PS Plus Members Launch Petition Against 'Dumbfounding' May 2020 PS4 Games

This months games aren't for me but this is a bit pathetic, there will be people out there looking forward to playing these and so what if you don't like them just play something else.

I dislike the lineup as much as anyone but this ain’t gonna do sh*t

Oh, good grief. 🙄

If only Sony could look at all the names on the petition, tie as many of them to the respective PSN accounts as possible, then refund their latest subscription and kick them from PSN.

Idiots.

If you were to draw a Venn Diagram, these people would probably be right in the centre, along with all the people who think the Earth is flat, Coronavirus isn't real, and 5G will melt your brain.

I wanted to try the farmer sim so im happy. Don't see why people should get this salty about it.

“ Sony has made changes to the PS Plus lineup based on feedback in the past: PES 2019: Pro Evolution Soccer got given the boot last year in favour of Quantic Dream adventure game Detroit: Become Human. It’ll be interesting to see whether there are any last-minute substitutions this time around, because the feedback hasn’t been particularly pretty.”

Hope not, I like the line up, both are games I wanted to play but hadn’t bought yet.

Yeah that’s a joke petition. Read the whole thing, it’s entirely in jest, meant to make it seem ridiculous with everything else going on in the world.

Surely it can't be just me with a backlog of games waiting to be played?If you don't fancy them don't play them.Like @carlos82 says above,some people will be looking forward to these..or one of them.
If the games get changed to something great like Horizon Zero Dawn people are going to whine that they already played it.

Just shut down psplus, make psnow needed for online, and make psnow worldwide, for people that don't have great internet for streaming (like me), psnow support downloading games so there's no problem. Or at least make $20-30 psplus tier only for online backup and psn discount.

thing is when the "leak" about this month's lineup showed up (the one with dark souls) lot's of people on here also complained it was not a good month.

same when that false leak with crash happened.

this just shows that that the only people they should blame is themselves for not knowing what they want.

if it's a good AAA month they complain that they already have the game,if it's a AA month they complain that the games are just average,if it's an indie month,they complain that the games are stupid or to small.

it's about time those people just sign off ps plus just so we won't hear their contradicting drivel anymore.

@nessisonett You're right, but the fact that thousands of people are signing it in all seriousness...

@get2sammyb exactly I was too!!! Was looking forward to PES

really, I thought it was a decent lineup, oh well

Sony knows things are going to go down hill and soon we will all need to know how to raise pigs and plant crops to survive!

I suspect for pro evolution soccer getting pulled from PlayStation plus had more to do with agreements Sony had made to market another football game rather than the public pressure.

Entitlement- worse plague than COVID-19.

The sheer entitlement is breathtaking...

Must be terrible when mum comes back and has bought the wrong snacks..

If they change the games, can I petition too as I already have Cities Skylines.. Ffs

I don't want either of these games tbh but to sign a petition is pathetic. The people who set up the petition clearly did it as a joke it's the sad fools who sign it that are the problem.

"Sony has made changes to the PS Plus lineup based on feedback in the past: PES 2019: Pro Evolution Soccer got given the boot last year in favour of Quantic Dream adventure game Detroit: Become Human."

Wait. Was there confirmation that that was the case? I heard it had to do with their deal with Fifa. Was it ever confirmed or is this another case of video game journalism?

What a bunch of snowflakes. Psn Plus was the original lootbox yet no one seemed to ever care. Its like signing against getting a bad loot box.

Lol. What? Entitled turds. Cities is actually a good sim and farming sim does well in its niche group. People need to relax. There are a ton of super cheap games right now. Huge rpgs and the like for dirt cheap. Instead of complaining go get one of them.

Selfishly I hope they keep Farming Simulator at least. I have Cities (and think it's decent but no Sim City) but wouldn't mind trying FS.

I remember they changed the month with two sports games, so surely they could change two sim games as it would make sense really, backlash then they could just move one of them to next month and arrange something else this time.

I can see why people are unhappy but this is ridiculous. Companies have been giving away free game throughout the pandemic, its not like noone has games to play. There are more important things to be concerned about like a PM who tells people to stay indoors, doesn't himself and nearly dies of the virus. Or the President who wants people to down bleach. Write petitions against them or something.

(Sony should give those people who signed Road Rage and Duck Dynasty as the PS Plus games XD)

@get2sammyb I'm disappointed in myself for not noticing the pun in 'given the boot' on the first instance of reading it. Good show.

@TrueAssassin86x maybe it's time we all start making petitions for the games we want and sending them to each other to sign. Sony will have so much paper work to get through, I'll be damned if we don't get every game we want, every month. For ever.

@get2sammyb me too. Still annoyed about it. How useful would PES have been during the current lockdown.

And here was me thinking the virus would have given people some perspective. Clearly not

PS Plus members. Yep, they are a bunch of members.

Embarrassing. 😣

That lineup is pure trash, but I've said it before Sony could either drop the free games and lower the price of Plus, or have two separate subscriptions. One with the games/online and one just for online and they would avoid most of this backlash when they put crap games in the lineup.

Get a grip For Farmers Sake..........................Isolation making monsters.
Sony gave you the Excellent Journey and Nathan Drake recently for FREE.

I mean, I had no intent in buying these games, so I have no problem that they show up on PS Plus.

We have 12 months of games, not every month is going to be home runs. Add them to your library, give them a try (or don't) and move on.

I don't like Farming Simulator (played it on PSNOW) and bought the other game recently on a sale...but I hate these kinds of petitions. You all just feel like spoiled brats by signing this.

Oh the pain in my head. They sheer idiocy on display is beyond the fathoms of this solar system. Sony is meant to offer games for this service and they are doing just that. Oh you don’t like the games? Tough! That’s not for you to decide, if you don’t like it then cancel your membership for a month. And what about the people who actually really are excited by this line up? Sure they are probably a small group but are their preferences to be ignored?

As mainly an Xbox gamer (I own a ps4 but haven't invested in it much) this comes across as entitled whiners, like port begging and 'ps4 when' on Twitter or YouTube for Microsoft-owned game studios.

@FX102A Spot on ..............nevermind petitioning MONEY SPEAKS LOUDER THAN WORDS SUBSCRIBERS!!!!

@Paranoimia actually radiation isn’t good for living things and there are hundreds of qualified scientists and doctors that agree 5G is particularly unhealthy due to high frequency millimetre microwaves. For example https://www.5gspaceappeal.org/the-appeal

These folk do realise that they can unsubscribe, right. Or an even crazier idea - don't download the games.

What about the people who are looking forward to these games, me included, have we just to be forgotten so the entitled can get what they want?

We get at least 24 games a year. Most games are worth, in the region of 15-25 bucks. So for our £50 a year subscription we're getting over £350 worth of games. It's a great deal, even if there's a couple of games we don't like.

Absolute joke Sony ,were all on lockdown and your releasing absolute s**t games
F***ing ridiculous, I’m cancelling my ps plus subscription

Offering two strategy/simulation titles is called "dumbfounding". Phrasing of the month. But then again, we're talking the fandom and the internet - two of the least verbal awareness environments one can possibly imagine.

I get to try 2 games I wouldn’t otherwise have played. No problem here

2020 PS Plus Games:

Uncharted Collection
Bioshock collection
Borderlands Collection
Uncharted 4
Dirt Rally 2.0
Shadow of the Collosus

And we were given Journey for free as part of the "stay at home initiative"

12+ quality games this year so far. Yet these entitled people want to complain about a month where they still gain 2 games?

Worst kind of people. This is embarassing. You don't like the games? You don't have to play them.

I'm going to enjoy farming simulator, and I'm going to enjoy thinking of all the people hating on it as they sit and have to contemplate playing a game from their back catalogue of probably s**t games they bought and regretted.

Thanks for writing this...
Never knew this existed. Now I can sign it too...
It disgraceful tbh. The consistency with which they've provided the games this year have been OK at best...
But after removing the PS3 and the Vita and then increasing prices, this is unacceptable...
Considering Xbox provides 4 (arguably similarly s*****, but they've got Gamepass) games, I'm dumbfounded by the arrogance of Sony of late...
Not the first time either. Everytime they dominate a generation, then absolutely botch the next ( atleast since PS2 days)...
And bloody Jim Ryan...
Who tf thought he'd be a worthy succesor to the lineup of head honchos that we've had till date...

Edit: Atlest give an option to pause the sub, like Humble does...

@Netret0120 Shadow of the Colossus as well.

I downloaded BioShock Trilogy, Shadow and Dirt Rally so this year I've definitely done well out of Plus.

@Dodoo There are different types of radiation. Ionising radiation is dangerous. Non-ionising radiation is not, unless at very high power. Basic high-school physics.

The 5G wavelength is shorter than 4G, but also considerably weaker - hence the need for more towers. The article you link even states that 5G is so weak that it has trouble passing through solid objects, so how is it going to harm anyone?

We had all this nonsense a decade or so ago with everyone claiming 4G was going to give everyone brain cancer, so everyone was encouraging headsets and selling stupid little foil stickers to put on your phone and "protect you from brain tumours".

If you believe this crap, ditch your phone, disable your WiFi, take the radio out of your car, stop using a microwave, don't drink coffee, stay out of the sun, and don't eat pickles or use talcum powder, because they all might give you cancer.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-48616174

https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswithabang/2019/11/01/the-science-of-why-5g-is-almost-certainly-safe-for-humans/

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/mar/12/5g-safe-radiation-watchdog-health

First world problems. First class dicks.

@Paranoimia no no, I'm in the firm stable mind that this month's free games are jokes, simply because they are available on ps now.... I'd wager that at least 45% of the signers are also subs to ps now so to have the choice of two free games.. That you can download off of a different but similar service, is nothing short of a cop out, its a joke sir.... Or ma'am, its not like I have any games I'd like to see in their place, because the two I would like to see I'll be buying next payday if the deals still there, this isn't the first time I've read on this site of fans being upset by the choices of Sony, throughout all of last year, there was murmurings of displeasure. While I do disagree with the use of the current pandemic to try and sway the minds of those that could possibly change things, the idea of petitioning for change on a service you pay for, a service that you should have some say over, because of said payment then yeah, that I can get behind. Don't throw all of us in the same idiot pile

I want nothing to do with either of these games, but a petition (joke or not) is just absurd. I’m going to start a petition to keep the games, just because I’m sick of entitled gamers.

@Dodoo no, no there are not. There is not one single respectable, reputable scientist or study that shows ANY negative affects from 5G technology. Your link is utter garbage. There were a lot of people saying the same thing about microwave ovens for years....yet not one reputable study or scientist supported this idea the entire time. They still don't....guess what, I use the microwave oven a LOT and stand in front of it constantly, and not one single health problem from it other than diabetes from overeating.

I don't get this forum sometimes.

I supported Sony when PS Plus released a critically acclaimed, triple a trilogy in The Uncharted Collection back a few months ago alongside the charming indie title Goat Simulator and was hounded out by many saying it was bad on Sony's part.

Now they've released two low budget simulator titles at the same time, it's a masterclass from Sony and can't be criticized?

I am at a loss for words, either you're happy or you're not.

Personally I feel ripped off with this because we've been handed two very niche simulation titles, but I'm not gonna go down signing petitions like a self entitled melt, I'm just going to wait and see if next month brings something better.

@DonJorginho extremely niche? Not my bag, but Farming simulator sold over 2 million copies world wide in 2019. It's no GTA5, but it definitely is appealing to an extremely broader audience than you would have it seem. Wouldn't call that extremely niche. There's even an esports league for it with a 250k cash prize.

I do agree though on some of your points regarding these people never being satisfied.

Quite frankly, any month where I don’t own at least one of the two offerings I consider a win. This month is a win/win.

@AdamNovice Then there gonna deal with negative feedback when they put games that maybe 10% of the Plus subs will actually play. Splitting it stops that. They obviously want to avoid it. Look at there US Playstation YouTube channel. They didnt even put a PS Plus video out for these games because they knew they were trash and would get slammed for it.

@ChipBoundary 2 million? That's quite good actually.

I need to perhaps research into this e sport, wanna see who the Ninja of plotting Rosemary seeds is 😂

@Nich0 "I'm in the firm stable mind that this month's free games are jokes, simply because they are available on ps now.... I'd wager that at least 45% of the signers are also subs to ps now"

Okay, and...?

Here's a scenario for you:

You've subscribed to Sky TV for a while, and one day you decide to add their movie channels to your package. A few months later, you notice that Sky One is showing Terminator 2. You then realise that Terminator 2 has been on Sky Cinema Sci-Fi & Horror for the last 3 weeks.

Would you start or sign a petition against Sky, or would you consider that absurd?

This is the sort of thing that makes people assume us gamers are all emotionally stunted recluses with no sense of proportion and a bad case of entitlement. Embarrassing

@Paranoimia so it’s all just fear mongering even though we are living with the highest levels of cancer, depression, disease etc ever? Has that just happened by chance or are you denying that also?

Yes 5G can’t penetrate through walls but what if there’s not a wall between you and it? There will be millions of transmitters and you will not escape it even if you chose to.

What you are also not considering is the fact 5G will be added to the environment in addition to 4g, 3G, 2g, radar, radio waves etc etc. Taken on its own it may or may not be harmful but at what point of us adding increasing radiation is safe?

Actually there have been hundreds of peer reviewed studies proving damage to living things.

“Numerous recent scientific publications have shown that EMF affects living organisms at levels well below most international and national guidelines. Effects include increased cancer risk, cellular stress, increase in harmful free radicals, genetic damages, structural and functional changes of the reproductive system, learning and memory deficits, neurological disorders, and negative impacts on general well-being in humans. Damage goes well beyond the human race, as there is growing evidence of harmful effects to both plant and animal life.”

@ChipBoundary there are plenty of peer reviewed studies that say otherwise.

https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/we-have-no-reason-to-believe-5g-is-safe/

@KIERONOO Probably not, but certainly not with this attitude.

@YorkshireNed ?

I don't actively have any interest in either of these titles, and I think it's probably not the best idea to offer two sim titles in the same month but I just can't be that offended by it. I buy my Plus membership for $35 a year on sale. Two sim games I will skip are still worth the $3 for the month.

@Paranoimia This is far fetched. Are you okay?

Alright, I'm just as unhappy with the lineup as the rest of you are, it's garbage and yes, we pay for these games so it's well within our right to complain... However, we are gamers, and most of us are not in isolation, but those that are should have a backlog to catch up on. If you don't, you likely don't even have PS+. This energy on a petition is pointless as it paints all of us in a poor light.

@Dodoo Clicked the link.

Found out 250,000 people are as thick as you.

Stop it Dodoo, no one needs to read about the spectre of 5g anymore. Tech is everywhere. There is real and unsafe stuff in a river near you - use your energy on that rather than self invented pseudoscience.

https://www.theriverstrust.org/what-we-do/is-your-river-fit-to-swim-in/

Wow, they could get like zero games for a month 🤔

I'm going to be honest I like the new lineup free PS plus games City skylines is not my type of game but I know it's a very popular game The only game that really interests me is farming simulator 19 because it has mod support Plus I have friends on PS4 that is into farming simulator if you don't like the f***ing games then don't download it you people need to stop being so f***ing salty it really makes you look like a little crybaby who forgot their pacifier 7,000 people won't convince Sony to change the free PS Plus games this month It's not bad at all but I truly wish they kept giving free PS3 games 😢

@Nich0 Another thing that I get is that both games are of the same rather unpopular genre so the backlash is understandable, but the entitlement is kinda ridiculous. That said the PS Now thing is absolutely a legitimate thing to be upset about. Also for those who say, but we got Uncharted: NDC and Journey for free...only non-PS+ members got them for free and get to permanently keep them. Uncharted: NDC was a free PS+ game this February and Journey was free a few years back which I redeemed both of them before the pandemic promotion. While I like what Sony did, it doesn't change the fact that the gesture was useless to us PS+ subscribers.

Watching these little lambs getting herded by Sony's mind games all over again is rather depressing.

They're giving you hard let-downs now to make you hungry for any crumb of good news later.

You Do Not Need Expensive Hardware Any More.
Don't give them this last dirty trick. Wake up and save yourself a lot of heartache and lost cash.

I have zero interest in these titles but I like when they choose things everyone doesn’t already own.

I’m firmly against all video games petitions in the past, present or future. Get a life.

@SilvertownScott bye dude. Hopefully next month will be more to your liking. I must confess I play possibly 3-5 of the games on ps plus. Seriously unless you're a kid, someone who doesn't work or work from home. How the heck does anyone play, find time and COMPLETE 24 amazing games in one year?! I've still got a backlog of 5 years and more!!!

@Ken_Kaniff not even a little. These games are massively popular. In 2019 Farming Simulator sold over 2 million copies and started an esports league with a pretty massive cash prize. Cities Skylines in about 4 years, from 2015 (it's release) to 2019 sold over 6 million copies across platforms. Just because YOU don't like them, doesn't mean they are objectively bad games.

@gollumb82 exactly right!!!

@themcnoisy there’s no need for insults. I didn’t insult you and your comment gives you little respect.

If I am so stupid are you effectively calling hundreds of qualified scientists, doctors and other professionals the same? How can this be self-invented if hundreds of these people are already voicing their concern?

Yes there are dangers everywhere. I didn’t deny that. Is that reason enough to add even more? Maybe you should take a look in the mirror before throwing insults around.

Nothing is for free... Lol. Let's be grateful for what we have people!!!! Try living in Venezuela or Africa and then see if u will be complaining.

@Dodoo no, no they are not. Peer-reviewed doesn't mean accurate or right. Peer-reviewed can simply mean echo chamber. The scientists involved are not reputable or respectable. Or their was something wrong with their testing, variables they didn't account for.

Here, an actual write-up from a reputable and regulated institution, reviewing studies that drew all kinds of conclusions to ultimately draw a proper conclusion.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6765906/

@ChipBoundary yes and many studies you point to ignore certain but important criteria.

The FCC’s RFR exposure limits regulate the intensity of exposure, taking into account the frequency of the carrier waves, but ignore the signaling properties of the RFR. Along with the patterning and duration of exposures, certain characteristics of the signal (e.g., pulsing, polarization) increase the biologic and health impacts of the exposure. New exposure limits are needed which account for these differential effects.

Every month I see titles that I don’t wanna play I... play something else. I have PS+ in order to play online. The “free” games are just a part of the package. I’m generally a guy who stays away from FPS, turn-based RPG, and battle royals games. I guess when those games come up on PS+ I should start a petition as well?🤷🏾‍♂️

@Dodoo you clearly didn't read it. If you had, you'd that know everything you just typed is nonsense. They reviewed the studies you refer to and found they either provided no proper evidence for their conclusions or drew incorrect conclusions, and many others did improper research techniques.

They specifically talk about the exact things you mention and the studies that made those claims, and state that their conclusions are unfounded or not based on proper scientific research methods.

There is ZERO credible evidence to suggest harmful effects caused by non-labratory RFR environments when following proper FCC regulations.

The link I shared did however acknowledge that the amount of proper, reliable, credible research done on this topic is far from being extensive enough.

My wife has no interest in gaming at all. When i just told her this story even she couldnt understand why two simulators would be released in the same month. Personally i don't really care enough to lose sleep over it. Never played them, will add to library and probably check them out at some point..

Why even make articles about this and give these losers attention?

S0 7000 sad people sign it and the other 23Millioj are not bothed..

@Dodoo Sorry bro, that was written wrong (the thick part, It was meant to be gullible) I just wrote it whilst watching Muppet Babies.

The reason this is big news and in everyone's heads is it a scapegoat, one you can light bonfires under and become a vigilante ruining the infrastructure.

You can't solve the pollution issues by lighting bonfires and punching it. That's why people like you don't take it seriously and concentrate on scapegoats. It's proven to be (Relatively) safe, our own scientists say so, and the EU has stringent measures on all new tech. We have confidence to trust what they conclude.

Pollution is the biggest issue in the world at large yet you want to concentrate on 5G. It's a total waste of energy. I can see the pollution - Its there in the river - the river is dirty. What the link proclaims is unproven, filled with Propaganda and just like every other hot topic I keep reading is one sided, all good papers are two sided.

The subject has been peer reviewed a significant number of times with more science in relation to it being safe in relation to our guidelines than the science proclaming it is not safe.

The wide availability of illegal drugs is a huge factor in the amount of depression. Maybe just maybe the lines of coke which has an effect on the Dopamine receptors has a fatter part in this. It's everywhere.

As @Paranoimia points out, these things catch fire online. Flat Earthers being the most out there example. Again sorry for calling you thick but please rethink back to what article or youtubers started you on this path to 5g hating. Probably worth cancelling the YouTube subscription or reading that author.

@Dodoo I don't deny anything with regard to the levels of various illnesses, only the cause. We have "the highest levels" because there are more people than ever before, with many living generally unhealthier lifestyles than ever before, with modern living creating more stress for more people than ever before.

When it comes to something like depression, it needs to be remembered that we are living in a world where certain elements of an entire generation need a safe space and a colouring book just because someone said a word they don't like or has an opinion different to their own. That's not to trivialise depression or mental illness (I know what it's like, my dad suffered it his whole adult life), just pointing out that many claims are pretty much the equivalent of 'man flu'.

There's no evidence of those stats being linked to any particular single cause or group of causes. They were on the increase even before the advent of widespread WiFi and mobile phones.

"What you are also not considering is the fact 5G will be added to the environment in addition to 4g, 3G, 2g, radar, radio waves etc etc."

All of which are harmless.

A few more links for you. Worth giving them a proper read, as two pretty much discount the cancer theory entirely.

https://analogmantra.com/will-5g-fry-your-brain-in-its-skull-like-a-mushy-grey-burrito-8fa2f0382668

https://www.engineering.com/ElectronicsDesign/ElectronicsDesignArticles/ArticleID/19682/5GDont-Worry-About-It.aspx

https://www.cancer.org/cancer/cancer-causes/radiation-exposure/extremely-low-frequency-radiation.html

https://www.cancer.gov/about-cancer/causes-prevention/risk/radiation/electromagnetic-fields-fact-sheet

But at the end of the day, you're going to believe what you want to believe, and it makes no real difference to me one way or the other.

Right. I'm off to play something online with some friends. Ta ta.

Okay. I'm not gonna say it's bad games, because they're not. But it's really bad lineup. For example, last month's lineup was great (not for me though. I already owned Uncharted 4, and I don't like racing games, so Dirt 2.0 wasn't for me, but that's not the point ). It was balanced. One action shooter and one racing game. Two pretty different genres. Everyone finds something for them (mostly). But this lineup has two grinding, and "calm" games. So for me and most players, it's hell bad lineup. Hope, that this petition will work, and they change at least one game. Also I saw some people write about, that we (players who don't like this lineup) are selfish (?!). When you write it, it makes you as "selfish" as we are.

I don't have that good english, so I hope it makes sense

Exactly. I understand why this petition exists but it ain’t gonna do sh*t. The petition against Sony’s censorship policies was also a failure.

@themcnoisy no problem.

As far as trusting government bodies is concerned then that’s up to you. We were once told cigarettes were safe. How did that turn out? We were told there were weapons of mass destruction in the Middle East. Were there?

We shouldn’t blindly believe everything we’re told whether it’s from a “reputable” source or not. You don’t know what ulterior motives these people have, especially when so much money is involved as it is with 5G. Not to mention the internet of things leading us to an Orwellian future. These cannot be denied.

As Benjamin Franklin said “it is the first responsibility of every citizen to question authority” to which I agree. Yet in this day and age if you do you get shot down, insulted and made to look a fool. Where’s the fairness in that?

I appreciate there are many other things in the world to be concerned about, with one obvious example as we speak. The only reason I mentioned 5G was because another poster mentioned it. I am not wasting energy concentrating on this subject, just it was mentioned here.

Good god, this is entitled and stupid crap. These people should grow the hell up.
I’m not impressed by the games offered but this takes it to pathetic new level.

@lacerz Well said. I'd rather have a huge library of everything.

I get it, everyone's stuck inside and PS Plus chucks out a couple of titles from left-field.

But whatever happened to just going in with an open mind and giving things a go?

What I see is 99,993,000 did not sign it out of 100 million!

I put 5G will kill people in the same place with the Earth is flat.

The way you handle a product you do not like is to not purchase it!
Not by signing a Petition!

What the oldest PS4 FIFA entry i would exchange that for one of the games just for a laugh.

Anyone who has commented they actually want these games is a SQUARE (lol)

Give us Dark Souls/ Dying Light

@ChipBoundary Well the massive outcry of people saying they suck and dont want them says otherwise. There are are almost 40 million Plus subscribers, so your numbers of 2 million that Farming Simulator sold doesnt even compare. You wanna know why? Because the people that really want those niche games already bought them.

Have no interest in these games whatsoever, but a petition? Jeez.

@Dodoo Roger that mate. The cigarette example is good, I wrote a paper on smoking economics and promotion way back when. The crux of smoking before and since was the amount of money and tax being made from ciggies already established for hundreds of years in society. We should have been the generation to make a break from it - then vaporizers happened In that respect smoking was different, it was a significant economy spinner. Doesn't excuse the lies told by the brand owners in a court of law in America. But it was an established societal bind. No one really wanted it to be abolished until the evidence produced in the 90s and early 2000s. And with everything there is a counter point, thousands of pubs closed post smoking ban.

Personally I know pollution is bad. I signed up just before LockDown to canoe in my local waterways collecting plastic and rubbish, the crap was everywhere. I was due to continue with that every other Tuesday with my kids in school. That didn't work out obviously due to LockDown. I have no idea why we are not petitioning for that. Worse still the scheme was struggling for volunteers, where are all the concerned people in this scenario?

We are closer to the gutter than the stars as they say and are not given the option or even the illusion of choice with 5g. Its here, that's it. Scientists will no doubt be constachecking its effect on society.

1984 is a great book BTW. My biggest takeaway was being a prole in the pub wasn't such a bad deal. If only George knew they would be closed when mass surveillance took hold lol.

Which feeds in nicely to this link;

https://www.orwellfoundation.com/the-orwell-foundation/orwell/essays-and-other-works/books-vs-cigarettes/

@Mikey1 Some people are very spoiled.

@shuvamg009 "Not the first time either. Everytime they dominate a generation, then absolutely botch the next ( atleast since PS2 days)..."

So.... they've botched it... once? I gather you mean the PS3? The 5th biggest selling console of all time. The one that sold more than all SEGA consoles combined? The one that sold more than the XBOX 360 which is the best selling Microsoft console?

Nice combination of generalisation and hyperbole (everytime! absolutely!) but pretty much any other console manufacturer would kill for Sony's track record (ranked 1,2,3 and 5 in sales) and based on consumer interest, the PS5 might do okay too.

If you want to keep it please look at this petition
http://chng.it/bQw8ZkxL4c

I'm actually looking forward to these two. Considered buying both in the past, so it's a double win for me

Wow. Imagine being this entitled

@Col_McCafferty

And its only May. I have more than gotten my money's worth from Ps Plus this year. Everything from now on is a bonus.

The people who started this petition are the types to complain about being given a free year of PS Now and say "the games i want to play aren't on it so its a bad deal"

I didn't read through all these comments but far enough to see that many people have apparently lost their sense of humour. Maybe they should replace one of the PS Plus games with one of those instead.

@Netret0120 Spot on. Last year I don't think I downloaded a single PS+ offering but I didn't whine about it.

You 'win' some, you 'lose' some. Thems the breaks.

I'd be up for more indie titles being made available but these are generally relatively cheap so if I really wanted to play, say Night in The Woods I could just take the plunge and buy it.

@Col_McCafferty Exactly.

People can't be like

"Support the indies. Give them exposure"

Sony then puts an indie game on PS Plus

People are also then like

"These are trash games. Give us AAA games"🤣

Then when sony gives them AAA games

People are also like

"We all have these games already. Trash month"

Sony cant win

I already have these on psnow. They should at least offer something else for those with both subs.

Oh my - backlash to the backlash!

And quite acerbic too in some cases...

Man I feel bad for Playstation now, dudes still giving you free games, maybe I'll really enjoy farming simulator or skylines who knows

@Paranoimia you're making a lot of wild assumptions and also clearly an idiot to think Sony would even do that if they could.

@Col_McCafferty so you're dumb then. Just paid for titles you didn't even download.

@stefan771 wow imagine expecting something that doesn't suck with your paid subscription...

Well i didnt hear a thank you for the two free games. What a bunch

@Tigerbolt12 lol it's only 8 people. What a bunch of nonsense. Who the hell wants to Sim games one of which is a farming sim?

@Flaming_Kaiser not free. You have to pay for PS plus idiot.

Im ashamed to be human smh

These players are pathetic. Ungrateful children.

@Mikey1 yeah you the only one dude 😂

@Johnny89 You need to learn not to take everything you read on the internet so seriously. Of course Sony wouldn't do it. Jeez. 🙄

@Paranoimia says the guy getting upset that people are voicing their displeasure over the games selected.

I'll be really annoyed if they change the games it is like a day till they get released and I a looking forward to getting these games I was going to ask my Foster parents to buy it for me then I saw that farming simulator is free this month and I was like let's go and it's nearly my birthday it's in 1 weeks and I would hate if they change that games at the last second and I would not be getting PS plus ever again if they do change it because I would be very annoyed with them. I think this whole partition is a bit stupid 🖕

Just a reminder that most of the people who sign this petition are probably aged between 12 to 20 years old, since older people have more common sense in themselves to make it not a big deal. Farming simulator is a great game and is fun to play with friends. Cities skylines is also a superb game, even if it's limited on PS4 hardware. Either way, just because you don't like these type of games, doesn't mean everyone hates it too.

I hope Sony will make some changes in PS Plus subscription with PS5... At least give us a lineup of games and let us choose 2 games from the list every month. Like HumbleBundle does.

Not the first time Plus games have disappointed me and I’m sure it won’t be the last; personally not gonna petition about it though, seems a bit whiny.

Just imagine how the people feel who have one [or both] of the free games almost every single month, I mean we don’t flip out and try to petition them to give us a different game, personally: I think this is “quarantine gamers” trying to get the gaming industry to bend to “privileges” they think they have.

That could just be me tho. 🤷🏻‍♀️

I've always wanted to try farm simulator. There has to be a reason they make this game every year.

@Netret0120 It's possible to give people AAA titles that recently released. They did that with Detroit, and Game Pass has been doing it for a while with the likes of The Outer Worlds, Crackdown 3 (the game sucks but that's beside the point) and I think also Wasteland 3, which isn't even released yet as far as I'm aware.

@M_abrahamse It's not free, guy. It's a subscription service.

@jdv95 It's not contradicting to not like two different sets of games. That is not a dichotomy. The problem is that people expect the world with PS+ and, to be honest, the games just generally aren't worth the subscription. Not these days anyway. It's also not especially controversial to say that this is a bad lineup, when even people on a PlayStation-dedicated news site can't even stomach pretending as though it's worth it.

@Johnny89 Oh, I'm not upset in the slightest. I just can't believe how petty some people are.

I'm not happy with the games either. In fact, I rarely am. I only downloaded 5 of those offered in 2019, sometimes because I already had them, but usually because they weren't my type of thing and I didn't want them.

I've commented on this site several times previously about how I think Plus could be tweaked to offer something alternative each month for people who don't want the games offered, such as a couple of free movie rentals. I commented on the original post about this month's games and how I already have Cities Skylines on PC but rarely play it, and have no interest in Farming Simulator.

Nothing at all wrong with voicing your displeasure or opinion.

The difference is that I'm aware that while they're not for me, it's not all about me, and there are people who might enjoy them, so I'm not signing petitions every month because I didn't get what I wanted. I'm also aware that the games offered aren't entirely Sony's choice, and that publishers will have a say in what does or doesn't appear.

I also have a theory that a certain other company may be having an influence on things. I have absolutely no proof, but they've employed similar tactics before, so it's not an entirely unreasonable suspicion.

I think Sony should wait for first 3 days of PS plus may to see how many downloads these games get this will please those who want the game and then Sony should change the games to make others happy.

Compared to XBOX Games Pass getting Gears Tactics and Streets of Rage 4...yeah, of course this is bad, lol.

I've already had more good games on PS+ than I've been able to play, so meh.

You win some, you lose some. No big deal-
The greatest gifts are the ones you least expect.....

It's probably the worst month of free PS plus games that I can remember for PS4

Cities Skylines is like the perfect game to play while this lockdown ***** is going on. Create a society free from viruses and killer hornets. I'm excited.

Yikes. Talk about people being absolutely spoiled and demanding.
I'm actually looking forward to these 2 games, they've been given decent reviews. Sony doesn't have to give you free games, they're doing it to keep people busy - and if others haven't realized, they gave Goat Simulator for free a couple of months back, and I don't recall this much backlash.

Stop being greedy, spoiled sucks.

Utterly pathetic reaction.

Seriously kids... time to grow up.

City Skyline is quite damn good, but the other title! Not really my cup of tea!

@Mythologue Nope. They are free, as in they cost "no additional money", just like you get a "free drink" when you pay entrance fee at a club.

The era of entitlement. Sadly..... Not surprising at all.

@Bamila Nah. Plenty of adults with sad lives who get some sense of satisfaction from acting that way, just like Karens who want to complain to your manager.

what about the PSPlus Members Launch Petition Against 'Dumbfounding' PSPLUS, and demand it being optional so people that dont want the games can play online for free?? but i guess thats to much to ask for, its better to whine about the crappy games PSPlus has to offer instead.

I cant believe how entitled people think they are to get games "they" like. Im not interested in this months offerings but i wouldnt get on my high horse to have those games taken away from others that may like them. I have plenty to be getting on with and ive downloaded plenty of plus games to make my subscription worth while. Self centered, entitled morons is what they are.

@Johnny89 Grow up.

While I am keen to try these games I do think it's a bit strange to have two simulator titles this month, perhaps one and a game with more mass appeal would have been wise but having said that, to launch a petition against it? No, that's just silly.

Can't say i care either way as i pay for Plus for Online and not the games.

7000 whiny brats u mean. Good grief what a bunch of self entitled idiots.
Boohoohoo I don't like the games mommy I am gonna throw a hissy fit.
Unbelievable

Was I enamored with this month's selections? Admittedly no. But my family is appreciating it. So with my wife and kids onboard, that becomes a no-brainer for us when the next PS Plus re-up is due.

@Johnny89 You're clearly not the sharpest tool in the shed if you can't even understand that the money you pay for PS Plus is for being able to play online.

The games offered each month are a free incentive to keep you subbed. Don't like it? You can unsubscribe, but then you'd be losing what you presumably subscribed to in the first place, which is playing online, you know....the important bit.

I have all the farming sim games on my pc just haven't got fs19. I really enjoyed the games. Great for times like these on using up your time. You might even learn something rather than just pulling a trigger. I also have skylines. And that's an awesome game aswell. Looking forward to playing fs19 👍

@ZenMex With all due respect, you don't take into account a lot of the costs involved with online gaming. There are servers that need to be upkept across multiple games. You may be blithely unaware of this, which is quite normal, because you don't work on network adminstration, but believe me these costs exist, and they're not cheap.

Of course, secondly, this is a business, and a business is here to make profit. So when you take both of these into account, you have to appreciate, and respect that the money you pay to Sony is primarily to support online play, and ensure servers are continued to be maintained, network connectivity is constantly being reviewed and adjusted to account to fluctuating numbers, as well as Sony making a healthy profit off the services they supply to consumers.

This pandemic being a good example, Sony would of had to make various adjustments to their infrastructure, just so you can continue to consume your online gaming, which you think should be something you have for free.

Try to keep this in mind, BEFORE you start your whining and complaining.

@themcnoisy interesting mate.

Where did you sign up for plastic collecting btw, local council? I’d be interested myself in looking into that.

Thanks for the link. It would be great to speak to George in this day and age to see what his current viewpoint would be in relation to 1984. Having said that he’d probably have a heart attack finding out 20 cigs now costs the same as the average persons yearly spend on cigs and alcohol back in the 40’s!

@ZenMex Nice attempt, but your arguments just aren't stacking up.

Yes, Sony is worth multi millions, it also has rich stakeholders who paid to have huge percentages of the business. You might not like it, but this is capitalism 101. I'm not saying that corporate greed isn't a thing, but unfortunately that's one of the prices we pay for the freedom of a capitalist nation. Got to roll with the punches.

Businesses are going to make money, that's what they're there for, bottom line.

In regards to making the games better, they have to ebb and flow that stuff, we've had some absolute bangers released in parts of the year. Realistically, this just can't be maintained, month in, month out, it's just not sustainable. Now, i get that when you remove the context, and just think of it in a "well I don't like it" way, then sure, but if you think about it, it's the only way to make free game give aways sustainable throughout the year, without cutting deeply into profit margins. Most of these releases will be based on sales figures of whats doing well, and what can be released en mass for free, and in the process mostly kill the revenue stream.

Lastly, and probably your best (but ultimately flawed point). Why was it free at the start of PS3. The answer to this is two fold. Early in the PS3's life cycle they were fighting hard to try and beat the Xbox 360 who at the time were charging for their live service. In order to build the PS3 customer base which at the time was flagging due to the poorly hardcoded piece of hardware that the PS3 was, they decided as a business decision to make it free in order to get people to jump ship.

As PS3 gathered steam, and it was clear that live services required more resource to maintain, equally Sony were aware that Xbox were charging for their live service so Sony switched it's process to inline with the rest of the market.

For your information PS Plus was around for ages during PS3 era, it was only made mandatory when they realized not enough people were upgrading to PS+ and the costs were likely to much to shoulder without making it mandatory.

If you want the full explanation, a translation of a Famitsu interview can be found here, where studio boss (at the time) Shuhei Yoshida explains why PS Plus was made mandatory: https://www.gamespot.com/articles/sony-explains-why-ps-plus-is-required-for-ps4-online-play/1100-6410806/

People have way too much time on their hands these days.

@ZenMex Sorry they way you talk you sound like a ass****. You win some you lose some we have had triple A games i think almost every month. I dont see the issues here. People just got Uncharted for free with Yourney and still complain. We had Uncharted trilogy, Uncharted 4, Dirt 2, Bioshock Collection, Shadow the Collosus, Sims 4 and the other games where not so bad.

Just wait till I get it downloaded then you do what you want.

@TheBuzz
Well that's one thing you are good at - "Whining"

@Dodoo you son are a melt

What's wrong with you people?

@Grindagger Ok, i get it, sorry for arguing, i know about servers but i do not know how much they cost, The ps4 isnt the worst due to it being a good console, BUT, we can all atleast agree that EA is the worst one, like ive never played battlefield but they just "20 dollars for a new character!" im done with arguing, theres no point, i also dont like how when u want a refund for a game, on the ps4, you cant download it unless u cant refund, like when u buy a new game then it automatically starts downloading, ps4 has its flaws but i like it, ive had an xbox 360 when i was younger and i can say that playstation has a better controller and design and crap.

@Artois as I said in comment #99...

“Yet in this day and age if you do you get shot down, insulted and made to look a fool. Where’s the fairness in that?”

Your comment just adds credit to the fact that all truths pass three phases. First they are ridiculed, second they are violently opposed, third they are accepted as being self-evident.

@ZenMex Well that was a refreshingly more well rounded perspective. And, yes, I agree with you on that. Particularly about EA, I'm not at all fond of their methods of extorting money from their customerbase.

There's business, and then there is EA.

Do people really get PS plus for the free games anymore? It was awesome in 2010 but where Sony really needs to shape up is with their "game pass" type service, compared with Microsoft it is horrible. I get it that Sony has better first party titles but it's foolish to think that will stay strong through next gen. You never know.

Petition has been gaining steam. Over 16,000 now. Might seem entitled, but I feel they should have done just one of those and a different genre for variety. I don't do the PS+ though, so what do I know?

@Lawlking This comment is asinine.

I mean, come on, you're comparing historical injustices with PS plus game selections. Talk about absurd comparisons.

It's one thing to have an opinion, I.E "I'm not a fan of this months selections, would be cool if Sony could maybe make X adjustment to make PS Plus more exciting for it's customer base" and "WAAAAAH WAAAAAH I WANT SOMETHING DIFFERENT, I DEMAND SOMETHING DIFFERENT, RIGHT NOW!"

There's nothing pretentious about pointing out people entitlement issues. It's the tone thats taken, not the opinion that something is good or bad.

If you're having to make a petition an sign it just because you feel that the games that were selected for the month, that are FREE, weren't up to your personal level of standard, then might be worth reconsidering your life priorities. Seriously.

PS Plus is, and always will be primarily a payment for using online services, and to pay towards upkeep of that, and of course for sony to make a percentage profit on mark up.

16,000 signatures says all you need to know, when there are nearly 40 million subscribers. And that's that most people aren't whiny crybabies.

This whole chat is acting like a bunch of cry babies. Just buy the game you want broke boys.

I hope Sony decides to axe the lineup for this month...

Bunch of entitled whiney lil clods.

Love this lineup, you know, not every gamer likes to pretend he is a murderous a hole who has a t bagging addiction. Cant wait to cash in the yields of my harvest. Good Job PS Plus!

I'm personally really looking forward to play farming simulator 19 for just the monthly 7 pounds. It's a great game and in my opinion is worth the payment

@DingusKahn yep same

@Grindagger I can't agree more

Honestly, not every month has games i am particularly interested in. And farm simulator this month is one of those I am not interested in. But I play Cities Skylines on PC, and I'm VERY interested in the PS4 version. It's a wonderful sim, like Sim City but for the new age and made by people who really love these types of sims and have put a ton of content and support into it over YEARS it has been on steam. Not only are the people in this petition potentially trying to get a game they may love taken out of the free games lineup, they are ruining it for some others who may want this game or may learn they actually love this game, as it is a high quality release with tons of great reviews. Sorry you aren't a fan of sims. How about not ruining things for people who maybe are?

@Cdtjr we did buy them you idiot. With our subscription. That's the point. We don't want those games.

@Paranoimia you're not upset yet you make a looooong reply that I didn't even read because I don't waste all of my time whining to strangers on the internet like you.

@Johnny89 You read enough to know I'm not upset, that's enough. If you're not interested in the explanation, that's fine. You have yourself a wonderful day.

@Cdtjr @Johnny89 All right let's not call each other names.

Almost 7000 people signed it?
So there is at a minimum 7000 self entitled people wanting something for nothing.
Good job ps fans.

Sony better not change these games for May. I have been waiting on these.

@ShogunRok stay out of it

@Johnny89 ???

Enjoy your ban!

@Dodoo there are regular paddle and pick events all over the country. Look them up online! On Merseyside there's a group in Liverpool - came across them via a news article and contacted them on Facebook. They don't provide equipment but you can get a waterways licence for free if you don't have one already and commit to a clean up. No boats are in the estuaries just water and rubbish where I live, get a net, grabbers and you clean up for a few hours. It's just picking crap out of the water. Most difficult part alone is the bags fill up quickly and then you need to take them to the tip.

I'm no eco warrior, it's a hobby to keep me fit whilst keeping the local area clean (well cleaner the crap is endless)?

I'm fine with the lineup I like fs19

@carlos82 theres more people that dont look forward to it then do look forward to it. besides they can always buy it

People are so entitled. Sony doesn't owe you anything

@picklerick305 and you can buy whatever game you want them to put on plus

Almost as high of a % as those who hate the leaked tlou2 plot. Long live joel! Down with the its maam guy!

@Grindagger paying to play online is a scam. Why do you think PSN (and even Xbox Live) still gets outages every year while Sony is charging for PS Plus to apparently “upkeep servers”? I call it BS. Sony only switched to paid online at the beginning of the generation just because they saw Microsoft getting away with it and profiting, and of course Nintendo which also offered free online on their previous consoles eventually followed when they released the Switch.

Hell, even Steam on PC doesn’t charge for online and it still produces bank for Valve. And you would seriously trust a businessman (Yoshida) regarding an issue? They are just there to market the product, if they reveal anything negative or concerning about it they know that it would end up not selling.

@Johnny89 There's nothing to assume you simpleton. It's a matter of fact. The subscription serves one purpose, and one purpose only.

@RALPHY88 I don't necessarily disagree with you, but there are definitely costs involved with providing online services to nearly 40 million subscribers.

I'm not saying they don't profiteer hugely off the back of it, but it's a service nonetheless.

Anyway, my point isn't whether sony do or don't make money from it, it's that the service is primarily provided to serve online capabilities for the user, that's it's primary objective. The monthly games are literally a secondary ancillary benefit, aimed to keep you subscribed to the service who might be waining on using online.

People like ol' Johnny here who are supposedly trying to utilize the service here as a free games mechanic still would come out massively on top, since paying £50 a year, when you're getting an average of at least 2 games a month supersedes the cost by an absolute mile, even if you only got 2 triple A titles a year, nevermind 3,4 or even 5 + the myriad of indie titles you get along with it.

There's literally no value lost here, except for entitled morons who think they're getting a hard deal.

@Paranoimia Agreed, Those 7000 People Are Taking The Piss!

i am a fan of citieskylines but sorry to say console versions are missing some of the best elements of the game. poor controler usage, no map/asset creation and real mods. i don't mind a bit of farming sim either but that market on console is tiny. Both games being sim games on + at the same time is a bad move. I would have waited a few months between them. Aso adding games that are on psnow will under value that service over time

No chance I will sign this petition. I might have had he not brought the NHS into it which has nothing at all to do with him crying like a baby that he does not like the games. He should put his hand in his pocket and buy games like everyone else.

@carlos82 thank you, as I'm really looking forward to both games and left disappointed the last couple of months as they weren't my taste but this month is a delight for me

@Paranoimia Actually if you consider the situation we are in, two simulator games are *****, people have a reason to outraged as we were hyped up for 2 fantastic games of Dying Light and Dark Souls Remastered and we were given two simulator and were heavily let down, and saying that we are stupid just because we are outraged for the right reasons puts you as delusional.

@Iron4695 Actually, if you consider the situation we are in, two simulator games aren't that bad, since they offer endless hours of open gameplay, with different outcomes every time. The only reason they're no good to me personally is that I already have Cities Skylines, and numerous other simulations, on PC.

You call me delusional, but I'm not the one who got himself hyped up over two rumoured games, am I? Honestly, I've lost count of the number of times this generation that people have got themselves overly hyped over rumours, and then blamed everyone but themselves when things don't turn out as they expected. You'd think people would have learned by now not to believe everything they read on the internet.

@Paranoimia If your going to bring up the excuse of this generation, then who in this generation would want two simulator games and not Dying Light and Dark Souls Remastered. Oh I have the answer, they would rather have Dying Light and Dark Souls Remastered. Rumours can be lead to them being real, it isn't bad to hype yourself up for a game that has been rumoured, as it can lead for the rumours being true and you being happy and excited to play the games.

Simulation games are usually only fun for 5 minutes and if not maybe 1 hour and that is it, but with two triple A games, most people would have fun for hours, maybe days, or even months. I have Dying Light on my PC and I have been enjoying every single day of it. Having two triple A games being rumoured and then presented with two ***** simulator games will anger people and rightfully so, and that is why I and many others are angered. If you had PS Plus you would understand people's anger!

@Iron4695 If people are that eager to play Dying Light, why haven't they bought it? It's been out for 5 years, been cheap in numerous sales, and can be bought used for a few quid on eBay.

"If you had PS Plus you would understand people's anger!"

Ah, but I do have PS Plus. I wasn't particularly pleased with the games either, since I already have Skylines and I'm not interested in Farming Simulator.

The reason I'm not angry is because (a) I know better than to get hyped over a baseless rumour, and (b) I already have Dying Light and I'm not interested in Dark Souls, so nothing would have changed.

Even on or off sales, people may not want to buy it and then finally see it for free, people would then be eager to play it and eBay isn't always reliable. If something was eBay it might be broken, faulty and corrupted. You could say the opposite that things could be fine, but how would you know if it is fine if it was a game? You would have to pay your money and take your chances, and maybe have to try to refund it or wait until it is free from PS Plus and get it then.

Saying the rumour now is baseless is understandable but no one knew then if the rumour was fake or not so you would just have to go with what you are shown if you wanted to, and it is alright to do it, but also saying that people who sign a petition that might not even go through are like people who 'think the Earth is flat, Coronavirus isn't real, and 5G will melt your brain' which is absolutely not true, and I know that because I signed the petition, and I worry about me, my friends and family if they get Corona, I know the earth is a sphere and 5G is just a newer and better data type. Honestly you are missing the point, people signed a petition, whoop-de-doo, get over it and get on with your life.

Now ***** off.

I pay for PS Plus mainly so my kids can play PVZ and almost all the games are turn offa for me. Usually just overblown action games. Bioshock, Borderlands, Infamous - they are obviously good for what they are but they really ain't my kinda thing. I give everything a go but so far I only really got into Journey, that moni Assasins Creed one they gave away and Shadow of the Colossus. I'd always wondered why they didnt have more variety on offer. This month I found our why.

Ps4, for the gamers. If those gamers are your friends dad who has a model railroad in the basement.

i went and signed the petition too. but then it started solicitating me and im like, yeah thanks a lot for making me sign this now im being harassed for money ugh

anyway the reason i signed the petition is not because of the month's crappy games but every month's crappy games. hence why i canceled my subscription today. Its always Popular mega hit games. Im looking for more hard and expensive, rare type of games you cannot afford or find anywhere. Im just not into POP games at all. and Yes, I KNOW! This month games are NOT POP, but they arent GOOD EXPENSIVE OR RARE HARD TO FIND GAMES EITHER! bah!

Now that i canceled my subscription im just wondering how many more Uncharted games Ill be missing on in the future.... cuz, gotta have every Uncharted game, every sequel remake ALL! throws up

@naruball What about people who pay for PS+ for the games? How is it free? Also, online play did used to be free on the PS3 so what else were people paying for besides games each month?

@Mythologue a 25 kilo luggage used to be free when traveling by plane. It no longer is for most airlines. You may want to complain both to the ones who charge for it now and to the ones who don't because they shouldn't call it free, since you're paying for the ticket anyway. See how ridiculous that sounds?

We were also paying for cloud services that allowed us to upload our save files. Whether one used that or not is irrelevant. They also gave from time to time themes at no additional cost, i.e. for free. Also, some other extras, like exp points in certain games, orbs, access to demos, etc.

It's a very simple concept, really. Words simply have different meanings depending on context.