Topic: Returnal

@johncalmc @Voltan @render Yeah, I’ve been mostly using the Rotgland Lobber, but also some of the carbine, depending on what the run deals me. Maybe I’ll try a large grindy run through B1 and the first of B2, it’s just I get so anxious to progress. But like I say, it’s not like I’m going straight to B3 with the beginning pistol and base integrity (ok, maybe I’ve tried that once, but otherwise…) I’m going in fairly well prepped.
But it’s good to know the Lobber is probably the way to go. I’m getting more accustomed to using it. It has a strange overload that takes some getting used to, as well as the aim is more nebulous, especially for flying enemies where it will whiff a lot more often. The accuracy is better with holding down R2 trigger for a moment and power up, but in the frantic fray of 10 enemies barraging you, that few seconds is the difference of life of death.

One thing I need to do is get the timing down on the red rings from the stupid turret bombs and all the different robots.

One of my good runs was completely ruined by my going into a collapsing floor secret room and the mini boss there was nigh impossible. He set the whole room’s floor as electricity and then sent out every manner of red rings, orbs, lasers, and had a melee sword type attack that had pretty good reach, especially for the small room with no where to go. Sucks.

@render @johncalmc I have to admit the driver is a strong weapon but I just didn't enjoy it very much myself

@Th3solution The overload is difficult to judge definitely, but if you get it you can blow stuff away with a few perfectly timed ones.

With those mini bosses in the yellow rooms if I was doing a proper run I'd just get the hell out of there straight away while it was still spawning. Sometimes you can even grab a health of something on the way out but just bail as quick as you can.

@Th3solution I actually found the lobber's overload to be very cool because there's a rhythm to it that also works if you have the double chamber trait (I forget what it's actually called). Works especially well with the artifact that makes you shoot lightning on reload!

@render that’s good advice. After I died and thought to myself why didn’t I just bolt for the transport orb. 😣

@Voltan Haven’t seen that artifact, but man, I need that one!

Perhaps I should be unlocking more artifacts with my ether in the opening crash site machine? Is that the best use of it at this stage of the game. I’m not sure what I’m holding onto it for, but I’m typically running around with 10-15 ether.

@Th3solution It's called Overload Bolts and while it's useful with any weapon other than Dreadbound, it really shines with the Lobber - check it out

And yeah, I think buying stuff from the Cthonos when you can is a good idea in general (it has a limited number of items and they get more expensive after you buy some).

Just a side note here —
Rift Apart is getting all the attention related to the quick world jumping / immediate loading SSD stuff, but this game has some impressive quick loads from one world to another. It even looks kinda like the rifts in the R&C game (from what I’ve seen in promos, not having played it yet myself) when you walk through the portal from Biome 1 to Biome 2. And also there are the little gates into treasure rooms that have that same effect from one room to the next.

@Th3solution Yeah i did full runs of biomes 1 and 2 before attempting biome 3. Like others have said Rotgland Lobber is the way to go, so get unlocking those traits and get all your stats up. Think I got my proficiency to about 13 when I beat it that biome.

And yeah you really need to start using that ether and purchase some artefacts if you have not already. The more you buy the more variety of artefacts will appear in chests and fabricators.

Holy $@¥%*! Nemesis is crazy hard!
Woah, that is one epic battle! Not sure I’ll ever beat him, although that’s what I thought about Phrike, so maybe I’ll find a way.

Took me a 4 hour run to go though B1, B2, B3 and make it to the boss. It helped to spend the extra time building up my integrity and getting a few artifacts and parasites. I used a variety of weapons along the way, a lot of the Lobber, but also Hollowseeker, Thermogenic launcher, and Carbine. I took the pistol into the boss fight because it was a level 13 and a higher level from the Launcher I had been carrying around. I wasn’t very proficient with the Launcher and really bad at the overload so I switched to the higher level pistol, but it also was just too slow. I had invested my ether into a reconstructor, so my second attempt I took in a level 10 Hollowseeker that I had dropped along the way. I made it a little further maybe but both attempts ended about halfway through Nemesis’s second health bar.

Any tips? Sorry, I’ll look back and try to find them in the thread, but it’s hard to locate specific conversations in these threads. I’m curious has anyone tried the Lobber or Spitmaw Blaster on Nemesis? It’s just so far away I don’t know if the shots will reach effectively.

@Th3solution we are in the same spot! I’ve been having a heck of a time just getting to Nemesis. The little flying robot drones in B3 are absolutely infuriating to me...anyways, I’ve had Nemesis down below the last quarter of his third phase. I’m best with the carbine, and I find focusing all fire on the orangeish centre drops his health fairly quickly. I’ve been strafing constantly, trying to time it out in such a way that I don’t run out of room on the platform. Phase 3 is where I’m struggling, but honestly it’s mostly getting to Nemesis that’s been the hardest for me. Not sure I can really help you but it feels good knowing I’m not going through this alone 😂

@Jimmer-jammer 😄 Oh yeah, buddy, I hear you on the drones, not to mention the kamikaze guys that crawl to you and explode and then the the freakin’ huge dude who whips you and can draw you in from across the room like Scorpion in Mortal Kombat or can also just jump on top of you, all the while sending red balls and rings of death. Sheesh, and then a room of all of the above right before the boss… eesch. Only to be followed by the boss fight which is like an effing Christmas Parade of orbs, lasers, fire pits and flashing lights. Oh and by the way, the ground is going to move beneath you and crumble unexpectedly. 😅

I felt well prepared; I had been planning to have some Silphium vials to heal during the boss, but I had to use them in the crazy rooms before the boss.
Did you take the shortcut to B3 or play though the first two leveling up?

But it sounds like you’ve made it a little further in than I did. Part of my issue was fatigue at the end of 4 hours straight too. I’m not sure if I’ll have much time during the week to play long sessions like this again.

@Th3solution fatigue is a reality that I’m still learning to accept in this game. I’ve been more of a teenager the last few days than I care to admit, staying up far later than I should, with debatable results to boot...If I can get a decent weapon, and the right gate, I’ll skip right to B3. I’m not sure I fully understand how but my proficiency seems to jump to 9 once I’m there. I do find going through biome 2 beneficial for upgrading integrity, especially if I can find a helpful artifact (required resin reducing one). Also, collecting both silphium vials from the biome entrances is helpful. I don’t know, there are so many different ways to adaptively strategize ones approach to each cycle, it’s really quite amazing to me what Housemarque have accomplished here, not to mention the ridiculously fluid and tight shooting mechanics.
I just had a go with the lobber. It was only level 5 but thought I’d try it out as I lucked out with a quick and manageable run. I can see how a higher level equivalent with better traits could do well against Nemesis. I had no trouble reaching the damage zone. Still, it doesn’t really sit right with me. A rapid firing carbine or a hollowseeker with waves just feel so much better to me to use. With the lobber I’m not as adept at dodging or even tracking the projectiles for some reason. I do wish there was a grenade-type mechanic, something that offered more player control than the consumable options.

@Th3solution Nemesis - and I know you probably don't want to hear this - is actually one of the easier bosses I think once you know his tricks. The first time I got to him I was bamboozled, but I wound up killing him on my third attempt with little issue.

I think one of the big problems is how you cause him damage. You only hurt him when shooting that little red circle. It's his weak spot. Also I tried different weapons against him and while the Hollowseeker annihilated everything up to him, it barely damaged Nemesis at all. Hit him with a couple from the Rotgland Lobber and then concentrate on avoiding his shenanigans while they hurt him then repeat.

The second phase is slightly more complicated because there's multiple platforms and more bullets but use the same tactics, the only really difference being you can grapple to different platforms and while you grapple you're invincible, so grapple while you're swamped in bullets.

Phase three is an evolution of two - you're doing the same thing, it just looks more dangerous. Move from platform to platform to get closer and closer to him then unload with the Lobber. He'll move eventually and repeat.

I think if you do a run through the first two biomes and make sure you stock up on health packs - you should have three big ones by Nemesis providing you don't run into any massive issues - then those should see you through this.

@Th3solution @Jimmer-jammer It's been mentioned before but if you are having trouble with those rooms on the way up to the boss then just get out of there. You can just use the translocator sphere or the grapple points, which ever room configuration you get, but you can get straight out of there as it's not a lockdown room.

If you've got "always sprint" on then those first 2 phases where you are right in front of it you can pretty much strafe left and right like @velio84 mentioned just using dash where it starts getting close, but remember to dash the opposite way than you were walking as you are less likely to run out of room that way.

And as @johncalmc said, use the grapples especially on that last phase. Once you see the bullet storms heading towards you start looking for another grapple point so you've got an escape plan then once they are nearer grapple out of there and you will be invincible for that moment. If you do have to throw yourself off a platform you can always find another one so just don't panic, but remember that you can only dash once until you've landed on another platform so you are vulnerable until you grapple again.

On the weapon choice I agree, I've used both the lobber and the carbine to take down Nemesis and both do a great job. I've also used the launcher but it had full auto on it and even then I found it quite patchy.

Good luck guys but you can definitely do it.

@Th3solution @Jimmer-jammer Can't really add to what others have said as i would just be repeating stuff. I didn't find Nemesis that difficult tbh and beat him on my 3rd attempt I think. But I struggled with the bosses for biomes 1 and 2, so some will be different in that respect. @Thrillo had a really good video for the boss, I believe so may be kind enough to post it. Again.

Getting there was way more difficult, but the Rotgland Lobber with a decent proficiency level and some good traits will make short work of the enemies. One of the traits will give you an extra barrel which comes in handy. I find you don't need to hit the overload everytime as reloading is quite quick. And just keep on the move, making use of the grapple points.

@JohnnyShoulder I think you might mean my video, here it is:

@Th3solution - as other said and as you can see in the vid - in the first two phases you just need to consistently move left and right while shooting the weak point.
Note: I did not use "always sprint". I think it's more important that you don't ever aim down sights as it slows you down (if you have a good alt fire - which I didn't - that's when you're allowed to use the left trigger lol)
Note 2: I did have a pretty strong weapon and admittedly Nemesis gets a little tougher if you let it live long enough in phase 1 or 2 - still doable though.

@Voltan @JohnnyShoulder @render @johncalmc @velio84
Appreciate the advice. I’ve watched that video and a couple more on YouTube and it does seem a lot more manageable when you see it done from a spectator’s point of view. I don’t know what I was doing wrong specifically other than just taking my eye off the defense probably, which is absolutely what this game is all about — survive first, damage the enemy second.

That being said, I think Voltan has a point in that I feel like Nemesis grew more aggressive the longer I let him stay in phase 1 and 2. From the videos I’ve watched now it seems like there was a lot less going on as far as attacks compared to what I was dealing with, especially during phase 2. There were plenty of times I was successfully paying attention to the two guys on the sides who were shooting sweeping lasers or red rings and almost immediately after dodging I had a face full of blue orbs coming out in a stream and arriving almost instantaneously.

Do I remember someone saying that after the last update they seemed to make Nemesis more difficult? It seemed like on both my attempts with both weapons that I was just chipping away at his health bar a sliver at a time and he was staying in each phase much longer than the videos I’ve seen. But it’s fully possible my weapon was not up to snuff compared to the videos I’ve seen. Knowing now the Lobber will reach, hopefully I’ll be able to get ahold of a good one to try before the next time. I felt the one I used through the B3 run was a bit underleveled anyways, but I’m sure it would have probably done just as much as what I had. The Hollowseeker although level 10 had like 5 of its point on extra damage, and it had waves, but it just seemed to barely scratch ol’ Nemesis. And I was aiming for the red center after I figured out that seems to be the only place he takes damage. But I may have been a little unwieldy in my aim, seeing as I was jumping around like a cat on a hot tin roof in the process 😅.

I’m itching to try another run. But like I say, I’ve got work today and a social obligation so I don’t have the consecutive hours to devote to a meaningful run. I think this is likely the most challenging part of the game, time commitment-wise wise, right? After I clear this runs will be shorter once it resets to B4 as the starting point? If I have to devote 4 hours to each run from here on out then it’s going to take me months to clear since I’ll only make significant progress when the stars align for that much free time (and free energy).

@Jimmer-jammer Definitely feeling the same. It’s expertly crafted to feel great to play, but it very much reminds me of the retro arcades that have you going back to play the opening area again and again. It’s quite an accomplishment to keep it fun whilst making gamers repeat the same basic opening section over and over. I am growing a little weary of Biome 1 though. 😒

And I totally had a ‘wish I had a grenade’ moment last night too. I almost instinctively pressed L1 to throw a grenade in one of the death rooms while I was just running away from a group of 5 enemies chasing me. I guess that’s basically what the Lobber is, but I didn’t have one at the time.

@Th3solution I found Biome 4 relatively straight forward and managed to beat it in one go straight after Biome 3. And then quickly got trounced in Biome 5. 😆 I won't spoil what happens in Biome 6, but I felt the game upped it up a knotch or two for that one. So for me, no the game did not get any easier. But like with most things in this game, most people's experience will differ in regards to that.

When I've gone back to do stuff in Biome 5 I have found it much easier to cope with what it throws at you. Biome 3 can still kill me off pretty quickly when I've gone back to it.

@Voltan I knew it was one of you!

@Th3solution im still stuck in biome 3. I watched @Voltan video and the biggest takeaway I realized is I never have a health bar that big. My problem is I skip biome 2 after collecting a few artifacts in 1. I think I'll have to go to 2. I did make it to the boss 3 times so far, and got nemesis down to phase 2 low health, but I had a rocket launcher and it wasn't working out the best for me. I'm still having a great time though.

When I get frustrated I quit and play a couple rounds of heros swbf2. I find myself trying to dash midair as a jedi though lol and usually get myself killed.