Topic: The Push Square Football (Soccer) Thread

Ok so since the World Cup is now over I have created a place where we can talk about football or soccer to us Americans here. Feel free to discuss the world's game here.

Everyone looking forward to the new Premier League season? At this point in time, Man United are getting beat at home in the first match of the season. Sammy won't be happy, unless they manage to nab a typical last second goal...

Same old, same old.

Let's stick to actual football discussion in here, please. I know it's tangentially related, but... Not really relevent!

Anyway, old habits die hard. Funny thing is - United won 4-1 against Swansea last season in first game. Reality check for everyone I think - United squad is simply not good enough anymore.

I think there's little doubt that van Gaal will have them playing better than Moyes would, but I agree that I don't think the squad's quite there. I expected bigger summer signings from United to be honest, not that the window is closed of course.

Nobody here bother with the Championship? I always watch the Football Leage Show every weekend as its always a great watch. The Championship has come on leaps & bounds over the years and is a high quality league. The fact almost all the teams in the league have a chance of hitting the playoffs make it probably the most open league in the world, yet still noone takes an interest in it

With all the Van Gaal hype all summer I was surprised to see United getting slapped down at home by Swansea. You'd think it was the second coming of the messiah with all the stuff I'd read over the summer lol I hope United get better otherwise our derbys are going to be lacking in excitement.....

Hire a manager who has only delivered in uncompetitive leagues (Spain, Germany, Holland) where he's had as much money as you want and people are surprised United lost? People need to actually look at his track record rather than who he managed. He took an all conquering Bayern side to third in a one team league (starting a dominance by Borussia) and in Spain where if Barca don't win the league Real do he managed to lose the league to Depotivo. Then in Holland he lost the title to PSV who started years of dominance after that and then with AZ and a very good squad he continuously messed it up at the final hurdle with his tinkering. He's just Claudio Ranieri with a crap haircut.

Absolutely loved them being beat purely because all it's been for weeks is "United are back!" in the media so to see them now all turn face and say "Well they need players" when their squad at 12:44 on Saturday was good enough "to at least get 4th, probably higher" was priceless. A long, hard season for United. LVG will do what he always does (cause trouble, annoy the press, make the players hate him) and will be sacked by May when they finish 7th or lower. Anyone can beat anyone in the Premier League and he's never had that before which is why he already looks like a rabbit in the headlights. And Rooney as captain? A man who's held the club to ransom several times and stressed his desire to leave for more money is their captain? It gets better and better.

Away from the Theatre Of Hilarity was what everyone expected surely? Liverpool and City both looked anxious as they know they needed a win and got them, Arsenal scraped a fluky win against a dreadful side and the rest just kind of played as they always do. Think we may shock City a week today, they don't look fully fit at the back so attack them with pace and creativity (Markovic and Lallana will be fit) and I fancy our chances.

I watch it every week after MOtD purely for Clarridge. Fantastic pundit and always up for being made to look a numpty on 5Live. Now have a further interest as one of my footballing heroes is a manager in there, Sami Hyppia. Hoping Leeds go down this year as it'll just be funny :')

With the squad they've got Chelsea have to win the league. If they don't it's bye bye Maureen. He also must get his side playing football that's even semi enjoyable or he'll be sacked before Christmas. Abramovich wants success and entertainment. If Chelsea win the league he'll stick with him but if they don't and it's as garbage to watch as last year he won't be there next summer.

So I figured since what is going on with FIFA this would be a good time to bring back this thread. So I know that we have alot of football (soccer) fans here what do you all think about the current situation?

Eufa should grow a set and go it alone. For anyone who doesn't know FIFA is a charitable organisation and its primary source of income is the world cup, and for the primary source of revenue to be so corrupt and millions of pounds filtered away from the overall game - then heads should roll.

EUFA is more transparent owing to its business links in Europe, and has done a hell of a lot for the game in Europe. That's the way I want to go.

@iDangerMouse_ read post 8 and your prediction came true. I reckon Arsenal will challenge this year with Chelsea close, City followed by Tottenham. Man Utd will capitulate and Alex Ferguson will be brought back.

Personally I think whoever takes over FIFA needs to bring Football into the 21st Century - particularly at the highest level. I know we have goal-line technology but we still see many mistakes by officials which can and often do lead into animosity and arguments. With the amount of money and status involved, I believe technology can and should be used to bring Football in line with other sports.

Looking at Tennis, they have a 'challenge' system where a player can challenge a linesman/umpire call. If its successful, they don't lose a 'challenge' but more importantly the right 'point' is awarded. So how could this be used in Football? Maybe ONLY the captain can ask the referee to 'review' the situation. It would be much better than seeing the team surround the referee arguing/shouting etc. It takes a few seconds to review (a 4th referee in a box with the TV footage) and can relay that to the referee and put the decision on the scoreboard (like cricket/tennis/rugby). Lets say they have 2-3 Challenges per half - at the end of the season. the team with the most challenges unused get an extra 3pts - for some that could save them from relegation or get into Europe. At International or in Cup matches, it would help to ensure the right result - How many matches do we see where teams lose because of poor ref decisions... In tournaments, the team with the most challenges remaining can be awarded something like the 'Fair Play' trophy.

These 'Challenges' can be used for any 'incident' but ONLY the Captain can approach the referee and ask. This would be useful around the Penalty decisions as quite a few are awarded by mistake and even some that don't get awarded. It would help referees as they can ask for 'help' from the 4th ref too during a match to ensure the right decisions are made. Look at how it has helped Tennis, Cricket etc... It won't slow the game down as often the TV has shown and reviewed an incident multiple times whilst arguments etc are still ongoing. Its not just 'Penalty' decisions but even the issue of Red/Yellow cards - we still see players sent off by mistake, Red card 'tackles' that don't get punished and even the wrong people given cards.

FIFA and UEFA to a lesser degree, seem so stuck in the past where Football is concerned and it does seem corrupt too - even on the 'pitch'. By using 'video' reviews etc, not only would we get a more consistent and potentially more accurate result but it also alleviates the refs from allegations of bribery/corruption. If a Captain can 'Challenge' a refs decision (in an appropriate way of course), they cannot be corrupt or influence the result.

Just my thoughts...

@BAMozzy 1 video call a game each max, the problem isn't necessarily the games but any diving should have an Instant 2 match ban if the ref picks up on it post match.

Personally I think 2-3 a half would be better. You often get several 'dubious' decisions that can and should be challenged. Maybe after a Season or two, this number can be revised until a good balance is found.

Diving, like other forms of play-acting, feigning injury etc, does need to be addressed. The 'Challenge' system would allow the opposition a chance to 'challenge' the ref and get the right result - if a player 'dives' it will be seen by a 4th official and a free kick/penalty can be overturned and given to the other team - the 'diver' can be given a 'card' and suitable punishment. The challenge system would help eradicate the players that try to 'cheat' and ensure that the result of a match isn't determine by these incidents. Punishment after a match is too late as the result can be affected. You wouldn't like to see your team lose 1-0 because a player 'conned' the ref and won a penalty to win the match. If that player gets a 'ban' it doesn't change the fact your team dropped 3pts because of it.

I don't think the challenge system is a good idea myself, just imagine how much stoppage time would be needed to be added at the end of a half if each team got a few challanges each half They should just have another official viewing the live feed of the game who can pick up on these things & notify the referee if its missed or let him know of any possible play acting etc via the mic he already wears. They do currently have other officials, but they seem to have no power to influence decisions during the game these days. That way the flow of the match isn't hampered continually by the challenges and we wont have to worry about Football decending into the stop-start nature of other sports. It's not a good change if it destroys one of the sports best aspects in the process.

Yeah it would drive me insane if they had challenges and stopped game play on every call the opposing team wanted to challenge. One of the things that I love with soccer over football is the continous play. It drives me nuts every time football stops for a challenge.

Continuous??? 5 mins of stoppage whilst the players surround the ref and argue their point. Its not EVERY Decision that will be challenged either and ONLY those that the team feel the ref got wrong. Watching Football on TV, we often see multiple replays from various viewpoints and clearly see what happened before the ball is back in play, sometimes minutes before so I really can't see how it can increase the stoppage time - if anything its more likely to increase the ball in play time as the players won't all be arguing over these...

Its just an idea to bring the game into the modern era - to ensure that the decisions made are accurate. Maybe the team who make the most incorrect challenges lose 3pts so they don't waste time or just challenges for the sake of it either. Either way I see every week games won and lost because of poor decisons, players surrounding the referee, players trying to con the ref too...

That Chuck Blazer is droping dem bombs...

I wonder if he knows where Jimmy Hoffa is.

I just don't see it as a good system myself, if anythin it's heavily flawed. There's all manner of ways it could be abused, which is to be expected when adding an element of influence from the teams to what is supposed to be an impartial aspect of the game. The idea of punishing teams with point deductions sounds a little draconian too, plus there's nothing stopping a team losing via a dodgy decision they can't reverse due to running out if challenges. It all just sounds needlessly complex to me, especially when the idea I put forward is relatively simple and would work within the current systems of the game.

It's not that I'm saying the challenge system is wrong or anything like that, it just seems there's better options out there

Well I am a few days late on this but the Woman's World Cup has started this past weekend. Sadly since I don't get tv I won't be able to watch any of the games but I will be keeping an eye on the scores. Anyone else following it?

@MadchesterManc I personally think the challenge system would eliminate all the pushing and surrounding the ref we see in matches. I think teams should have the opportunity to challenge a refs decision IF and only IF they are certain the ref made a mistake. All to often we see games decided by a dubious decision and teams feel 'cheated' out of results. Its one way to eliminate mistakes and to bring more 'order' to the game.
If a team waste their challenges and then lose because they don't have challenges left, that is their own fault. It happens in Tennis too. The point is to 'challenge' IF you are certain a decision is wrong. You don't lose an opportunity to 'challenge' if a successful challenge is made.
Maybe penalise a team for making the most unsuccessful challenges is 'draconian' but It may stop teams from making unnecessary and pointless challenges for time wasting or whatever reason. I prefer to see teams rewarded for having the most challenges left in a similar way to the fair play - maybe even with bonus points.
The point is I think its 'Draconian' that teams are not able to challenge a ref at all. I suppose having a 4th ref who helps out with video replays that can feed the decision directly to the on-pitch ref would be a good way too. If they know that another ref is studying the decisions and seeing replays to help a ref make the right decision it may also stop the arguments etc.
Its not always easy for a ref to see exactly what happened and has to make a quick decision based on what they can see from their viewpoint. If you ever watch Sky's Monday view though you will see at lot of decisions in a lot of Premier League matches that are 'mistakes' - analysed by an ex-ref - Dermot Gallagher. Its not just 1-2 decisions in a game but often 5-6+
Even in this years Champions League - Juventus had a few Penalty claims, Neymar had a goal disallowed which probably should have stood (no way was that intentional) etc. I doubt the 'right' result would have been affected too much by using some form of Technology to help but it may have helped eliminate the mistakes...

I think the main problem with football is the play acting and mad antics like rolling around aka Suarez, Neymar, Ronaldo, Robben, Young etc. They go down after a slight touch. If they over act and are running fine five minutes later yellow card - hard to ref but it would sort it out.

@Tasuki yeah the women's world cup, looks like Canada has done a cracking job so far.

@BAMozzy and the Neymar example is why challenges wouldn't work. In my opinion without his hand intentionally or not it wouldn't of gone in. So its handball. He mistimed the head and it hit his hand. That's unintentional but without him screwing it up in the first place it wouldn't of hit his hand. The commentators on itv both disagreed - one saying it should stand and the other saying it shouldn't.
HOWEVER... Ive thought about this alot and the challenge system should be in place for red card offences and off the ball incidents which are missed to give a red card.