We’re still eagerly anticipating a PlayStation 5 price announcement, but speculation seems to ebb and flow in enthusiast circles, with the delay of Halo: Infinite this week seemingly bringing a fresh round of concern regarding the cost of Sony’s next-gen console. And infamous Games Beat reporter Jeff Grubb, who’s been a very vocal figure this year, has suggested the system could cost upwards of $500.
Speculating as part of a podcast, he said: “I think they’re going to do everything in their power to hit $500, but they’re going to be losing money. I thought the Xbox Series X was more expensive to make, but now talking to people it sounds like the PS5 is more expensive and less powerful.” He continued that the exotic nature of the PS5 could lead to some differences in multiformat titles at launch.
It’s a sentiment that’s been shared around the web elsewhere, with fellow “insider” Dusk Golem recently claiming that Capcom was having some issues with the initial development of Resident Evil Village on PS5. Speaking about pricing, he said: “People should get ready for the really real possibility that the PS5 is going to end up being the more expensive console between the two.”
He added: “I’m trying not to say much here as I was asked not to but prepare yourself, which does put Xbox Series X in a position it'll be the less expensive and more powerful console. I used [Resident Evil Village] as an example, but I've heard from other developers that PS5 struggles with 4K games in particular so you'll see a lot of fake 4K. That doesn't matter to some, but get ready for that too.”
Of course, no one’s really discussing the fact that Sony actually increased production of the PS5 earlier in the year, and now plans to manufacture 10 million units by the end of March 2021 – after it had initially targeted between 5 and 6 million units. It’s hard to imagine it selling those kind of numbers with a price higher than $500.
According to Bloomberg, the PS5’s bill of materials sits at around $450, and a quick browse of Sony’s financial forecast for the coming year suggests that it’s planning a small loss with hardware. This is because it’s predicting a substantial jump in revenue to reflect the new console’s release, but only a small increase in operating profit.
There’s no doubt that the next-gen consoles are going to be pricey, and we wouldn’t be surprised if Microsoft managed to undercut the cost of Sony’s system, but we’re not overly worried about a PS3 era-esque blunder here. The Japanese giant has doubled production because it believes it can shift a significant number of units, and it won’t do that at an outrageous price point.
[source youtube.com, via twitter.com, bloomberg.com]
Comments 171
Yeah, I’m going to wait until an official announcement about the price before worrying about the sky falling. Same as the rumours of resident evil having a difficult time on ps5. The power is there for full 4k easily.
Loads of rumours have been completely false in the past.
Edit: and the person making the claim of resident evil having difficulty on ps5 has admitted it was just to shift the focus off Xbox and he has no idea if it’s even true or not. Surprise surprise.
https://twitter.com/trugiffers/status/1294332061864677377?s=21
I have $500 saved. It's enough for a console, and I can get $100 more for a game or two. Demons Souls is all I really care about.
Hopefully it costs that much, and if the All Digital edition is less that'd be great!
Price has been a sticking point for me in general, though at this point, I think regardless of price I still won't be buying this at launch. I will wait for the time being until I think it is worth my time, or I somehow magically run out of PS4 games to play (huge backlog, so doubtful).
Personally I’ll buy the Series X or PS5 digital, which ever is the cheaper, I’ve got both platforms now so am going to base my decision on which to buy on price and value, to me both systems have games I like and pluses and minuses, if the Series X is the same cost as the PS5 Digital then I’ll have to think about that extra power and a UHD drive built in.
It seems Sony may not have learnt it’s lesson with high prices consoles.
Digital Foundry have said they’ve heard talk of both XSX and PS5 costing around 600 dollars or more!! And the reason neither company has announced pricing is because they are going to very high, as well as facing off against each other, look at the tech in them, incredibly powerful CPUs and GPUs they aren’t even on the market yet! All completely custom built, you won’t be able to buy these all in one chips with CPU and GPU anywhere else.
Nah. PS5 won't be that expensive. 499€ for the disc drive and 399€ for the digital edition.
Physical PS5 and I’m hoping for 500 euro price tag ! I’m just hoping Ratchet and Clank or Demon Souls are launch titles
$599, that is what I have saved. Hoping I can also get a game in there.
I have a good 4K capable PC so do not need an Xbox.
My PS4 lasted over 7 years, and most people I know spend more than that on their Cable bill in a year (that we do not have)
I should add £400 is my mental limit, I have around £270 saved currently.
Does price really matter?
I mean everyone already know which console they will buy, either it's Day1 or not.
XsX being 50/100usd cheaper doesnt change what people want to buy ..
Im hoping for 600.to 700 $AUD. If it's any more than $600 for the digital edition i will hold off until a price drop. Maybe. Or at least a deal that includes some decent games and another controller. I.hope the price is announced soon. Come on M$ and Sony. November is not far away.
I really hope that rumour about 4k game problems is a load of old nonsense, cos that would be quite bad for a true next gen console.
I don't care price, I care fun. If there are "must play" games, than it is no problem to buy new machine. Actually... in era of ps3 a lot of games were similar, but huge fun. ps4 era is more and more confusing for me. AC series is ruined, God of War is huge step back and only thing that work is remasters, because new games are just totally same. third person, rpg, open world, crafting. ctrl C, ctrl V rename... Maybe I just accidentally bought similar games, maybe it is true, but the fact is I rather buy remake, than new title... pitty
@gmxs Native 4K is a waste of resources, as we're beginning to see with these reconstruction techniques that are basically imperceptible in some cases.
Also, we saw lots of PS5 gameplay at the recent reveal event and a lot of it was native 4K...
@S1ayeR74 £449
@get2sammyb Constant recording of gameplay is waste of resources, not native 4K.
Been saving all year and I've put aside €700.00 for the console and a game or two. I've been expecting the console to cost €500.00 to €550.00 all along.
@get2sammyb Agreed. Was just about to add, aren't people finally starting to see 4K as a waste of resources when very similar results can be reached with up-scaling trickery? Why waste funds on some extra power when it can be done another way?
@NeutronBomb For what??? PS5, PS5 Digital, Series X? Also 600 dollars plus taxes would push towards the £500 and over mark.
$500 for the disc-based PS5 would be the sweet spot for me. I don't give two craps if the thing can run games at native 4K. All I care is whether or not the first-party exclusives will come with a 1080p/60fps mode and if they're high quality games.
@djlard Not for me it isn't, would rather have that then 4k which millions of people won't have the TV to support that.
There was a discussion yesterday too with Digital Foundry and 'price'. Admittedly the conversation was more centred around Xbox (the delay to Halo and imminent Series S) but the topic of pricing came up and the very real prospect that these consoles could be closer to $600.
Of course it really does depend on how much of a hit these companies wish to take but the specs inside are not cheap. Of course they could take a big hit and rely on other avenues to offset that cost. it seems that both MS and Sony are waiting for each other to make a move and I don't think its down to profit margins, more likely down to how much of a loss either is willing to take. Who ever breaks first, the other can at the very least match it or decide to take a slightly bigger hit to be cheaper but you don't want to take a much bigger hit - ie lose $100 per unit when the competition will price theirs first at a $30 loss.
Personally, I don't think a console built to sell comfortably at '$400' - also considering all the links in the chain that will want to make some money - not just the cost of parts, would cut it for a 'next' gen leap to last 5-7yrs. Compromises would be necessary somewhere and as such, wouldn't be much more powerful than the Pro or X. I doubt Sony would have invested so much in the SSD and its 'speed' advantages for example - but raise the build a console to sell at $600, that extra $200 can make a big difference in specs.
However, building a console to sell at $600 today will drop in manufacturing costs over time and with numerous other areas of income generated by the console market, they could sell at say $500 and recoup any loses over the long term. At some point, the cost to make these consoles will drop and eventually become profitable to sell at $500 so they could keep the price 'longer' too - not drop off so quick.
Native 4k is as @get2sammyb states, a waste of resources. Sony's implementation of CB rendering, especially those that use the hardware to great effect, deliver fantastic '4k' like images - case in point H:ZD and God of War. Of course, some game engines are not so good as RDR2 showed. Couple that with DLSS type reconstruction, Mesh shading, VRS (the last two effectively reduce the quality of polygons or parts of an image that don't need the 'highest' quality) etc, all of these will help deliver much better performance with minimal impact to Image Quality and the actual Native resolution (or what size image is being rendered by frame) becomes less and less important.
Of course, VRS and Mesh Shading for example are essentially reducing the quality of specific objects or areas of the screen and will help offer higher native resolution and/or frame rates - because the GPU doesn't need to spend so long processing those parts. Its another example of more efficient use of the hardware to achieve better results than would be possible otherwise.
It seems that the money Sony has invested on exclusives, Microsoft has been investing it on insiders
I've put £600 away for a PS5, anything less is a bonus. I have a 4K TV but honestly native 4K is a waste for gaming. A crisp 1080p with excellent RT/HDR implementation is fine by me.
Its a epidemic they should lower the price because its gonna sale anyways we all finna be in quarantine again MY KID ISNT GOING BACK TO SCHOOL !
@Chimhog Some devs may well find the PS5 easy to develop for - especially from scratch. But porting over a game built on PC woth a certain API in mind for a multi-platform game may well be quite difficult.
With so many new features and changes to the way these consoles are built, you have to make sure that the 'engine' works with the hardware. Sound for example may well be coded to run on CPU but now they have to make sure that gets sent to the Audio section and 'works' as expected. Getting to grips with the geometry engine etc.
I knew it, totally saw this coming. They'll charge the highest price they can at launch, catch all the diehards and deal with a backlash after everyone complains and they don't sell many consoles. Then reduce the price with a big release and come over like the heroes.
It has become a common trend in the industry where publishers price high then just go on sale with a price that a game should have been in the beginning. Capcom were guilty of this with many of their switch releases. It's a win-win for them, especially with digital releases of older games. Now they will try it on with a console release. Price high and slowly lower the price until it hits a sweet spot.
Surely now Halo has been delayed Sony will think “Hang on....why do we need to low ball the price?”
So...I expect £499 for the digital and £549 For the disc version in the UK
I dont care, just tell me how much and when i can pre order. Ill skip the new xbox for a while so even if the ps5 ia a bit expensive it wont matter much.
Digital Foundty was going on about the price too. Its possible. However I dont take seriously someone who talk about 'fake 4k'.
Edit
The ps5 'struggling' to do 1080p 60fps 'story' was debunked though.
@Milt
The fact that this DuskG 'insider' only mentions the PS5 as one sku is suspect.
@manux59 Thats statement will make any company happy.
@TheAdza Yep,between the current exchange rate & usual "aussie tax",I'm even fearing anything up to $750AU or so for the disc version.
@BAMozzy Yes I am guessing arond the $600 mark £550 here in U.K.
@rachetmarvel i know right , but at some point let be real..
We will buy it , and i'm pretty sure people know if they will take ps5 or XsX , i think it'e just a question of time Day1/christmas/etc.. people will buy it , because even for 500€/£/$ you've got a great console for 5/6/7 years i think we can all agree this will be paid for itself
So PS5, a console marked as 8K ( I know I know, that probably only for streaming and movies, but it still say so)console on Sonys PS5 site, will not be able to do 4K ?! LOL. Digital Foundry is sooo bought by M$ if they actually said that.
Ofc it will do 4K, but still, it's up to the developer. You could do Tetris in 32K on a PS4 but that wouldn't work so good for AAA-titles like Ghost of Tsushima or Last Of Us Part II hehe
My guess is 499-549€ for the PS5 with the 4K drive.
About 50€ less for the discless.
@Chimhog there have been lots.
To be fair, when you see the DualSense and compare with the 'new" xbox controller it's obvious which one looks expensive and which one looks cheap.
@Constable_What Did they say demon souls will be available at launch?
@Zeke68 if it's 50€ people won't get the digital editon , an 50€ difference is nnot a enough gap imo.
i think they had to make it 75 or 100 cheaper if they really want to give poeple a choice
499€ (same price they use for the 1st PS4) for the complete and 399€ the Digital imo , and i'm thinking of XsX @449€
@Spoonman-2 if they priced it at that level it would flop. The PS3 flopped in the U.K. in the beginning due to its price and it was cheaper then that at £425, not in a pandemic or the biggest recession the U.K. has ever had as a result. The PS3 only became a success when they dropped its price.
I don't really care about the price. I care about 4K even less.
The first-party games are the reason I'm buying it.
Consider that demo Epic showed. Speaking even as a non graphics whore, if a game looks that good, do you really care if it's "true" 4K or not?
@Chimhog oh there is still much more info to come for sure!
I think what we see here is Sony and MS trying to time their information reveals for maximum “impact”. Thing is though they’re running out of time 🤣
@Chimhog Its getting on my nerves - not only do we have far too much speculation with very little actual facts and people from both sides using a lot of BS to make out their 'choice' will be the 'best' choice and the other is 'terrible'.
It doesn't matter who you are a Fan of, until the facts are out, what the 'specs' actually translate too over a period of time on actual games that can be compared (ie those on both systems) because they have the same ambition, game-play, aesthetics, engine and devs etc, its pointless to think that because dev team A is 'struggling to get game 'X' to run at 'Y' specs on a brand new console, that's indicative of 'every' dev team, every game etc.
Wait until the games start releasing, when you can actually get your hands on these monsters and actual 'facts' can be ascertained.
Personally, I would forego a Native 4k if the devs can use Temporal Reconstruction or Machine Learned upscaling and any other 'tools' to increase the performance and overall visual quality. By reducing the 'native' pixel count, they can increase other aspects - lighting quality, shadows, level of detail etc without having to reduce the frame rate.
Being able to do 4k/60 (albeit with compromises to other things) and using ALL your resources to hit that metric is not necessarily the 'best' option. I don't care if Series X has a 'higher' resolution metric either if that difference is pretty much indistinguishable or actually 'worse' than doing a CB rendered 4k with overall higher visual settings because they aren't wasting resources pushing out native pixel counts.
If you are gonna buy a PS5 or Series X regardless, does it matter what the 'other' side does? All that matters is that 'your' choice delivers the experiences you want at a 'reasonable' price.
I don’t really care about the power difference, PS has more of the games I want. If they’ve managed to make a less powerful console cost more than it’s main rival however, that could be an issue in the grand scheme of things.
Think they have to announce price in next couple of weeks now, it's nearly September so that would only be a few months from launch, especially at this time people need to know how much it's going to cost so they can save a bit towards it. I'm lucky I have enough savings at the moment so I just want to know how much. Price is obvs still important as well as games so I need info. It's getting really stupid now getting on my nerves lol. Early this year I was defo getting it day one, but all this silence I'm on the fence at the moment due to lack of info, think a lot of ppl getting tired of this stale mate between ms and sony now.
Don't forget MS is doing that upgrade program and also allowing people the make monthly payments on their new console like how you can do with a cellphone.
I'll be getting both however most likely will be holding off on day 1 ps5 since most everything I do is on the xbox
@PupTwilight I don't think so, but I'm hoping it is. If not I will probably wait until that's out to be honest.
And I remember a couple months ago, I upset people when I asserted that the PS5 would be priced similarly to the PS3.
The only thing that would convince me to jump to next gen would be a cheap Xbox Series S. And let's be honest, if you're going to pay for a sub 4k device, it might as well be a reasonably priced one that is actually meant to be sub 4k.
@Paranoimia well most games at launch will not look like Epics UE5 demo most likely since it has not been out that long.
Also hopefully they didn't just add all their resources into making a beautiful world and a fudge up looking character model like in the demo
@JJ2 it was, not that it’ll matter to the Xbox fanboys trying to use it as an example of their plastic box being “better”.
@S1ayeR74 there is no chance its £400 mate. If its $500 its £500 so you might wanna get an extra 100 from somewhere
I will wait for the facts. I expect these consoles to be expensive at launch becase a) next gen and b) really are pretty packed with tech. I really don't think native 4k as opposed to upscaled 4k is going to make a huge sales difference. Plus, I have no doubt that devs will struggle at the start of this gen with cross platform games. It remains to be seen if it is as stark as the PS3 from 360.
It's kind of weird after microsoft fails suddenly there's a fresh batch of concerning ps5 rumors lol.
@MarcG420
Yes there s a lot going on behind the scene I believe and these companies are manipulative.
I think that Spencer sees the price as a very important point of next gen and it may have even influenced his decision to delay Halo among other things, and step back, like Sony promoting third party taking full advantage of next gen and therefore looking way more impressive than Halo.
That's why Ray Tracing is a must have to sort of distract from cross gen graphics. I know I'm thinking perhaps too much but I think there are lots of influences we dont know.
I just want Xbox to reveal the price first so there s a chance PS5 price goes down.
@wiiware what exactly are you calling fails in your opinion
@Gilvin rumours sugests that some youtubers has received (or will receive) a MS console with a tag to open only after november 6th. Maybe that could be the case of some insiders creating those type of rumours against PS5?
@JJ2 as someone who is definitely buying a ps5 and not a series x I want MS to reveal their price first too so I can save a few bucks 🤣
@Jacko11 you do realise $500 does not equal £500 right? And at £500 it would be an instant flop and I certainly won’t pay that much for it.
@JJ2 what third party taking advantage? You mean the third party making a exclusive?
A normal multi-platform game normally doesn't take a full advantage of the console and try to keep it even on both platforms if they can easily.
If you are speaking of a exclusive made by a third party then of course they are going to take advantage of a console resources since that company paid a lot of money to either have the game made or to buy the rights to only have it on their platform
@thefirst oh I won’t be, there’s a small EB Games near me that won’t have many preorders so I’ll be going there to ensure I get my day one console 😁
@Chimhog not all the exclusives Sony announced are launch titles and most were 2021 and 2022 with a few that had no dates. Also a few others are just time released exclusives that's been mentioned just like on Xbox side and some are slated for PC release to but those don't have dates as to when
@S1ayeR74 yes I am aware of the general conversion rate but if you look at past console conversion prices. We in the UK never get the proper conversion, we get shafted every generation.
With Sony’s confidence from PS4 and taking into account price of r+d, the console is going to be priced much closer to £500 than £400.
No matter what, you’ll need to save more than £400.
@Zeke68 They didn't say that at all. What they said is that maybe they will need to do 'fake 4k' to get the higher frame rates or when using Ray Tracing etc. There could be cases of a game running at 4k/60 on series X and devs opting to use some 'fake' 4k because at 'native' its not as stable - they didn't say that will happen and that will be the case across the board - just that it 'could' happen. Just like it could happen that DRS is used on one but not the other too (so doesn't run consistently at 4k).
There is nothing wrong with 'Fake 4k' and a better use of 'limited' resources. Obviously compared to current gen hardware, these are not as limited as those but you still have a fixed max amount of resources to process and render a frame in such a 'small' amount of time. If you are using a LOT of resources just because the image is much larger, 8.3m pixels that all need an equal amount of time to process, that's not necessarily the 'best' use of those resources and make it very difficult to do that all in 16.666ms (60fps) but half the amount of pixels rendered in a frame and pull pixels from the frame before to build a 4k image uses a lot less resources and could be the difference between a 30fps or 60fps game. Also if you factor in RT as well, could be the difference between using RT or not - which may end up meaning Native looks worse...
Its not like the start of this gen when you had no choice but Native resolution and relying on regular upscaling to fill the space (other wise you would be playing with black bars around the edge). 720-900p upscaled was much softer - but also starting from 'larger' pixels and much fewer too. 1800p (the same equivalent reduction in size as 900p from 1080p) when upscaled is not as soft because it has many more and much smaller pixels so any 'softening' is greatly reduced.
In numerous examples, DLSS 2.0 actually looks better than 4K - especially at 1440p - better than CB 4k too. Games like HZD and GoW also show that CB4k can look 'almost' 4k - but you do have to get close to the screen and/or really look for the tell-tale signs.
Personally, I am happy for devs to utilise Fake 4k to improve the overall game experience. I doubt that either console would struggle with 4k on many last gen games - assuming all they do is increase the output resolution. Of course boosting the frame rate significantly and/or adding improved visual tweaks may make it difficult to be a Native 4k game. To me, its more important that they get the balance right, make the right choice rather than focus on resolution as a metric. Of course, if their game does run with all the visual bells and whistles at a locked and decent frame rate, great but if dropping the resolution and implementing a 'fake' 4k improves that experience, I would rather they go that route
@PupTwilight
Let's say, for instance, it's just an example, next battlefield is not cross gen but only on next gen. That game would take full advantage of the next gen consoles even if the deal is purely marketing or the usual timed dlc.
I already put 500 in the price bracket of the disc version and 400 for the digital but who knows with these things, but i would rather think higher than lower.
@Kefka2589 facts facts facts! I was surprised to see Digital Foundry saying $600 UPWARDS!! The only reason MS are releasing 2 spec consoles is because the XSX is going to be very expensive. There is no way XSS will be say $250, I'm thinking more $300/350. Which leaves us with PS5. I feel like with PS4 launching at $399, PS5 will launch at $450/499 for digital and disc. If this is the case, for a machine that will go blow to blow with the XSX, why get an XSS? Even sadder, why get an XSX, unless you love MS or Sony screw up the pricing, its looking finito for Xbox
@Jacko11 No I just won’t buy it, simple facts mate, and again it will instantly flop if they charge that much, put it this way, £500 for the console, £65 for a game (because more devs are talking about $70 game prices), or the Series X or even S at what ever price plus tons of brand new game release for £11 a month.... with no contract.
" I've heard from other developers that PS5 struggles with 4K games in particular so you'll see a lot of fake 4K"
I don't have a problem per say with them using fake 4K however! If the same game on Series X is getting real 4k then that's a problem. It would mean the PS5 would be used for exclusives and the Xbox for multiplatform games as that is where they will look and maybe run better.
@BAMozzy this fake 4k discussion is really intriguing. As we could see from digital foundry, DLSS 2.0 is better in most aspects than checkerboard rendering, even though IMO the latter is very very good. Apparently, PlayStation have something cooked up for the PS5 but is it a form of DLSS or is it an improved checkerboarding technique? I am really, really excited to find out
@S1ayeR74 £500 is more than acceptable for the tech you will be getting..lets see you build a full on gaming pc with the same or similar spec for £500 or less..i tell you now it aint going to happen.i expect it to be around £500 and if it turns out to be a bit more..you know i'm still going to have one..
Honestly, I don't care who prices what at what amount. While that is a concern, it isn't as big of one as this:
Are we going to see another Mid-Generation "upgrade?"
it's interesting some "coincidences" happening these days. Always after a bad situation for xbox (halo delay for example), "rumours" about something bad on ps5 immediately pops up from "insiders".
Curious, isn't?
@BAMozzy It will matter to Sony for people that will own both machines. If you do own both consoles (plenty of people will) and Series X will give you native 4K and maybe slightly higher fps compare to PS5 who would buy the Playstation version of said game?
I don't know about you but I really don't want the PS5 to just be an exclusive box just like the PS3 was.
My biggest concern is if i dont buy one at launch, will the price be hiked from January if the UK doesnt agree an Free Trade Deal with the EU - or will any PS5/electronics tarrifs apply only to any deal that the UK has with Japan/USA. I don't want to sit on it and then find i have to pay more in January due to added tax. We are in a tricky spot at the mo.
That might genuinely be the push i need to buy a PS5 this year.
If they struggle to get it running on a ps5, how are they going to manage on a xbox series S? The market needs to cater to pc owners too so will we see xbox series x runs at native 4k, ps5 checkerboard and series S at 1080p and no Ray tracing? Microsoft have a whole separate tier of sku to support
@Chimhog 8k is totally possible - even Native 8k - it really does depend on the game and how graphically intense it is. For example a game like Fifa 17 runs at Native 4k/60 on a PS4 Pro but other games struggle to run at a native 1440p/30. I can imagine numerous Indies easily running at a native 8k but I doubt you would see Horizon 2 running at a Native 8k - even at 30fps but again could use Temporal Reconstruction or Machine Learned Super Sampling to create an '8k' image.
@theMEGAniggle Sony built in object tracking to Pro's GPU to improve the CB rendering. By tracking objects, it can use that to ensure a better alignment of frames to construct a 4k image. I think that's why you see the 'best' use of CB rendering on Sony's system. Game Engines can be built to use temporal reconstruction from previous frames but as RDR2 shows, it doesn't always impress.
They filed a patent for a form of Machine Learning but not sure if its the same as DLSS. DLSS is of course nVidias tech and naming which rely on Tensor cores and its own neural network but as both next gen consoles are using AMD's tech, they have to either use AMD's options or create your own 'version'. MS obviously have Direct X so will be using DXML, DXRT etc so Sony either have to develop their own or use what AMD offer. Sony will no doubt use Vulcan API too but they may also develop their own.
This is why the APU's are very 'custom' and not off the shelf designs just 'bundled' into one APU. Sony will design their APU with features they want, features they designed etc. Their 'Audio' processing component for example could well be very different from MS's, designed a different way with different processors because Sony designed the way they want 'Audio' to be processed.
We will have to see what they have in store though rather than speculate on what it may or may not do. Sony seem to have their own version of Mesh Shading too in their Geometry engine but again we don't really know how it compares, whether its doing the same thing 'better or worse' etc.
It just leads to speculation and misinformation spreading around. Take the fact that MS didn't talk about too much about its separate audio processing in the APU, people speculated it didn't have that and so the CPU was actually 'worse' because it had to process audio. Even though it does have a separate Audio processor built in, we don't really know if its as good as Sony's and it seems Sony has an advantage their, we still have to wait to see if any game really has an audible difference to be able to say yes its an 'advantage/disadvantage' to either console.
Its clear that Sony's Triggers may have a much more complex Haptic Feedback compared to MS's rumble triggers that vary in intensity according to what's happening on screen, but whether or not that really adds anything, we will have to see. Obviously it can add tension to the triggers but whether that's 'enough' to warrant buying a game on Sony's PS5 over buying it on Series X, we don't really know until we can actually play those games ourselves and assess. It may also have a bigger impact on some over others.
they did all this made-up nonsense with the last generation wait for Sony.
For demons souls I'll pay anything!
Lmfao! Yeah, I doubt Sony is gonna do “fake 4K”. If that’s the case then it’s just a better PS4 Pro. 😂 Also highly doubt the development issues with RE Village on PS5. I’m waiting until spring of next year to get one anyways so I’m not that bothered about the price right now.
These comments by so called 'insiders' are a bunch of nonsense, what is even meant by exotic? The PS5 doesn't ask you to do anything special to optimise your game, it doesn't have a weird split-RAM arrangement or a GPU that's hard to fill with jobs to do, or an SSD that's kind of but maybe not quite fast enough. It doesn't ask you to handle compression or the complexities of audio. It's pretty-much go out of the box and builds upon the much loved API of the PS4.
I also never understand what people mean by 'struggles' with 4K. A Geforce 2080Ti struggles with 4k on max settings, it's an arbitrary thing, you can keep turning the graphics detail up, if it gets too slow you have to lower your resolution, the extra theoretical 2TF of the Xbox Series X isn't going to magically allow it to play 4k games at maximum detail, it's going to have to draw a balance somewhere and we have no idea what that balance is, if you go with Halo as your guiding light it's all resolution no detail, which in my eyes is worse.
@Juanalf I intend to buy both myself. The point is that if for example, Sony cannot offer a Native 4k/60 compared to the Series X in a specific title, dropping the resolution to keep a stable 60fps is much better, than keeping it 'Native' 4k for the sake of parity in that specific metric.
Its much better for devs to drop the resolution to keep the frame rate the same. CB rendering creates a much better image quality than the equivalent rendering budget can do natively. That's like the difference between ~1600p + upscaling or CB4k and given the choice, I would rather have CB4k than native 1600p. CB4k will be much closer visually to native 4k when sat on your couch.
It may also free up resources to allow the devs to tweak visual settings higher than 'native' 4k allowed on the Series X. IF the devs have to turn down some visual features to run at a consistent 60fps, they could opt to use CB4k and have headroom to turn up some visual features on the PS5. It might have some tell-tale signs of CB rendering when you get close to the screen and analyse it but from a normal viewing distance, it could look 'better' overall and still run at the same frame rate.
In that example, I would rather take the PS5 version because overall, it looks better, plays just as smoothly but technically, its running at a lower resolution. I would take DLSS 2.0 1080p, RT and other visual bells and whistles over a Native 4k with no RT and lower visual settings overall. I know which would look better despite running at a much lower resolution.
To me, there are more important factors and why I don't think one will necessarily become an 'Exclusive' box or have to 'make do' with a lower res, poorer visual quality and/or more frame rate issues. Technically, one could have a 'higher' native resolution but not necessarily the best overall visual presentation or performance as a result. May not offer the 'best' experience overall.
I don't think resolution will be the same as it was at the start of this gen. There has been a LOT of developments over the course of last gen to get more and more visual quality without compromising on frame rate. HZD could NOT run at Native 4k and 30fps on a PS4 Pro - not to the same visual quality and opting for CB4k was a much better choice than reducing the 'native' resolution down to run at 30fps. GTSport runs at CB1800p and that looks much better than upscaling from an equivalent native resolution. Because of this, as well as the fact that the pixels are much smaller and upscaling has less impact, Native resolution is less important. As I said, there could be an overall 'better' experience and overall visual quality on the platform with the 'lowest' amount of pixels being rendered by frame.
@BAMozzy I also question what detail Xbox games drop to be able to claim 4K, it's not like an extra 2TF is magically going to allow it to play 4K games at max settings.
Great to see BAMozzy in the comments.
@Northern_munkey No it’s not, or to me and most definitely not to all those parents who’s kids will be asking for one at Christmas. £500 is overpriced no matter how you look at it, it’s economy of scales they buy components in the millions, of Sony are incapable of designing a machine to be cheaper then that’s on them. I’m not fussed as I stated I will buy the cheapest one that’s the best value. Hell that might even be the Series S.
@S1ayeR74
Good point, but I see them eyeing a very nice profit at MS’s expense... although I hope the disc version is £399/$399 🤞🏼
@JesWood13 I think you are going to be disappointed then and the PS5 will just be a better PS4 Pro - just with its own software. Rendering Native 4k is not the 'best' use of the resources and very costly. Its better to drop the resolution, use 'fake 4k' and push the GPU to improve the overall visual quality and/or frame rate.
@GMScribe you have to remember that games differ and as such, the resources required to render a frame at whatever resolution, with what ever settings etc will vary a LOT.
You also have to consider that 2TF, which is more than a base Playstation has that runs a LOT of games at a native 1080p, is 2TF of RDNA2 which is a lot more efficient and achieves a LOT more per TF than the current gen does. As a percentage, its not that big of a gap as say PS4 Pro GPU to XB1X GPU, but its still quite a big difference if you also look at the amount of Cores and therefore shaders it has - even if they are not 'processing' as fast as the PS5. You have nearly a 3rd less Shaders in the PS5 and each shader can handle 2 instructions per cycle - meaning the Xbox can cope with far more instructions at once - however, with the PS5, it handles those instructions a bit quicker but 'every' second, the Xbox can theoretically do 12.1 'trillion' floating point operations per second compared to (up to) 10.28 Trillion per second on a PS5. Obviously games run at 30 frames per second at the least so you divide those numbers by 30 for example and that's how many floating point operations each can theoretically do per frame.
What that could mean is that under a 'specific' set of conditions, you could see a game release that delivers a 'reasonable' visual quality at native 4k and a consistent 60fps on Series X but with the exact same settings on PS5, it can't quite deliver Native 4k at the same consistency. Therefore a Dev 'could' opt to use DRS to drop the resolution to make the frame rate consistent or implement a CB 4k for example and use any 'extra' overheads they have now freed up to boost some graphical settings over the Series X version - maybe have better Shadow quality, better LoDs etc because they have more 'overhead'
Of course I don't expect a Series X to run a brand new, graphically intensive game at a native 4k with ultra settings at 60fps and with full Ray Tracing too - that's totally unrealistic but Ultra settings too are NOT always the best use of Resources. Its often better to settle for high and get better performance.
Of course there will be games on BOTH systems that can and will run at native 4k and some games no doubt that will make a point of running natively at 4k but whether its the 'best' use of those resources or not, I don't know. We all know how great HZD or GoW looked - easily as good (if not better) than many 'native' 4k games. Being able to hit 4k doesn't mean its the right or best choice. It could be the difference between 30 or 60fps, the difference between having RT or not, the difference between 'medium' visual settings and high/ultra settings.
@S1ayeR74
I'm not worried about the power, the only thing that makes me want a new system is the ultra fast SSD and bandwidth.
I want instantly loading games like with the old cartridges.
I honestly believe Sony is going to sell the PS4 at $400/$450 which is roughly the manufacturing cost. I believe this to be the case simply because Sony knows what happened the last time one of their consoles had a starting price of $500 & given the fact the PS5 is slightly less power than XSX it wouldn't surprise me to see Sony sell the console at ($400/$450) a small loss. They will recoup those costs with the sales of PS PLUS subscriptions along with their many, many first party titles. I've also read elsewhere that Sony plans to add extra compute units to the PS5 GPU as well as increase clock speeds on the production consoles to help mitigate the slight power difference between XSX and PS5. At the end of the day I care about the games, obviously I'd like them to run at 4K on my PS5 but honestly if it's slightly less than that it's NOT a bug deal to me. My PS4 pro graphics blows my mind with the games that have been optimized for the PS4 pro so I have NO doubt Sony has created another masterpiece of a console that's capable of hitting 4K resolutions at 60FPS. I'm looking forward to seeing my PS5 in action! unlike previous generations where I've owned ALL the consoles I'm going to be skipping the XSX. I've been a PlayStation fanboy well over 20 years now but I've also enjoyed many Xbox games because I'm a gamer who loves games lol. I'm skipping the XSX because there's nothing that's MUST PLAY for me anymore. After Halo 5 and gears of war 5 I sold my xbone & haven't looked back since. Wow this post is longer than intended lol happy gaming 😉💨✌️
Or you could, you know, wait until a real announcement is made and cut the asinine speculation from someyimes dumb sources. Sony made a mint and if they want to invest in the future, then surely £450 hete in England, just for example, should be fine considering how much they will earn back from the first party devs they are heavily invested in and seem to have historically printed money for Sony. It seems to be Sony won't have any issues with price and especially won't after a 'slim' revision comes about a couple years after. I don't exactly know where this bs cam about that Sony will be the only one that's more expensive at face value, especially when xbox seem to have more riding on Hardware and not much else.
Regardless, the person behind the RE Village comment was quick to rectify their claims and state that it is more of an early issue with getting things working, and tbh the dev keynote went into a lot of detail as to how there's more GPU headroom and an architecture easier to develop for which seems contrary to this fanboy "news" fodder paraded around as fact. The simple fact is a 15% difference isn't much and doesn't account for potential performance bottlenecks. Back to the point: we actually saw RE 3 remake run better on playstation
with xbox having technical issues to do with frames off the bat with more horsepower vs ps4 pro.
With all this said, no TF should be taken as an absolute indication of performance and especially should not be compared since, for example, one ps4 TF would logically be less efficient and less powerful than a PS5. So, between both consoles having custom architecture and requirements tailored to squeeze every last performance from that configuration, the TF buzzword is simply fanboy gymanstics irrispective of how tech horsepower actually works- because the fact is most consoles owners/ fanboys have no clue, yet they lover convenient marketing that doesn't show the full picture (pun intended).
The truth is we will likley see little difference and the reality settling in thay both systems have different ways if reaching a similar goal. However, we will obviously know more with a direct performance test and with teardowns. On a related note: I see these irate and downright impatient people think that the really need to chill. I mean, I see people paying upwards of a grand for phones these days...so, who really cares?
Lastly If, If the platform is good and offers the best games (or simply games people csre about and value) then an investment proposition for 7 years is not to bad. To no finer point, in spite of the OG ps3 price, it still manged to go down as a memorable and successful system according to sales with good games and smart marketing- I also strongly belive the multiple revisions and game bundles helped massively.
Disc-Drive version: £449.99/€499.99/$499.99
Digital-only version: £349.99/€399.99/$399.99
Biggest cost over lifespan of the console will be PS5 games/titles. They will be approx £59.99/€69.99/$69.99.
That get expensive fast/where costs will build up and where Sony will most likely recoup their costs/make a lot of profit.
Provided I can get one (pre-orders don't sell out straight away) I will getting one on launch (disk-drive version as have many PS4 physical titles).
Compared to a similar specced PC (which is always best platform in my opinion) the PS5 is good value. Similarly specced PC would be like £1500, around 3 times the price, albeit with cheaper titles.
@S1ayeR74 good for you..stick to your guns..i stand by what i say and i personally think that £500 is very reasonable indeed and that appears to be the oppinion of most people on here and i say most not everybody just in case anybody misunderstands..(we are still allowed to form our own oppinions yes?)
@jpsmith881 this..thanks
@Old-Red
This has been the strategy for... Well.. almost all products. Not just video games.
@Northern_munkey You can form what ever opinion you want, it won’t change the fact a console priced at £500 will be a sales flop. Sure they’ll shift some to begin with, but once all the hardcore gamers have them it’ll slow to a trickle of sales, in he current environment kids and casual gamers will not be spending that much on a new toy.
@Angeljuice I hear that, plug the cart in turn it on instantly into the game load screen.
Would rather have 1080p or 1440p with 60fps tbh
@S1ayeR74 ok you win
@Spoonman-2 Hopefully, then £300 or £350 for the digital model.
If the PS5 released during the holiday season, I'm sure they''ll probably have a Black Friday deal, even during this pandemic that's happening.
yea, i don't believe any of the "claims" made by this grubb guy. he is in the dark just like everyone else so no point in getting emotional until we see for ourselves. i think series x and ps5 will launch at the same price and i believe both consoles will be powerful, each with their own unique caveats and advantages. if series x is slightly "more powerful" but has longer load times compared to ps5, i would prefer the shorter load times personally. now, if ps5 stuggles to maintain native 4k/30, then that is a problem to be concerned about but nobody knows a darn thing at this point and won't know for a few years after the consoles launch.
The price of console will win or lose this generation. Which ever console comes out more expensive will struggle a lot.
@PupTwilight Their "gameplay" event x2, halo is graphics is a mess, halo not ready for xbox x launch, no forza games at launch, there's no 1st party exclusives at xbox x launch, it's like they're not ready for the next-gen this fall, which is weird.
@S1ayeR74 you’re honestly the first person I’ve spoke to that thinks it’ll be less than £500, or at least £450 for digital.
I think people are more than prepared to drop £500 on this because they are aware of the capabilities of these new consoles. And it’s laughable that you think the PS5 will be a sales flop because of that price. And I would be happy to revisit this conversation at the end of this month when the price is revealed at the next showcase (should it not be moved from the currently rumoured)
It has become increasingly more likely that the Xbox will be the sales flop with the loss of GamePass. Why would you pay close to £500 for a console with no new system seller games? When you can play those same games on your current console and only spend a tenner?
Again, we shall revisit in time.
It looks to me both companies want to avoid the bad press of announcing their price first. Both are going to be too expensive, it it will be easier to announce you’re the same price as the other guy after everyone has had their melt down.
@Constable_What Demons souls is NOT coming out anytime soon...
@Medic_Alert To be fair a lot of rumours have previously been consistent in claiming the Series X will cost less then the PS5. So you’d save even more money by getting one, if it’s true.
@Jacko11 It’s actually a fact it will be a sales flop at £500, in case it’s escaped your notice, thousands are losing their jobs weekly at the moment, the economy has tanked, their is NO money around, and you think people have £500 to spend on a games console instead of food and keeping their homes etc.. and even if their was none of this it will still flop at £500, that’s way over what most people would accept to pay, you need to think outside the hardcore fan box, think casual gamer.. I bet it doesn’t cost anywhere near £500.
It’s great you have the cash to burn, millions of others don’t and Sony has to sell lots of consoles to keep the PlayStation brand alive. They need to generate profits for returns on share holders investments.
I honestly think this console power mess is highly over exaggerated. I don't understand why they continue to push this narrative how powerful the xbox is and or how under powered the PlayStation is. I honestly think the games will prove the outlier in all of this. Look at the PS4 Pro and the Xbox X. The X was more powerful than the pro and yet the pro had a better game catalog. So at the end of the day it will come down to games and I think Sony delivers time and time again. Xbox has continued to lack in this fight and will continue to do so until it changes the narrative. Games will will the console war no matter what. The power of the consoles will do nothing just like this gen. The games will show us which console to get and my money is on Sony because they have showed us time and time again that they can deliver.
@Andyhunter132 Eh. I'm gonna wait and see. So far Sony has been fairly tight lipped on their launch titles.
Sony have indicated they hope to sell over 100 million PS5 units in the next 5 years, and that's why I don't think it will release at $600.
For a lot of dedicated hardcore gamers that price would be ok, but it's not a mass market price by any standard, and most purchases are by parents buying little Billy and Jane a new console to play Fortnite on, and 600 would be just too big a pill to swallow for that 100 million to be achieved.
I'm going to say 499 for disc and 425 for digital, with Sony taking a slight hit on the digital edition to be recouped in software sales.
And as for the PS5 struggling to push 4k, I'm hoping that's because developers are trying to achieve 60fps, if it is, give me 1440p, that's more than enough resolution, 2160p is such a massive waste of resources at the cost of frame rates and graphical effects.
@S1ayeR74 I totally agree 100%, they want to sell over 100 million units in 5 years, if they break the £500 barrier, they will have a PS3 scenario all over.
£450 disc, £385 digital, that's my prediction, I think the digital will sell at a greater loss to be recouped in digital software sales.
Being Canadian, I am already screwed when the system comes out price wise. But I am in no rush until a different color scheme comes out as it is.
@Paranoimia
Exactly.
In my opinion I'd rather see devs focus resources on implementing HDR in more compelling ways, rather than focus on running in "true" 4K.
@Medic_Alert
That's only assuming you just want to play those games.
Edit
And you dont even need to upgrade for it as of now.
@GMScribe
I ve read a post where this guy DuskGolem admitted he said what he said because he thought things were 'too one sided' at the moment. Imagine that. Too much positivity for PS5 so hey, let's push some FUD basically.
🤯
PS universe has amazing games and PS5 will be a powerful console despite all commentaries. Nothing will change my mind to purchase the console. 4k native or upscaled, who cares, even on PS4 the latest games looks gorgeous so I believe that on PS5 will be more better. The specs are strong enough for native 4k in my opinion. Time will tell. I think the price would be around 550€ for disc version, but I do not care and I can't wait to pre-order it.
@Medic_Alert
I based my comment on you saying youd only have to buy the console.
Now your saying not really. I mean it's fine. I was just trying to make sense. I dont care arguing about promoting a console. ✋
Edit
And again you dont need to buy a new console to 'enjoy' gamepass as of now
If it's over £500 or $500 then all SONY's hard work so far getting people wanting to buy it DAY 1 will just die in a second :-/ Saying that the new Xbox must cost a lot to??? No one seems to be talking about that(well maybe no one cares about it I guess)
@Medic_Alert
Ok ok
I just mean I was replying to you saying 'So you will only have to buy the console.' That is what you said.
Now your saying something else that I'm not really interested debating?
No big deal.
That's all. Yes it's great and all lovely if you want 😀
@S1ayeR74 The PS3 wasn't cheaper than that. £425 when the PS3 launched is the same as £620 now. The value of money is not fixed, each pound is worth less one year than it was the last.
These rumours read like Microsoft propaganda tbh. Still can’t believe neither company has released price info! It’s just a massive game of chicken.
PlayStation has a better SSD, Xbox has better graphics chip. what cost more "Graphics Chip". Xbox has to cost more to build!
Until units start shipping to retail stores Sony or Microsoft do not need to nail down a price.
I've managed to save around £3K by no longer commuting into Central London by train anymore and working from home, so some of that will go towards PS5.
Hoping the bluray drive based console won't be above £450... £500 would be my limit.
@JohnKarnes No it’s the entire system you need to look at, it’s design the way it’s put together the components the R&D etc etc. Look at Microsoft’s design, it’s a box, they’ve been clever in the packaging of the components but it’ll be more expensive to make a two board design. Sony we have no idea if the internals but that’s fancy shaped plastic will be more expensive to make them a box will be. Plus it’s SSD is custom, as is it’s CPU and GPU, I can see why it would be the more expensive machine.
@Matroska So, it was still expensive at the time and today £500 is still expensive and not many people will spend that in a luxury item like a games console.
@Medic_Alert That winds me up when all Sony fans are like, the XSX has no launch games, conveniently forgetting about those two! Both launch titles exclusive to Series X and PC. I would put them above bugsnax and that robot game that’s built in the PS5 (that’s another reason for the PS5 being expensive having a brand new built in game).
@JustNeepz I hope so! My gut feeling is the series X will be priced between the PS5 Digital and Disk version, if that’s the case I’ll get a PS5 digital edition. That’s probably what I’ll do anyway if it’s £400 or less, maybe they’ll ditch the built in Robot game from the digital edition too to help cut costs?
I have ps4 pro that is 4k gaming and I have 4k tv . My PS4 looks better on my non 4k tv then it does on the on the 4k. Maybe my 4k is junk i don't know. I have never been a fan of the Xbox .I will be getting a PS5 a cheaper price would be nice and I'm not much for backwards compatibility ! I only play a few games and very rarely play old games any way! I ust keep the going forward.
Don't panic ranks of the faithful ps5 tops the ps4 pro in every department and the pro does 4k no prob he prob talking about 4k 60fps don't forget the devs are prob still getting used to the new tech as for price Sony and ms will prob announce august or early Sept neither can wait much longer the game of chicken didn't work
@StormNuken to be fair that's a rumor inside a rumor... and it's come to this for the Xbox, not much of evidence of anything and lots of rumors about perceived power of the console
Jeez man. I just listened to Jeff Grubb and he has no idea what he is talking about. He thinks PS5 variable frequencies is mainly based on SmartShift and thinks devs will struggle to use that feature 🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️
There are so many of those 'journalists' who seemingly didnt even listen to Mark Cerny explanations.
Yes I dont know sht either but at least I listened. A lot of people think its SmartShift and that's it. No Haha that's far from it.
@JJ2 I know, I mostly ignore game journalism. Cerny was very clear that the devs need to do absolutely nothing for the variable clock rates to be used. This kind of stuff happens every time a new gen arrives though so I tune most of it out now for my own sanity 🤣
@S1ayeR74 Sorry yeah I wasn't clear. Disc version. If that's over £499 tho. I might need to rethink.
@MarcG420
Yes though later DF questioned Cerny and he said the dev kits could use a fixed clocks for dev to use but the retail console has variable frequencies on it's own. SmartShift is just an additional feature on top of it as I understand it.
@NeutronBomb We’ll see, I just wish they would hurry up and announce the prices.
@JJ2 A lot of idiot Xbox fans saw that Smart Shift and instantly claim the PS5 can ONLY boost the speed of the CPU or the GPU at once, not together, which is not what Cerney said.. they are looking at the tech based in a computer, not being used in a totally custom build single chip design in a console with lots of other features boosting the frequencies as well.. and some other idiots run with the same flawed thinking.
@S1ayeR74 Sure, but £500 today would be less than £350 when the PS3 came out. That'd be a reasonable price, surely? We'd have been happy with the PS3 being £350 at launch and that's the same as the PS5 launching at £500.
That's the problem, people get certain numbers fixed in their head but forget the value changes. We could agree that £50 would be insanely cheap for a console yet that'd be around £1600 when my dad was a kid.
@Matroska No, in no ones world is £500 ‘reasonable’, your not living in the real world where the mass majority of gamers are casual and do not spend that kind of money on luxury items, a mobile phone is paid for on contract over 2 years, not an up front cost of several hundred. Add to that a recession deeper then any other and no, here in the U.K. a £500 will be a sales flop.
yes, the PS5 has a proprietary SSD which is probably more expensive to manufacture.. but the xbox x has more CUs on its APU which costs more, and produces more power/heat so needs a bigger cooling solution. PS5 has a consistent RAM setup across the board, rather than xbox's mismash of faster (than PS5) and slower (than PS5). so both consoles have parts which are cheaper/more expensive than the other. it seems to me that both could potentially be expensive, but microsoft is desperate to be cheaper than sony, and sony is desperate not to be more expensive than microsoft.. but neither wants to take the scale of losses of the xbox360/PS3 era. it's probably why we are seeing a game of price chicken.
sony's revenue forecast for G&NS for this year looks to be about $4.9bn (1977bn yen to 2500 bn yen) up from 2019.. what's unknown is whether or not its revenue from existing sources is projected to be up or down. from a simple view, if all other revenue was more or less the same, and it expects around 10m sales.. that would be $490 per console. other revenue up by $1bn would be $390 per console, other revenue down by $1bn would be $590 per console.
@S1ayeR74 Matroska is just making the point that prices increase over time; we can't expect to be paying the same forever. If some people can't afford it at launch, that's just how it is. We're talking about a luxury good not an essential. Buy or not buy is a decision for the consumer.
@Porkfiend Well of it flops then don’t expect their to be a PlayStation 6, considering an ex Sony executive stated if the PS4 wasn’t a success their would never have been a PS5, for Sony console sales matter, so no it will not be priced at £500, their share holders would also punish them if they don’t sell millions of PS5’s, so no your attitude of ‘if it doesn’t sell so be it’, wouldn’t fly in the Sony board room.
@leucocyte The Series X cooling solution is just clever packaging, a single big fan and a big heat sink, not really advanced or complicated. And with the overclocked speeds I’d argue the PS5 will run hotter, but who know how it’s cooled? You can or compare the two currently.
@S1ayeR74 fact? You have no evidence to prove that this is a fact, none at all.
Yes the economic climate is a travesty atm (thanks Tories) but you’d be surprised to find how people spend their money regardless of any redundancies and “NO money around”. If Apple released a brand new phone tomorrow people who have lost their job would still be buying it no doubts at all. And considering I am one of those people who is a victim of redundancies and being let go from their job due to the current climate, I am more than aware of financial situations and fyi I currently do not have the money saved to afford a PS5 at launch. Mainly because my savings are currently be ‘saved’ to ensure other things don’t become an issue.
But again we can revisit this in time as i’m 100% confident that the price will be closer if not dead on £500 and it certainly won’t flop. Cause I know if I can conjure up the funds to buy I will.
@Jacko11 Well now I know your full of it, firstly Covid 19 wasn’t created by the tories... secondly you’ve got no idea what so ever, clearly, about consumer spending habits, your living in a dream world if you fully believe people will spend £500 on a luxury item in the millions rather then pay to keep their houses etc.
@Kefka2589 Which comment is that a reply to then?
@S1ayeR74 I know Covid wasn’t caused by the Tories it was a joke about the economy you pleb 😂😂 Jesus
And considering I put myself in £50k debt to study a course around this exact thing you call “consumer spending” I’d say I have a fairly solid idea of how it all works and following the job I got from that £50k debt analysing consumer spending habits and household consumption expenditures. Though I guess from what you’re saying I should have saved my money and used FACTS created out of thin air.
I honestly don’t think most people are at as high a risk of losing their accommodation as you think and in fact I think the situation is arguably much more stable in most cases in most areas. There is no doubt that people will not be buying the console at launch due to current situation (🙋🏻♂️ Yep that’s me) and sales will take a hit, but to continually say it’ll be a sales flop, is just wrong mate.
Sony are eyeing around 5million sold by 2020 end, they raised production by around 4 million consoles. If they see the potential numbers, then you can’t honestly sit there and scream flop.
But alas, we’ll know how it pans out soon when the price is announced and the pre orders go live.
@Jacko11 well said. If I were you I’d simply mute him and move on. I’ve muted him and the site is better without him tbh.
@manux59 well it does when the Xbox series s/ project Lockhart is rumored to only be 200$ and be fully capable of playing next gen games at 1440p@60fps and 4k@30 or more fps. And is also meant for people that can't take full advantage of the series x and don't have a 1'000$ plus 4k 120hz tv in there living room. There's a bonus too it's likely to include 3 months of gamepass to jumpstart your digital games collection if this is all true the series s will be a HUGE hit for sure. Price definitely matters. The reason why the ps3 launch was a disaster and one of the main reasons why the original xb1 launch was a disaster.
@Jacko11 Jokes like that NEVER translate across on the internet.
As for your course, great you have the education, do you have the real life experience where you really learn? Sorry but I still think £500 is a sales flop price, too high. But I don’t think it’ll cost that anyway. I remember we had the exact same rumours for the PS4 and Xbox One and rumours of really high pricing, and the actual cost was no where near the rumours.
@S1ayeR74 if you read my reply to you properly, you’d have seen that yes I did have the real life experience...did...that’s why I’m having this conversation with you cause I’m using my own experience of not being able to afford a PS5 currently myself, and the knowledge I have of real life experience working in the field that focuses on this to say to you that the PS5 will not be a sales flop at £500.
But yes, the rumours for PS4 and Xbox One were of high pricing, but we didn’t know for sure the ins and outs of the consoles, now we do. Analysts and experts have told us how much it costs to make both new consoles, how much the companies can really afford to take a loss on them, and how simply having a 4K disc drive can create a $20-25 difference in overall price, and understand how could literally be the decider in selling at a loss or profit.
@Jacko11 I wouldn’t trust a analyst in anything, they are only making guesses themselves, they don’t work for Sony or Microsoft, Patcher for instance has a record of being wrong.
As for you not affording one, I just assumed your paying for other things, and yes you implied you had experience but not you don’t anymore, hope you find a job soon if that’s what your referring?
I think you’ll be shocked at the price that Sony will set, they are going to undercut a lot to shift them, they have already stated they want as many people to transition as fast as possible to the PS5, the ONlY way they will do that is with price.
I am pretty confident now that it will go Series S, PS5 Digital, Series X, PS5 Disk in regards to pricing.
My limit is still going to be £400 and I’m fairly confident at least two consoles will fall into that bracket.
£500 is just too much for the casual gamer, how many kids will ask their parents for a £500 console? Plus games? It’s not going to happen I don’t think.
@BAMozzy Nice piece and i loved the look of PS4 exclusives on the base PS4 so i will be happy anyway i rather have 1440P upscaled with rocksolid 60 FPS and all the graphical fidelity then 4K with a lot of comprimises.
@S1ayeR74 Get a job and pay along i had too every console i owned after my first one and even with that console i bought my games myself.
@Perryg92 Dont they pay travel in the UK? Not being smart here in the Netherlands you get a set amount of your travelcosts reimbursed.
@Kefka2589 exactly, I just got a 4k TV, obviously can't use my base PS4 at 4k but when I get my PS5 it's gonna be glorious. Sony have said so much about their aims and sales targets, for the price to be $600+ it just would not make sense. So many conflicting reports out here, I might just go into a coma until November.
Imo console generations are meant to be impactful and exciting. Microsoft are bent on taking this away and making it like a minor upgrade, by allowing their flagship games to be cross gen, no one will get that feeling they got from previous generations. It'll just be like halo infinite and may look good but isn't anything special as it has to run on base xbone 🤦🏾♂️.
@BAMozzy good analysis, it's interesting I saw somewhere that this geometry engine is advanced as hell and even has it's own version of vrs which obviously they haven't spoken about.
I've been hearing that apparently the PS5 is very weak, I laff, because it's based on the AMD smartshift thing and it shifts power between the GPU and CPU. What do you think about this? Have you used an AMD device with the smartshift function?
@Flaming_Kaiser I’ve been working longer then you’ve been alive, judging by that immature childish comment. When you’ve grown up you’ll also realise you don’t want to spend so much money on toys.
@Flaming_Kaiser I'm sure some industries in the UK reimburse some of your travel costs, but silly me chose to follow my dream and work in the post-production movie business, where they'd never do the sort.
@Perryg92 Just asking dont have too be a defensive about it.
The people playing down 4K are just coming off as a bit fanboyish. Any new TVs going forward are going to be 4K. It's like saying HD wasn't that important back when gen 7 launched in 2005 because most people didn't have a HD TV.
@S1ayeR74 New consoles tend to launch at a premium price because it's only the most hardcore of fans interested at launch. The mass market won't look at a new console until 2-3 years, and then it comes down in price. They don't need to make it affordable for all right out of the gate. There is also the matter of the pound absolutely tanking in value since the last consoles came out. Sony will look at the production cost and sale of the consoles in dollars. £400 now, is not what £400 was in 2013. Sony sold something for £400 in 2013 they got $628 for it. Today they sell something for £400 and they get $523 for it. You can't expect a foreign company to take a loss on something just because a particular country ruined the value of their currency.
@Porkfiend If people can't afford it at launch, Sony has a massive problem on their hands.
Yes it's a luxury item, and yes people don't have to have it, but Sony has to sell the PS5, and lots of them.
The R&D costs and the set up of manufacturing and tooling will be astronomical, and selling a couple of million won't put a dent in those losses, it needs to move tens of millions of units.
It's pretty clear to everyone's right now that the PS5 will be more expensive than the previous generation, that's a given as it's not off the shelf components this time around.
But if Sony even contemplated dropping the PS5 on the market at near £600, then it will go horribly wrong for them, and with the economical climate as it is, I'd say it would be far worse than the PS3 release debacle.
@theMEGAniggle The PS5 certainly isn't weak - all you need to do is look at how it compares to the most powerful current console and can see its a lot more capable. Compared to previous Playstation consoles too, its a big step up. Again, remember that RDNA2 is much more efficient than previous architecture so its not going to be a 'linear' improvement. ie the PS5 is little less than 2.5x as powerful as a PS4 Pro because of the TF (4.2 vs 10.28)
That's without considering any of customisation of the APU Sony have added. Therefore it won't be weak by any stretch of the imagination. However, when you look at the 'numbers' of the Series X, there is quite a disparity in the designs and differences in how they will operate too - like compression/decompression - even if both have that built in to offload that from the CPU. You have Sony's Geometry Engine too and MS's Velocity architecture so you really don't know how these will impact the games and whether or not, the different approaches will give one an edge - regardless of the 'numerical' difference.
As for the Smartshift thing, what that does is essentially speeds up CPU/GPU in tiny fractions of a second. What this means is that if a 'single' frame needs the GPU boosted to max speed, it can boost the GPU virtually instantly to try and get that frame out in time. Its very difficult at the moment to know exactly how the PS5 will operate on average. It could run at an average 2-300mhz lower consistently, and when needed, drop one by another 2-300mhz and boost the other up to the cap. That would of course mean that in 'general' its running that much 'weaker' compared to the Series X, BUT games are 'not' always utilising the full capability of the GPU/CPU anyway. So in other words, you get the full capacity of the PS5 when the game demands unlike the Series X which always runs at full capacity but its wasting power most of the time because games are not constantly requiring that power.
Again though, we don't know what any of that means to a gamer yet and won't know until games start releasing on both consoles and can be analysed. You need to look at games ported to both, by the same developer team etc to keep that aspect consistent - and then can compare like for like. Its also worth looking a wide range of games to see if certain common traits appear to be able to say that one generally has an advantage in certain areas or whether the differences in design and tweaks minimise perceived numerical differences.
Overall, I don't think the PS5 is weak at all and on paper at least, looks to be a big step up from all current consoles available. Its not weak at all, but on paper again, its not as powerful as the Series X. Again though, we will have to see if the design approach minimises any differences or not.
@Peach64 You’ve got absolutely no idea what your talking about, you are also ignoring what Sony themselves have said. But you go on and ignore facts if it makes you feel better, I’ve explained myself several time’s already and now have better things to do..
@Flaming_Kaiser I answered your question, followed by a light hearted joke about myself and the industry I work in... Hardly defensive.
@Perryg92 Ok maybe i read too much in it then. The im sorry part made that happen.
@S1ayeR74 I meant a kid could get a job too save for the difference if he really wants it. I had parents that didnt have so much money too pay for these things and i had too buy it myself. Ill be more clear in the future.
@JustNeepz Thank you, someone who gets it at last! I don’t think it’ll cost anywhere near 600 or even 500, because of what you stated they need to shift millions of units.
599.99 USD for both versions. Discless unit will have larger SSD. Disc based unit will have lower storage SSD. 89.99 for Controller. 99.99 for Camera. 109.99 for Headphones. 69.99 per PS5 title. PS4 games will remain 59.99
@Flaming_Kaiser there was never an "I'm sorry" part in my initial response to your question, so don't know what you're referring to... I said "I'm sure", when discussing if the UK had reimbursement schemes.
Unless you mixed up my response with someone else?
Anywho no matter.
@BAMozzy facts, I guess just the media rumours and and what not have led to soon serious doubts from ppl about it's strength.
A Zen 2 8 core/16 thread CPU at 3.6GHz costs around £300. An RDNA 1.0 5700 XT (40 CU's at much lower clock speed) costs around £400. SSD's are not cheap and Sony's is more advanced than anything on the market. There is extra customisation on the APU - like Audio Processor, Decompression etc.
The XB1X launched at $500 less than 3yrs ago, the Pro at $400 less than 4yrs ago. Even if you take the Pro and allow for '4yrs' of advancements, the PS5 is MUCH greater than what $400 can buy today, more than what $500 can buy and if you wanted to build a PC to match, if you could, you would need a lot more than $600 too.
I know Sony won't be paying anywhere near £300 for a Zen 2 CPU as the buy direct in vast quantity, but the silico is more expensive to produce. I doubt the APU will be much smaller but a lot more dense so more expensive. It was designed and specced out before the world crisis we are in now and no doubt designed to be an evolutionary over even the mid gen consoles. Designed at a time when gaming has been very successful - and also saw a big jump up in sales during Lockdown too don't forget - and being an 'indoor' activity, something that is less likely to suffer like Gyms, Tourism etc.
Of course, making an 'expensive' console that perhaps would have targetted $600 (for example) before the outbreak of Covid, doesn't mean that Sony/MS will now launch at $600 but trying to decide how much they are willing to lose. Drop the price by $100 for example may not seem like a lot, but sell 1m in launch week, that's a $100m loss that would need to be made up else where. Of course Digital Console owners will probably offset that in less than a year by buying 'new' games in the Online Store but its harder to make that money back in the same financial year from Physical game purchasers - especially if they don't game online. Therefore, they have to try and decide what price they can effectively lose and the potential to offset that loss with profits elsewhere.
If they do drop the price considerably, that could also mean it holds its price much longer, at least until the cost of manufacturing drops low enough to sell at a profit...
I am 2 on Gamestops preorser list...i have 700 put aside already. I'm quite comfy
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