Final Fantasy VII Remake's DLC Summons Detailed in New Gameplay

It’s absolute nonsense that they’re DLC given this is a remake of a game before DLC was even a thing. They do look suitably cute but it’s not something I’d pay for.

Can we talk about the designs? Carbuncle in particular. They could've used the one from FF15, that was perfect. The forehead is just waaaaay too big

They're going to milk this one to no end, aren't they?

@Octane Absolutely, but we could potentially get some good stuff out of it. A DLC where you play as Sephiroth could be amazing, for example. All depends on whether Square Enix can keep up the (supposed) quality.

Pretty disgusting tbh.

not only has the single game been broken into THREE parts at FULL PRICE — costing upwards of $180usd should you buy on release day — but s-e has the gall to include dlc summons? what else does s-e have under its sleeve? likely it will wait to reveal more dlc goodness after the game has launched to avoid negative reviews.

That chocobo chick is an unholy abomination, and Carbuncle looks like a moldy corgi. The cactuar... is a cactuar, at least.

@Porco - Nailed it. How anyone can justify charging almost £200 for ONE game is beyond me and asking more for DLC is straight up ripping the piss. Scumbaggery of the highest order.

@Shigurui @Porco I get the concern, but the notion that Square Enix has disassembled one big Final Fantasy VII remake into three parts is misleading. Based on what we know, this is going to be a full game — it just happens to be based on one section of a 20+ year old title, stretched out with a way more in-depth story, systems, and mechanics.

The best comparisons are things like the Mass Effect Trilogy or the Final Fantasy XIII trilogy. Each entry was a whole, complete game, but they all added up to a bigger story.

I know it's a bit different since FFVII Remake is based on an existing release, but I don't think we can jump to conclusions until we've played it.

At least it's only summons that are DLC, and there's a good chance they're the kind of summon materia that will become weak towards the later parts of the game and never used again.

@kyleforrester87 hey, thanks for labeling me as an idiot for having a different perspective on s-e' business practices. much appreciated!

@Deadlyblack Yeah it still sucks that they're DLC but you're right.

@kyleforrester87 right on! if an "idiot" means seeing through terrible business decisions and exploitative behavior, i would choose to be an "idiot" any day of the week. what then would that make you? a mindless consumer? and blind loyalist to s-e? someone who doesn't question the world around them and enjoys paying for something that should be included in the base game to begin with? a shill or sheep? funny how my comment is considered baseless but yours is not. what information is out there to confirm the length? you mean those vague quotes from s-e which is essentially propganda to help sell their own game? for someone who is so active on this site, you don't seem to have a strong grasp of the current state of the gaming industry. you sound very ignorant to say the least.

for the record, the only one here looking to start trouble was you. that usually happens when you make things personal and call someone else an idiot after all.

thanks for the sincere and heartfelt apology. i feel warm and fuzzy inside

@ShogunRok i would love to see DLC like ff15 had where u played as Ardyn. Playing as Sephiroth would be great.

Thankfully these are the exact summons I would never use anyway. Even if they were earned in-game I would stop using them as soon as I got a "Real" summon so this is no great loss imo.

@Porco Totally agree with you I don't understand why people defend this when games like Dragon Quest XI and Persona 5 give you around 120 hours of gameplay and it's not divided into 3 parts and DLC before the game has even been released

@kyleforrester87 you seem angry, kid.

@ShogunRok I also understand your point but i believe it's the wrong comparison. The Mass Effect games were part of a bigger narrative but were developed as full fledged games from the beggining. This is more similar to the Hobbit book split into 3 movies for no apparent reason other than profit. I'm sorry but milking is still milking.

@kyleforrester87 that's good to hear lol. You grabbing the remake day 1?

@Syndrome I know what you mean but it's the closest comparison I can really think of in mainstream gaming.

Ultimately, either we get this game in April or we wait until 2085 for the whole saga.

At this point, because none of us have played the full game, I think all we can do is expect it to be worth the price of admission. If it isn't, then we can absolutely complain about how Square Enix has managed this.

@ShogunRok I can’t think of any past examples of a game remake or a film or book adaptation being split into multiple releases. Plenty of cases of games having overarching stories or ending in cliffhangers. The same can be said for series of books and films as well.

We are so used to the likes of the Spyro Trilogy putting multiple games together that it feels strange having one old game split into multiple modern releases. Even if the first part is as big as Final Fantasy XV we know what is being adapted and that they have already said that more to come.

It being a full game (which is a slightly nebulous concept given how diverse games are) doesn’t mean it’s a complete remake of Final Fantasy 7.

Considering that Carbuncle and Catuar are 2 summons from FF8 worries me a bit, because so far it's clear that they may sell other games summons as DLC, we have 2 as stated. 2 summons which don't seem at all that good to be honest. I really hope they have put in the original summons from the game like Bahamut and Knight of Round and especially Hades and Bahamut Zero.

I'd be pissed if this are not I have it pre ordered but at this time I'm considering it canceling it and getting maybe later on

@ShogunRok to be fair, the main reason (other than profiteering of course) the game has been broken up into multiple entries is due to s-e' incompenence as a developer when it comes to project management and meeting reasonable timelines. because the companay cannot make a game within 4-5 years like other studios, the customer is expected to pay for it multiple times and in multiple pieces? how does that make any sense? if anything, s-e should be more accomodating towards its community (for its loyalty) throughout this past console generation which will go down as one of the worst in its history, followed closely by the ps3 era. how could s-e be more accomodating? by not charging its fans 3 times for what should be a standalone and complete package. that would be a good start and the least they could do. but instead, the fans are being punished for the company's inability to better plan its projects and to make matters worse, we are supposed to be OK with that? in a world where rockstar, cdprojekt red and atlus can put out a single 60-100+ hour game, there is no reason why s-e could not do the same with ff7 remake. heck, so long as the game was complete, i wouldn't mind if it was 40 hours. we all know that each episode will be on the shorter end of the specturm, but padded out with optional content that has nothing to do with the main story arc. that is not a good way to justify this business model.

rather than continue to find excuses and defend poor business practices, we should be outspoken towards anti-consumer behavior. this complacent attitude is not helping anyone other than the s-e shareholders.

@Porco Don't get me wrong, I think Square Enix has grossly mis-managed the Final Fantasy franchise for years now (outside of FFXIV).

All I'm saying is I don't think we should pass judgement on it until we've played it and seen what's included/how long it is/whether splitting it into a 'saga' is justified.

@kyleforrester87 yeah same here, 15s side quests weren't the best.

Hope you enjoy the game👍

Going to be my first FF game and looking forward to it. I can't believe I have went my whole gaming life not playing one but here we are...

@Splat sorry to hear that you missed the golden age of squaresoft in the 90s to early 2000s. the company, in its current form, is a shadow of its former self and lacks a clear vision on what the final fantasy franchise is at this point. if ff7 remake sells well, which it undoubtably will, you can expect more remakes in the future. s-e no longer has the ability to put out an original and noteworthy final fantasy title (based on final fantasy xiii trilogy and final fantasy xv) so i do wonder if they will even attempt to make final fantasy xvi or just take the easy way out and remake its backlog for the next 10 years.

@glassmusic heh, i'm right there with you on this.

@ShogunRok I agree. I'm not sure where people are getting this idea that the game is only going to be like 10 hours or something.

I was never a fan of Reflect magic anyway, so Carbuncle would never get used except once to see what summoning him looked like.

I think this game looks hideous, I mean look at that Chocobo for Christ's sake!!

DLC already before the game even launches? Classic Square Anus LOL.

@Octane No doubt man LOL. Already milking it by releasing half the game and charging $60 without even saying when the next part is coming and how many parts there will be. Still no mention of how big the game's world is either or how many quests.

@Porco We don't even know if its 3 parts. They never said.🤣🤣🤣🤣 I will just watch people play it on YouTube out of curiosity.

@ShogunRok I really wish people would stop defending this bs practice of Square. FF7 was my favorite game back in the day but I am not going to be blind for nostalgia sake.

Mass Effect was 3 separate games all connected like the Star Wars trilogy. FF7 was one whole game and now it has been broken up because of Square's greed.

FF13 was like Mass Effect, not FF7 Remake. You dom't know what content will be in the game. Square has not shown anything but combat and they made the same promise with FF15 only to not be true.

@kyleforrester87 Only an idiot would be ok with getting ripped off by a company. Ridiculous.

@GodGamer you're right. it might be 4 or 5 parts don't get me wrong, i'm interested in playing this game, i just don't like how the release is being handled so i will await the complete edition on ps5 instead.

@GodGamer Well, this is what I'm saying. We don't know yet. No point passing judgement either way until we've all played it.

A shame Kyle is allowed to be personal like that, vet or not, there's a thing called decency when talking to fellow gamers. I'm no snowflake at all and have thick skin but it just childish and uncalled for.

On topic:
I really like the tiny cactuar summon, but both carbuncle and chocobo are horrible!!
Regardless, this reeks heavily as bad business practices. Summons should never be DLC in the first place (this includes possibly extra added tiny summons) but included in the game itself. Let us do some side stuff to acquire these..
Makes one wonder what SE has up its sleeves still 🤔

Must admit that I was very hyped when I saw FFVII would get a proper remake. Never played the original because I was introduced to FF after VIII was released, so for me VIII has the most nostalgic value. In fact, I'm playing FFVIII remastered right now and it's a blast (getting carried away lol).
The more I see and hear from VII remake the more the hype fades. Doesn't mean I'll never play it but I'm leaning heavily towards waiting for a complete edition on PS5, heck, could even be PS7 with how long SE takes to develop games these days 🤦‍♂️
Square Enix is a shadow of its former self, in more ways than one!!

@ShogunRok - This is going to be a full game, based on a section of what is already a full game. Yeah, seems legit. No matter how you cut it (zing!) it's one game that'll be sold in pieces, with added DLC. From the guys that tried to let you Augment your pre-orders!

@kyleforrester87 - Thanks for the personal dig, appreciate it!

Why can't people look at this as these being offered as an ADDITIONAL gift for those that wish to pre order, purchase deluxe edition or the Soldier 1st Class edition?

These are definitely not paramount, or necessary for the game, just some fun extras for the people who pledge for the game.

@Grindagger IMHO, people are annoyed because DLC encourages and excuses bad game design - content anti-immersively airdropped into the game as a random mishmash of pointless eye-catching tat, rather than as elements carefully crafted and organically introduced to be part of a cohesive greater whole.

Also, two out of the three of these... things look viscerally awful, but that's beside the point.

@Fath This is subjective. I like 2 of them, the carbie, not so much, but it doesn't bother me. It's nice I'll be getting them as an extra for ordering the soldier 1st class edition.

I get your point, but I think it's a little on the pedantic side. These additions wouldn't have taken a great deal of development to manage and bring to fruition , and would of been done only as an addition to compliment purchases.

I can't see how it's anti-immersive. You don't need to use them if you get them, and if you don't pre order, or get the deluxe editions you won't see them, I don't really see how that gets in the way of you being able to enjoy the game? These summons are arbitrary at best, and nothing more than an incentive for fans.

@Grindagger Opinions on these buggers' aesthetics are subjective, of course

When I said DLC tends to be anti-immersive, I had in mind its method of acquisition, or lack thereof - an immersive, non-DLC implementation of these summon materia would have Cloud coming across them naturally in the course of the game, perhaps finding them tucked in some hidden corner, or winning the as prizes in a minigame, or even used as plot devices amongst main characters.

As DLC, though, since they have to be implemented in a way that doesn't impact the base game for them to be missing, and since developers don't want to put roadblocks in the way of people getting the items they've paid for, they'll probably just be shoved unceremoniously into the player's hands via some marginally-relevant menu, mailbox, or NPC at the earliest opportunity, with some terse note of "Thanks for your support of this commercial video game!" attached.

From a player's perspective, content in a game is a product of gameplay. With DLC, though, content becomes a product of paying money, and hitting "buy" on a real-world storefront supplants gameplay. It's anti-immersive.

If Vegeta was reborn as a Chocobo.

@Fath Ahhh, ok, well from that perspective I can agree with you on.

But, in the event that these are given off the bat, at the start, before really getting into the story, I don't personally feel it detracts too much from the game as a whole.

Sure they're not located, or acquired naturally throughout the game, but in honesty they weren't part of the original FFVII game anyway, so them not appearing, or not being used is still arbitrary.

In regards to the immersion side, I do get your perspective, and I'm sure it's one shared by others, because getting sent an in game "mail" or something to that effect breaking the immersion of the story and/or world you're engaged in can definitely detract from the enjoyment of the experience.

What if they were unlocked at the title screen, and were just in your inventory, or better still were introduced into the game with a more immersive method (even if they're given to you), would you then have less of a problem with it if that were the case?

@Grindagger That's actually an interesting question - I'm not sure if I'd be more or less ok with that, honestly.

But reading over my last post, more importantly, I want to back down a bit, since I was getting pretty doom-and-gloom, and that's not the way I want to call it a night over here. It's not the end of the world either way, and I'm not going to say I've never enjoyed a piece of DLC handed to me in a game myself.

I appreciate you giving my opinions some thought, and I can respect your own that there at least shouldn't be any harm in tossing a few pieces of fluff on top of the game so long as everything from the original game is still properly integrated. Most importantly, if you're looking forward to having fun with these little guys, then by all means, enjoy them.

Anyway, yeah, time for bed for me. Wish me luck on my dreams not being haunted by that nightmare chocobo

@ShogunRok I hope thats a joke? Putting the remade story behind another paywall? If we get the complete remake its already €240.With the massive joke of putting GF behind a €200 paywall.

@kyleforrester87 I know its a bigger game no problem but too hide Summons behind different expensive versions of a game is nonsense. And thats someone like me who is waiting for more then two decades.

@Porco Dude, each game is a full experience. How can you label it "one game" for 180 dollars, when each iteration is a fully fleshed out, full JRPG...

I mean, I'm not going to say you're an idiot, because I don't know you, but the comment does come across as a bit clueless, particularly so since we don't have any of the concrete facts at this time.

At least wait to see, before passing judgement on Square Enix.

pay 1000 bucks to revive Aerith

@Grindagger it is one game and it will cost 180 bucks.
that's how he can call it one game that will cost 180 bucks.
cuz he's correct.

Taking out content that is ALREADY developed and selling it on top of the game is the only kind of DLC I fundamentally disagree with. Keeping the game relevant with any paid DLC (small or big, doesn't matter) AFTER the game releases is totally reasonable and probably necessary these days given the increased costs of game development. But asking for extra cash for content at this point just comes off as greedy.

@MJF Using your same logic, that's like saying the "Gears Of War" games are collectively X amount of dollars.

We are not in 1997 anymore, the company cannot create an epic game with graphic quality that is currently expected out of a AAA studio in one iteration.

Instead, they have to create it into a meandering story, fleshed out, modernized, and updated for the current era.

If you want to be smug about it, fine, yes, it's one game, as in it's "Final Fantasy VII", but it's been dissected into chapters, so as to give players a fuller, more meaningful experience of the world of Final Fantasy VII.

An attempt to try and disingenously hookline it as Square Enix using it as a tool to squeeze cash out of people is petty, and childish, because it's clearly just not true by looking at the production value alone, and the fact that the first chapter of the game is 100gb.

Either (a) grow up and form an opinion that's not grounded in childish perspective or (b) at least create a logical, and sound reasoning to your arguments.

The actual correct phrase would be (without being disingenous). The collection of fully fleshed out episodic games that make up the entire story of Final Fantasy VII now each include a full 60-80 hour experience per episode, each episode costing $60, with a potential of 3 episodes to cover the entire story will amount to a total of $180.

Lol I give up.

This type of marketing always baffles me, sell a thousand games for 180.00 or sell 1 million games for 40.00, which one makes you more money?

This is a remake, they have the plot, characters, subplot, story, equipment, world map, locations, and secrets already in place. Most of the work is done already. To charge consumers through the nose is a bad business model in my opinion.

@Grindagger spare me your rebutal. i have heard it all before. also, if you read the comments around you, you will know that this is a plaguing issue for many people and i am not alone in my opinion. if you truly believe s-e is looking out for its fans here and is doing the best of its ability to be pro consumer, you are either a fanboy who cannot see clearly or you are in for a rude awakening.

you truly believe each espisode will justify its full asking price? i doubt the main content will equate to more than 20 hours per episode and will be padded out with mindless side content. also, why on earth would i give s-e another benefit of the doubt when they ruined my once favourite franchise 4 times in a row at this point, beginning with final fantasy xiii? why would i forgive greedy business practices that is clearly meant to benefit their shareholders first and foremost? wake up man. this company has lost its way and is taking people like you for a ride.

@Porco Maybe if you've heard it all before, it's because people are talking sense.

Listen, I understand that we are not going to see eye to eye on this subject, but in my view this is primarily to do with your embitterment towards SE due to past disappointments. I didnt like FF XIII either for the record, I thought it was trash, but I still love most SE releases, and sure I'm a fanboy, but not blindly...

You're passing judgement with nothing but speculations. How can anyone take you seriously when you're trying to build an argument off the back off literal embittered ranting?

The irony here is they're not taking me for a ride, they're taking you for one, seeing as I'm the one who is happy and excited about the product, and you're rage-filled, and upset that some people dont agree with your perspective.

Mine is grounded in current observations of what we have been shown so far, and I'll attest, a certain degree of optimism, but that's still a heap ton better than speculated ranting.

@Grindagger sorry, but it isn't speculation that s-e is making summon DLC on top of a game that has been broken into pieces just so that they can charge people 3 times for it. i am allowed to have an opinion on that. i cannot understand how someone would defend such practices simply because you are filled with nostalgia for ff7. they do say nostalgia is a powerful thing, but it doesn't mean you should throw away all logic over it.

what s-e is doing is bad not just for this remake, but for the gaming industry at large as it could even reshape how other publishers handle their franchises in the future. trying to justify a game being broken into pieces is a fools errand so don't even try. also, to say someone shouldn't judge a company's forthcoming game based on its poor entires in the past is bonkers. that is exactly WHY people should press judgement and be more weary of their future releases. many of us old final fantasy fans have lost faith in this company but it is for good reason. all s-e had to do was treat this remake with respect, but more importantly, treat its fans with respect. they are instead doing the complete opposite with this business model. should blizzard fans blindly look forward to diablo 4 without any reservations after everything that has gone down with the company? i would hope not. at the end of the day, your attitude towards this issue is making things worse and encouraging more bad behaviour from publishers. maybe one day you will wake up and realize it.

People like this Kyle "You're an idiot because you don't agree with me" Forrester are the main reason why I don't post on this site. The place would be much better without people like him. It is juvenille and immature in every way, and he posts on almost EVERYTHING. You have quite a few regular users who are like that, but he is a prime example. There are plenty of regular commenters who are great (word up son) but also too many members that aren't so great. I never post anything here because I know that if I make even the slightest complaint or give the slightest criteque about something, there will be a dozen Kyles down my throat. So, yeah. Just a heads up. word up son

@Porco This is a pointless discussion, because this is just perspective, of which we have differing takes.

Your perspective is that the game being released episodically is SE taking you for a ride, and trying to drain you dry of cash. I've already explained my argument for why they've decided to do that, and to be fair, my perspective makes a lot of sense, just from a development point of view. And having actually worked for a triple A studio for several years in the development team, I can attest that the work required in todays capacity, in terms of storytelling and subsequent creation of assets like modeling, physics, coding etc takes a lot lot longer than it did in 1997.

What could be accomplished in 1997, where storytelling was still very much the main stepping stone for making an accomplished game, as graphic were still infantile (certainly when compared to todays standards), FFVII was an expansive, and deep story, and that was over 3 discs, THREE, back in '97.

To try and pack that all into one game now, and deliver it with stunning visual effects AND develop back story AND enhance character story arcs AND faithfully recreate all the areas from the original game, but again in amazing quality, and polish, and to do all this, and expect the ENTIRITY of FFVII in one game is, to be frank, absurb, and devoid of any critical thinking, or logic.

You saying I'm fawning over FFVII remake with nostalgia, and losing my logic is ironical, when in fact I'm producing reasoned arguments, based in logic, rather than ranting and raving over SE's malpractices, and bitterness about previous titles.

Sure, I get that you don't trust them with this game, because previous games weren't up to standard for you. But, it's again important to understand perspective that, whilst this may be the case for you, there are a lot of people who feel quite the opposite. For me, the only truly bad main FF titles recently created were FFXIII (I'll agree, an absolute disaster, however, there are still people who like even that title), and FFXIV (pre a realm reborn) which when it first came out in 2010 was a piece of excrement.

Should I therefore hate anything that comes out because of those two games? No. Should I judge everything they do because of those two games? No. SE is not EA, so no is the answer, and clearly the company still has a faithful following, and is loved by many. My recent trip to Japan showed me just how much their own culture loved Square, so much of their cultural heritage for modern video games is grounded heavily by SE influence these days.

In regards to your final comments. I (And likely many others) do not feel that Square are treating their fans disrespectfully, and sure some of us are going into this blindly, but not with trepidation, but hope. So far, i've not seen anything that would deter me from absolutely loving the remake of one of my favourite games of all time, I see no time to start scrutinizing a game, that has given me very little to scrutinize thus far. The DLC summons is such a minor point of contention, that only people who are looking to create an argument for the sake of it will do so.

Anyway, i digress. I understand you have your views, and nothing I'm going to say will change them, and that's fine. Just understand, and appreciate that your views (which may also be shared by many) are just another opinion, much like my own, and these perspectives won't change, whether you want them to, or not.

@TheFatPonyo I think it's fine to make your opinion known, just be aware of the fact that if it's on a forum, it's open to being commented on. And that can include scrutinizing your point of view, from people who don't agree. Although, people should generally stay away from personal insults, as it doesn't really do a lot for anyones argument, I agree.

@Porco
Ah you made me sign up to reply to you, hopefully to bring this from the other perspective (though I agree with the appoarch you gone).

Japanese culture is traditionally very much developer/supplier/creator focused especially when it's a quality item. I'm sure you may know this already but many Japanese business cultures are like this also, as such, if they get something right from the starting gates they thrive on that specialist field/product, you will feel the amazing passion/effort that's put in. If they do not, it looks like they're stubborn to change their ways for consumers.

2nd point I may add is that games nowadays cost say £50, but the additional revenue comes from online play and (pay to win esque) DLCs to cover the overheads of creators.
If a game is purely single player with no 'intent' for DLCs then I'd imagine they need to charge £200 for it.

Point 2.5
A 4k TV can be cheap because of manufacturing improvements, AI, automation.
Drawing/modelling every blade of hair on every character requires simply requires hours of human time. Inflation goes up, specialisation goes up (sophisticated modelling software/hardware and the prowess to match), pay packets go up.

Conversely- look at Nintendo, they're not even 'trying' yet people still pay exorbitant amounts. Least s-e has some effort put into it.

That said, business is a business, they will milk it where and when they can...

I'm not sure which camp I'd go for; I prefer models of online DLCs as I'm OK to take the free stuff and not pay the developer for the actual work, let the fan boys/girls pay. Morally speaking, that's probably not OK xD

@Katuo This just makes sense though. It's pretty much what I was pointing out, with the addition of more contextualized views of Japanese cultural work ethic.

But, yeah, couldn't agree more.

I do also agree, that, of course SE are going to milk this game, it's one of their biggest flagship games. They'd be complete idiots not to, from a business standpoint.

It's not like they're going to just do minimal business from it, when they know it's going to sell like hotcakes. No one is forced to buy what they don't want. I have a problem with DLC's when they're paywalls or some nonsense like that(cough cough EA).

@ShogunRok Hey man, just wanted to thank you for the interactions you have with the community here, I'm mostly a silent reader but most of the time I read to comments here and enjoy them.

Anyway... It is really nice of you to reply to people and talk about games (seems logical because you write for a news site about games) but you (guys) engage (way) more with us then some other big sites do with their community's. Keep up the good work!

@BrintaPap Thanks for the kind words!

@katuo
@Grindagger

i appreciate the other side of the argument, although i have a very hard time agreeing with it. hear me out.

the gaming industry has spiraled out of control over the past 10 years when it comes to project managament, budgeting and the constant chase for higher visual fidelity. the improvements in graphical quality has made the process of game production "unsustainable" for some publishers. at least, that is what they want you to think. there could be some truth to it, but ultimately, you can find a successful little game called the witcher 3 which was massively successful and did not have any mtx crammed into the game. taking the optional expansion route is how it should be done when it comes to full priced games. as far as i am concerned, if someone is paying the highest tier price for a base game ($60usd), they should be getitng the complete experience and everything that the game has to offer and should not be price gouged any further. once you start charging people for additional bells and whistles to presumably help pay for the cost of the game and turn a larger profit margin (which again is only partly true and not consistent across the board), you are essentially forcing your community to subsidize the game for the publisher and that is utterly wrong. if your game is not sustainable, that means elements need to be scaled back in the production phase. simple as that.

if the game was priced below the highest tier, than i am ok with some mtx put into the game as that is less insulting and makes more sense in terms of recouping development costs. here is another example: god of war. no mtx. not expansion. just a AAA quality game with incredible scope and production values. hugely successful and profitable. horizon zero dawn. there was the optional expansion which took cues from the witcher 3. no mtx. why then do we see so many publishers playing the victim game and telling us that mtx and price gouging is a necessary evil when clearly there are successful examples on the contrary? why did sony decide to take this route and treat its community with respect while other publishers, such as s-e, do not?

as things stand now, i have been soured on the current business practices we are seeing across the industry. for this reason, i rarely purchase games on day one and instead wait for a more reasonable price point. that said, if every AAA release treated the community with the same level of respect as say, god of war, horizon or the witcher 3, i would be more inclined to bite the bullet and purchase on release day.

as for final fantasy xv.... that was not a good game from s-e either and an even bigger mess than the xiii trilogy. sure, you can find "fans" for pretty much anything on the internet, but the general consensus from the final fantasy community was utter disappointment. never have i dropped a game so quickly than i did with final fanttasy xv. attempting to complete the core story with dlc mroe than a year after release is an embarassment. similar sentiments would apply to kingdom hearts 3 (i have yet to play it but the nagative feedback towards it has not been enticing me to dive in).

for the record, i used to be a massive squaresoft fan back in the ps1 era. their games made a monumental impact on me during those years. it is very sad to see how the company allowed so much talent to slip away and lost sight of what makes a final fantasy game great.

anyways, agree to disagree with you on this topic, but maybe there will be a different topic we can both relate to a little more next time.

@Grindagger I'm not doing what you think I'm doing.
I don't care about putting 180 bucks into a game I like.
But I'm not going to pretend it ISN'T 180 bucks for a game.
I'm an adult with a job - 180 bucks doesn't mean poo to me if I like the game.

But you keep on pretending that someone acknowledging reality is doing whatever it is you think they're doing.

@Porco I actually agree with some of your points though. Extended DLC being one of them. I dont see episodic full blown rpgs as that though, that is where I cant agree with you. I didnt play the FFXV dlc either and it bothered me it came out after the initial game too. FfVII remake was never going to be able to fit into one game, never, it's not possible with today's graphical standards.

@MJF Is Gears Of War 1, 2, 3 etc one game?

You have to consider it the same when a story is being retold on a much larger, and wider scale with higher production values.

Your perspective is literally a straw man semantics point and nothing more. It's technically true, and that's where the reality of it ends.

@Grindagger No, gears of war 1 is one game - gears of war 2 is one game and gears of war 3 is one game.
Also - Final Fantasy 1 is one game, Final Fantasy 2 is one game, Final Fantasy 3 is one game, Final Fantasy 4 is one game, Final Fantasy 5 is one game, Final Fantasy 6 is one game, and Final Fantasy 7 is one game.
I hope this has been educational.
And it isn't a matter of semantics. You are using that word incorrectly.
It also isn't a straw man - I don't think you know what that means.
Your last sentence makes no sense - I'm correct - technically and however else you can be correct - and reality aligns with that correctness.

@MJF Yeaaaah, ok. I think we'll just leave that where it lies, this is clearly not something you're able to get a handle on here, as my points have either gone over your head, or you're too obtuse to understand them, either way it's a waste of my time trying to explain them.

@Grindagger no, you're simply wrong and can't admit it.
your argument showing final fantasy 7 is three games is that "gears of war 1 2 and 3 are three games" - which literally makes zero sense at all.
yeah they are three games - if they took one of them and split it into two parts and sold them separately, that is still one game split in half.
you can stop arguing because you have nothing.

@MJF Your simplemindedness is not allowing you to understand the detailed points I was making, because of the closed narrative you can't seem to broaden.

I already agreed that technically speaking you were correct, but your pomposity, and complete lack of understanding anything other than your single minded viewpoint is seriously making any sort of discourse with you extremely limiting.

Frankly, I don't have anything more to say to you, because it wouldn't be worth discussing further with you. You're probably trolling at this point, and I have better things to do with my time, so
feel free to have the last word, and have a nice day.

@Grindagger No, your argument was dead on arrival.
I was correct - you said so yourself.
Now just stop.
You'll never win this argument in a million years.
You pretending that I'm not understanding something is adorable.

@MJF It was meant to be adult discourse, but apparently you're a child. So, nothing else to say at this point.

Being wrong but insisting you're correct isn't adult discourse, kiddo. But nice try reframing this again.

you just typed a bunch of words that don't do anything to change the fact that this is one game and that you're wrong to say it is more than one game.
you can keep pretending that whoever you're arguing with is lacking in "comprehension" - but you're doing that in bad faith just so you can feel better about yourself.
you've already said you were done - so why don't you live up to your own words and be finished?
(that is a rhetorical question that is better left unanswered)

@nessisonett none of the dlc were in the original game.
It’s still pretty sh*tty they are cashing in on this though.

Agreed. In the original I’ve I really used we’re odin for the instant kill then knight of the round once unlocked. Rest weren’t all that.

@MJF Because this isnt about right or wrong. Because the definition is subjective on whether it should be released as one game or as more than one game, but seeing as you're too dense to understand that, it's not any surprise to me that you keep harping on about the same point over and over like a broken record, due to your one track line of discourse being unable to fathom alternative opinion. It's still amusing nonetheless so please continue with your inane babbling

lol no
I already pre-ordered the special edition - the demo is awesome - go away - you're objectively wrong

@MJF That really says a lot about how ridiculously moot your point is. Hilarious, just doesnt cut it.

@Grindagger my point was never that it is a bad idea to buy the game

@MJF "I don't care about putting 180 bucks into a game I like.
But I'm not going to pretend it ISN'T 180 bucks for a game."

In your original statement you insinuated that because it's episodic that the combined episodes somehow is one game.

I suppose, if you get down to it, this is really a matter of what you actually consider to constitute one game?

Look, Episode 1 of this game is a full 60 hour JRPG in it's own right, so you're paying 60-70 bucks for a FULL GAME, as in, you're getting your moneys worth of experience for time spent experiencing playing a game.

So to say you're paying 180 bucks for a game is in honesty, disingenous, because you're implying that you're paying 180 bucks for one game, when realistically, it's for several. The game is just not condensed into one game anymore (for reasons already previously explained).

However, since you've clearly shown that the price point doesn't bother you, and you're buying it anyway, this makes your whole argument, and perspective seem lacking any reasoning whatsoever. So, what exactly are you making disingenous statements like that in the first place for?

@Grindagger no, see - I address reality whether or not it fits into my life conveniently.
I address the reality that this is one game - split into three parts.
I also don't care that much about money - I make plenty - just got a 70 inch 4k tv when I already had a damn good 50 inch 1080p smart tv.

you seemed to assume that just because I was acknowledging that this is one game split into three that I'm somehow advocating for not buying it.

That was all in your head, kiddo.
You shouldn't assume what other peoples' arguments are - you end up doing what you did here - argue a bunch of meaningless drivel - as though the other person has this idea in their head that they didn't have.

You've been wrong over and over again this entire time.
It's time to stop, kiddo.
Go to bed - start the day over again.

@Grindagger it's one game split into three parts.
it will forever be one game split into three parts.

you keep on doing you though
keep on responding - even though I'm right and you already said I'm right.
keep on wasting time reinforcing my argument.
Thanks, kiddo.

and no, those games you mentioned are separate games
but you keep on trying, sport.

@MJF You're right it's 1 game split into 3 parts.

You're wrong to try and masquerade it as one game costing 180 dollars. Learn to read. Thanks.

@Grindagger Please stop arguing and insulting other users in a comments section that's almost a month old.

@MJF As I said above, please stop arguing in a comments section that's almost a month old.

@Grindagger it is one game split into three parts and when you're done paying for it all you'll pay 180 dollars.

for the one game split into three parts.
if they continue with the special editions - I'll end up spending 240

and @ShogunRok - I was done a long time ago - this is like a windup doll though.

@MJF And yet you still feel like you had to have the last word.

@ShogunRok Fair point on the insulting part, but discourse can be had. Either way, let's put this one to bed.

lol - pot calling the kettle black again?