@dd8900 GreedFall and The Outer Worlds are supposed to be a bit shorter than your typical RPG. I've not played either so can't comment on how good they are.
Life is more fun when you help people succeed, instead of wishing them to fail.
Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt.
@dd8900 I’m assuming by “adventure” you mean “full of action and plot” rather than an “Adventure” point and click style game in the truest sense of the the term.
Yeah, short RPGs seem to be more rare these days. Depending on your preference, the 3 Tomb Raider games are certainly adventuresome with light RPG, and the other they comes to mind is Marvel’s Spider-Man. You level up and assign skill points and have a limited customizable equipment. Those games are more action oriented with very light RPG elements and last in the neighborhood of 15-30 hours depending how much time you explore and do side activities. It’s quite a bit longer, but Horizon Zero Dawn is also light on the RPG, very adventuresome, and shorter than say a Red Dead 2, Persona 5, or Assassin’s Creed Odyssey 100 hour marathon. HZD is more like 40-60 hours, so still long, but very engaging.
—
On a separate note, I had my own question:
So with Nioh coming next week to PS Plus, I’m curious about it.
For the veterans out there — for a relative Soulsborne novice, what’s the recommendation of Dark Souls vs. Nioh?
I just read the Push Square review of Nioh and it sounds good and maybe a tad more approachable than the Dark Souls games. The Borderlands style loot finding sounds great and it looks like there is more opportunity to make up for poor skill by grinding and finding superior loot and crafting equipment. Is this true?
Also the ki recovery system sounds a little like the Bloodborne mechanic of being able to get back a little health by being aggressive which makes for a more action oriented gameplay.
Thanks everyone. I think I'll give The Outer Worlds a try. I suppose for me it's less about the overall games length and more about the complexity (if that makes sense). Old Zelda games, Fable; sit down and play for an hour and make progress and advance the story. Complex open world games seem daunting to me these days.
@dd8900 I have been enjoying The Outer Worlds the past few days. It's not a long RPG (Nothing like say Dragon Quest XI in length) but it has a great story. And really it's only as long as you want to make it by exploring and such.
@Th3solution I had a harder time with Nioh, presumably because I'm used to the slightly slower nature of Dark Souls, so you'll probably be all right. The loot is good, although there is a heck of a lot of it, and you end up selling loads off at the end of each mission, making it a game of inventory management at times. Thankfully the menu system is good - you can 'favourite' your preferred items so you don't accidentally sell them off, and you can break armour down and take the buffs to apply them to a different piece of armour instead.
The only thing I'd say - make sure you meet the stats required to wear armour. It's easy to miss the fact that you don't have enough vitality/dexterity/whatever to match the item - the number simply shows up red instead of white, but because you can still equip it, it's easily overlooked. This will make sense when you play it. I went for quite a while without realising that I wan't getting the benefit of the armour I was wearing because I didn't meet the stat requirements. It let me wear it anyway, but it turned out that looking like a badass wasn't enough to stop the enemies killing me.
Good job, Parappa. You can go on to the next stage now.
@Gremio108 Ok, it sounds good. I’m not sure when I’ll get the itch for a Soulsborne style game again. Every time I think I want to start one, I second guess myself.
“We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.”
@Th3solution@Gremio108 I'm defo going to download and will give it a go at some point. I did play the demo a while but it didn't click with me for some reason. I am willing have another crack at it though.
@Th3solution I really enjoyed Nioh and it is more Bloodborne than Souls. The USP of having different stances with each weapon (high stance for slower, harder attacks with medium and low stances quicker but less powerful) is really neat.
I found the best way to get good gear was to resurrect people via the online component and cheese to victory with a spear from distance.
@RogerRoger Wise move, I feel better about expounding my thoughts over here.
Yeah, I’ve played all three. Flower I even played on PS3 and then replayed on Vita.
First, Journey. Journey is a little bit polarizing. At the time it came out, it was doing something new, the likes of which hadn’t really been done before (Funny that we are having similar discussion about Death Stranding now), at least not quite in the same way. Many will argue that the game is boring, tedious, and pointless. Pundits say that it’s overhyped by Sony fanboys who are blinded by their console allegiance (sound familiar yet?) etc, etc. For me I have to admit that I bought into the hype and played it after all the 10/10 reviews and Game of the Year awards and I was a little disappointed. That said, I appreciate the game for its artistic merit, unconventional approach, and trailblazing new ideas into gaming art. It’s probably worth experiencing because of its role in gaming history. I won’t overstate and say the game created some kind of Renaissance of gaming art, but with the focus on the sublime and the interesting approach to online player interaction, I think it holds a place of influence. It helped bolster indie style games like Abzu, Rime, and The Unfinished Swan. It’s probably a stretch since I haven’t played it but perhaps even a tiny smudge of its DNA could be found in Breath of the Wild (the openness and wandering “play at your own pace and enjoy the journey” aspect)
Anyways, I was lukewarm on it and only experienced it once. I think there increased depth to the game if you replay it. I’m also not sure how active the online community is now, which is part of the cool aspects to the game when you get to hang out with a random anonymous stranger who drops in.
I actually enjoyed Flower more. Actually it’s probably my favorite of the bunch, despite it being the most simplistic. It’s gaming concept is a little more concrete, although still obtuse and artsy enough to be unconventional. The integration of music and gameplay is genius.
Abzu is a game thats probably somewhere in between, conceptually. It’s less abstract than Journey but the gameplay is more varied and deeper than Flower.
All three of these games are great to play alone on a quiet Sunday afternoon while it’s raining outside and you’ve nothing to distract you. They probably won’t translate well to spectating a playthrough, so if you watch your partner play or he watches you, then it may come across as more boring to the viewer. I don’t know. Each of them were enjoyable to me, but I can understand if people don’t “get” them. Some people gotta have their explosions and spews of blood to feel like they are getting quality game time. And that’s fine. But I have a feeling you’ll appreciate them for what they are. After playing Abzu you’ll know whether you can tolerate another of the same ilk.
Preffered Abzu to Journey for the reasons @Th3solution mentioned above. Enjoyed them both though but they are an acquired taste. The perfect games for when you fancy a change or inbetween games.
Life is more fun when you help people succeed, instead of wishing them to fail.
Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt.
I thought Journey was a neat game for the most part but when it suddenly dawned on me that the other character I’d been following for a while was another human rather than part of the game, it made it more unique.
@RogerRoger I knew the twist to The Sixth Sense before seeing it in the cinema. It's still a really good watch, and stands him to multiple viewings. You just see it from a different point of view from someone that has no idea what happens.
Life is more fun when you help people succeed, instead of wishing them to fail.
Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt.
As I said yesterday @Ralizah over on ninty life my answer has predictably been stupidly long... Good thing I said I'd put it here instead! 😂
Honestly I prefer the original for the most part over the second Ralizah, even if the second has notable improvements in a bunch of areas.
Dark Cloud
Has the better story I feel, by being more minimal for the most part.
Dark Chronicle's story is far more cliche overall and it always feels a bit contrived.
For most of the story in DChr it revolves around you travelling by train to different areas and you'll always be stopped by something blocking the tracks or something.
But it's ok because you NEEDED to be there anyway conveniently.
At least so the game says...
Only the fifth chapter feels kinda important and even then it's only because it leads into chapter six directly (but that feels like padding)...
Plus the bad guys They're never TRULY bad and it's not their fault they turned evil honest! plus the final boss is completely pulled out the games butt .
DC has a bit of it as the whole area of "queens" should've really been resolved in about two seconds but there's just something about DC's more minimal approach that I like... Plus the final dungeon in DC is great and really sets the mood for the ensewing epic finale.
The translation is a bad though in DC. DCh has that beat easy!
The weapon upgrading
I like the wider array of options in Dark Cloud regarding this,
Dark Chr's is much more streamlined with what you can upgrade (You can't even choose what you'd prefer to use either regarding elements so the elemental weaknesses never seem to come into play like they can in DC).
Plus starting round the 3rd chapter in DChr you find out that you can't evolve weapons up too high as they're locked off til you beat certain monsters and it can feel a bit stingey about that.
Though Monica and Max have quite large weapon pools with the evolution mechanics (Even if Monica mainly just has all Toan's swords and Ruby's bracelets from DC and Max has a bunch of Goro's hammers)
DC meanwhile let's you upgrade to your heart's content. Plus the synthesis points system in DChr is just as easy to exploit like the simple 2-4 attachment slots in DC.
Back Floors
They're great. Ok you can't get the item for the back floor in the final story dungeon in DC due to a bug/glitch/oversight... But they're nice little challenges and great for farming ABS/exp for your weapons.
Dark Chronicle doing away with them is disappointing.
Dark Chronicle on the other hand
Has voice acting
And it's quite good for the most part.
Main character Max sounds fine (a bit like he's from the 1930's though with that accent), Monica's voicework is solid as Max's counterpart, Max's boss Cedric is Col Campbell from Metal Gear Solid, Cam Clarke (Liquid Snake) is thrown in the mix and Mark Hamil does his thing and does it well.
Kath Soucie (Phil and Lil from Rugrats and using that very voice in fact) feels rather out of place though.
Overall the voice talent is good though.
The Postgame
Both games have an extra challenge
Dark Cloud has a hundred floor dungeon (that isn't part of the original japan release I believe) whilst Dark Chronicle has only 30 floors or so.
Dark Chronicle's feels part of the story though.
It's pretty threadbare admittedly but it's not quite completely tacked on and out of place like Dark Cloud's. It's quite a challenge too in fact.
Though the bonus boss is VERY out of place... Just like the final boss in fact.
Dark Cloud's meanwhile rewards you with a sword once you've bested the dungeon that's completely pointless other then bragging rights in that you've done it.
The sword isn't even that good either!
The Minigames
Fishing is DRASTICALLY improved in DCh. Sooooo much more fun and actually involving then DC's.
Spheda (The golf minigame) is pretty good too (Though it can get pretty annoying)
There's also the Finny Frenzy (fish racing) or the Fishing competition...
Plus the medal system (that allows you to buy clothing items for the characters with them) revolves around playing spheda and fishing alongside doing certain requirements like only using Max's gun or Monica's sword for each floor of a dungeon... They can add a bunch more hours to the game if you get sucked in.
Max & Monica and improved combat
Most of the cast feels a bit redundant in DC and honestly there's one or two too many (Looking at you Ungaga & Goro)
DChr having just Max and Monica ( Well there's Max's special ability of the Ridepod mech (That's pretty good) and Monica having monster transformation (That's terrible) ) means it's much more manageable.
Plus with them having both a ranged weapon AND Melee weapon it means there's still variety (Monica's magic feels a bit... dinky and underpowered at times though, especially when you first get her).
Monica's swords even have varying hit combo's depending on what sword she has.
Game doesn't tell you that though mind...
Dark Chronicle is probably better overall... but Dark Cloud is quite nostalgic though to me. I played the demo of it that came on the demo disc with my first PS2 a whole bunch of times
They're both regularly on sale on the PS4 too.
Got both Dark Cloud and Dark Chronicle for £3.50 each. Bargain! (I also have them phyiscally and they cost £20 each so... I don't feel bad getting them dirt cheap digitally)
Though if Dark Cloud never really clicked with you I fail to see how Dark Chronicle/Cloud 2 would as it's a refined and honed type of sequel.
Nothing is drastically different in it... it just polished it up for the most part.
Just don't play Rogue Galaxy also by Level-5. That game is awful
The weapon upgrading is pathetic and even more streamlined.
Gameplay, while fast, is an utter slog, terribly button mashy combat and you're CONSTANTLY ambushed (it's random battles weirdly unlike DC & DCh) and you're running down seemingly neverending hallways.
(I know you basically do the same in Dark Cloud/Chronicle but the combat feels more methodical and deliberate in those and it just... works)
The story is unbearable with the worst star wars like space opera and anime clichés rolled up into one unholy alliance.
Plus the seven main characters are terribly bland and like dark cloud there's waaaaay too many.
I REALLY wanted to like Rogue Galaxy as it looked like it'd be a space Dark Cloud...
Uggghhhh. I've never loathed a game so much in my life
Nice. Thanks for the breakdown! I actually still have Dark Cloud on my PS2, so I'll probably boot that up sometime and see if my feelings have changed (I was a young teenager the last time I played it, so my feelings could easily have changed).
Rogue Galaxy is a game I've heard a lot of people mention (usually positively), but I didn't know it was another Level-5 developed game, to be honest.
Ugh. I have too many PS2 games to catch up on.
Currently Playing: Fields of Mistria (PC); Cookie Clicker (PC); Metaphor: ReFantazio (PC); Overboard! (PC)
I have too many games in general to catch up on @Ralizah 😂
If you wanna break the difficulty in Dark Cloud ( Or just pump up a weapon for the hell of it) there's a glitch you can take advantage of that produces an attachment that looks like a broken dagger (The Broken Dagger glitch) that when attached to a weapon will boost the stats considerably
Rogue Galaxy is a game I've heard a lot of people mention (usually positively), but I didn't know it was another Level-5 developed game, to be honest.
It came out at the very end of the PS2's lifecycle and I don't think it sold well at all so I'm not surprised. I didn't actually know about Dark Chronicle til 2008 as it wasn't marketed as well over here but I did happen to know about Rogue Galaxy... I just never found it in the local stores so I never got to play it til 2 years ago on the PS4 as a PS2 classic.
Rogue Galaxy looks rather pretty still being cell shaded... only thing I feel the game has going for it.
Like a lot of the criticisms for FFXIII, RG has you running down corridor after corridor that are far too long winded and the battle gameplay being fairly mindless.
Cloud and Chronicle have the more methodical, slightly clunky, slower combat that adds to the experience with tense encounters and with them being Dungeon Crawlers with that lite, dare I say, roguelike quality of you being bumped back to the start with a loss of money it makes it all the more worthwhile.
Plus in Chronicle there's the Spheda (golf) you can do on every dungeon floor once you unlock it and Fishing on most that allows you to change up the gameplay.
RG has a bug battling minigame... but it's terribly slow and the factory building one is way too complicated and again extremely slow.
The Georama building however is fairly simple in both Dark Cloud/Chronicle and not terribly complex, but a nice little distraction allowing you to build the villages as you like (Preferably once you've got the rewards for the areas)
Plus I forgot to mention Chronicle also has a crafting mechanic tied in with phatography via Max's camera... Allowing him to combine three ideas together to form various items (He's an inventor)
It can be rather obtuse at times though and terribly picky on what'll make certain items. Still neat though!
@kiki3400 Fist bump returned, friend. I'm still holding out hope for a Suikoden VI, going back to its 2D roots. It seems unlikely at this point, but you never know.
Good job, Parappa. You can go on to the next stage now.
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