Topic: Official Push Square Xbox Thread

Xbox has its purpose as a third party machine ; it’s more powerful and the closest thing to a PC for someone who doesn’t care about sonys exclusives. if you don’t care about sonys exclusives , there’s no reason to get a ps5 over an xbox. it’s plenty of things Xbox does better , but they don’t know how to utilize what their potential is and they’re just completely lost .

nintendo knew their potential was in first party and quirkiness so they’ve capitalized on it ever since . Sony makes good big budget interactive cinematics & they’ve ran with it ever since. M$ doesn’t care about Xbox and trying to phase it out into a service app like steam .

@Kidfried What I see EVERYWHERE in the Xbox community, and have seen for years now, is growing anger and disappointment over the direction the company is going, which is the difference. Playstation and Nintendo fans are happily chattering right now in their respective communities about exclusives they're excited for. Meanwhile, aside from 2021 when the company seemed to have its stuff together and released some decent games, Xbox fans have had to endure endless disappointments. And even the centerpiece of that 2021 triumph, Halo Infinite, is now a source of anger and disappointment for Xbox fans, as they've apparently done a terrible job of maintaining the multiplayer aspects, which are what Halo fans stick with the series for.

Personally? I'm not all that much more interested in a PS5 than I am an XSX, and I've been critical of Sony's direction in terms of the sort of games it makes for years now. But I'm a minority in that regard, and the base broadly seems pretty happy with how the company has been performing.

@Pizzamorg I stand corrected! 😂

@nomither6 Xbox also doesn't get a good number of Japanese third-party games, for some reason. Perhaps not your cup of tea, but some of us are still gamers FOR those types of games.

Microsoft used to counteract this weakness by making deals with Japanese developers for exclusive games on their platform during the 360 era, and even attempted to during the One era (with Scalebound, which exploded in their faces), but that's yet another thing they don't do anymore. Again, the brand is on auto-pilot.

@Pizzamorg Gamepass is great for clearing backlog titles, or trying out indies or weirdies you might not have wanted to pay full price for, for sure, but I do think the lack of quality, first party, day one exclusives for Xbox hurts the value of Gamepass, too.

I disagree - Backlog games are already in your 'backlog' so don't need Game Pass for that. If you 'missed' out on 'older' games because you didn't buy them when they were 'current', they are still 'new' games to you. If I didn't own a PS5, Deathloop and Ghostwire are still 'new' to Xbox and Xbox only gamers. Every month, there is 'brand new' games added, games you don't have in your backlog. Not all are 'Indie' or 'smaller' budget either. In the last few years, MLB21, 22, 23, Plague Tale, Back4Blood and 'numerous' other big releases have been available Day 1 on Game Pass - saving gamers 'money' compared to playing on other Platforms. I am never going to buy these 3rd Party games on PS5 as a result - even in a sale because I can play it elsewhere cheaper...

Yes it maybe good for games you aren't sure are worth the asking price as well - maybe High on Life or Scorn were too weird or 'different' to your prefered taste in games but that is more indicative of your tastes - perhaps you are only interested in 'mainstream' generic game-play loops wrapped up in a 'pretty' visual package and using the 'story' to keep you playing a repetitive game-play loop, only interested in things that are 'familiar' to you and anything 'new' or 'different is just 'weird', but others want something new, something different, something unusual or unique, don't stick to specific genre or same few 'IP's' every generation. As you can ONLY play 1 game at a time, it doesn't matter if its Indie, 3rd or 1st party, doesn't matter how much it cost to make or the size of the Studio, doesn't matter if its 'new' or 'old', its still occupying your gaming time. Just because games like Doom, Fallout 3:NV or Minecraft are old games, they are still 'great' games and can still fill your gaming time.

I refuse to spend $/£70 on ANY game - no game is worth that much to me. There is NO game I 'must' play Day 1 that I need to spend that much. So between my Backlog of games I have yet to finish across PS4/XB1/PS5/XSX consoles (as both XSX and PS5 are backwards compatible so I can 'finish' games I bought last gen too), free games on Gold/PS+ every month adding to that Backlog, that even without Game Pass, I still have a LOT of great games to play so don't need to spend money on something, just because its new. Now add Game Pass to that which not only has 'old' games I missed out on, it also has lots of brand new releases coming every month. So not all are 1st Party AAA 'exclusives', but it still offers me a LOT more brand new games I couldn't play for just $10 a month. Vampire Survivors may 'not' appeal to you because its not AAA, doesn't have the 'best' graphics etc, but it beat God of War to the best Game Bafta. You'll call it weird or just dismiss it because it isn't AAA but obviously nailed the game-play loop that people find highly enjoyable and very addictive. I appreciate that 'everyone' has different preferences etc, but ALL games compete for your time/attention and Game Pass helps break down the barriers gamers put up - not spending money on Indies, not spending money on games they aren't 'sure' are for them, only buying games in certain IP's, genres etc because its 'safer' etc etc.

All games compete for my time - I don't care who made it, what budget it cost etc. I can only play 1 game at a time so every game - new/old, regardless of budget etc is competing for my time. The fact that I have access to 100's of great games - inc older games on Sale competing for my time and 'money'. I would rather pay £20 for an 'older' PS5 game in a Sale than buy something newly released costing £70 so I'd check this weeks sales before playing Spider-Man 2 when it launches. I'll be playing games available for 'free' on Game Pass, playing whatever PS+/Gold games are in my 'library', playing any of the games in my backlog until Spider-Man 2 drops below at least £50, preferably £40 or less. If it takes a year or more, well I have 'plenty' of great games to keep playing, new releases too...

As for 'Exclusives', Game Pass has many 'great' games from the history of Xbox and have a lot of games on the Horizon. Over the past few years, 'exclusives' may have been thin - with many coming to PS too thanks to 'legacy' - inc both Minecraft Dungeons/Legends, as well as Psychonauts 2, Deathloop, Ghostwire etc and PC only too (Age of Empires 4 - with a Console version coming to Game Pass too) but again, why would I buy Deathloop or Psychonauts 2 on PS5 when I can play them on GP for a lot less money? Just buying Deathloop and Ghostwire, (Or MLB22 & B4B, or any two AAA games that also released on PS5) at launch costs more than a year (at full price) of Game Pass yet can play those, as well as hundreds of other games, inc Starfield, Forza, AoE2, AoE4, HiFi Rush, Goldeneye, Last case of Benedict Fox, MLB23, Redfall (even if its not the 'best' game released, its no worse than many other AAA games at launch in terms of bugs, glitches, performance issues etc) and whatever other games come this year - so I get to play MANY great games, new, new to me, old, indie,, AA, AAA, 3rd/1st Party etc etc for less money than you can play '2' great games on PS5 new...

Game Pass doesn't suit everyone, but its not just for the '4' AAA Games a year MS 1st Party Studios are 'aiming' to deliver - 1 a quarter. It offers a wide variety of 'games' with a much smaller barrier for gamers to be able to jump in and 'enjoy' playing anytime. You don't 'need' to buy a Game again with ALL the games in Game Pass - you'll never have time to play them ALL and 'new' games come every week...

That is sorta what I was trying to articulate @BAMozzy, albeit poorly based on your response (outside of all of the weird projection stuff I just skimmed over). If you are a capital G Gamer then Gamepass probably has relatively low value to you, as you are chasing the new, exclusive, thing, which as of right now Gamepass generally does not provide outside of a small selection of non platform exclusive third party titles. It also excellent for trying out stuff you wouldn't ever consider paying full price for.

However, if you are a more "casual" (hate the term) lower case g gamer then Gamepass is excellent value because you get a massive selection of premium titles all under one subscription.

@Pizzamorg You are completely WRONG - as a 'G' Gamer as you put it, there is ALWAYS something NEW on Game Pass - not 'just' Exclusives - the '4' a year that maybe a PS5 owner might bother to Subscribe to play 'just' those because ALL the other games they can 'buy' on PS5 or 'only' indies and not worth your valuable gaming time which can only be 'spent' on those 'few' games a year you really 'play'

To me, Game Pass is Perfect for the Hardcore Gamer - always something new, something different, something to add to their overall gaming experiences. It doesn't matter if its 'indie', I really enjoyed some when I wanted a 'break' or try something 'different to' whatever AAA games I'm playing. Every month there are 'big' game releases - MLB is a AAA game that if I ONLY had PS5, would be 'forced' to pay the asking price or miss out, Plague Tale - maybe not 'AAA' but AA and high quality, Back4Blood was 'AAA', Age of Empires II is a AAA game - first time on Console, So was Ghostwire and Deathloop, both within the past 6months and for the 'first' time available on Xbox hardware. Every month, there are 'big' games, Atomic Heart, Lies of P, Forza, Starfield, Redfall (still a 'big' game) - so every month there are GAMES for GAMERS...

Its 'great' too for those 'new' to Gaming to have a collection of games they can play - many of which they may of missed - great to play through the entire Halo, Gears, Fallout, Elder Scrolls, Doom, Wolfenstein etc games to 'catch up', Great for anyone with a 'broad' gaming palette, not narrow minded and only focussed on 'brand new AAA games' that are rated 90+ on Metacritic to waste my time on' or 'casual gamers who may start a game and find it gone the next time they try to play it...

It really is for GAMERS - not 'the Casual' so much as you seem to think. It just doesn't suit you (or those who only want AAA exclusives scoring high on metacritic) because you have a very 'narrow' band of what you consider 'worthy' of your time instead of being open and willing to see what all these developers have poured their heart and soul into bringing to GAMERS, Seeing what unique ideas, concepts, twists/turns, message etc - and only want AAA games that score high on metacritic to make it worth your time to 'try' it....

How many of this years top third party exclusives are on Gamepass @BAMozzy? Some, sure, but not all of them. So saying I am completely wrong and in all caps no less is honestly kinda laughable to be honest.

I'm also confused because you are saying I am wrong and then explaining how you use Gamepass to play games that you wouldn't ordinarily pay for, which is literally what I said in the post above.

I also like all the judgmental nonsense in your messages as well, you don't know anything about me, and it makes me take nothing you say seriously when you act like that. How about you cool off and come back when you learn how to have a proper conversation?

@Pizzamorg Again - there have been 'numerous' highly rated 3rd Party games, not 'necessarily' exclusive or AAA - Vampire Survivors isn't AAA, but it is a TOP 'Bafta Award Winning' third Party game on Game Pass - so was Hi-Fi Rush, AoE 2, Pentiment etc etc - but because they are not 'AAA' or necessarily brand new (AoE2) doesn't make them somehow not worth playing or somehow makes Game Pass worse.

You just proves my point that you are only concerned about AAA highly rated games as being 'worthy' of your time - nothing else - 'top' games but ignore 'top' indie/AA games or any game that's not exclusive to Xbox even though its still adding 'value' as I don't need to spend £70 to play now, just only count 1st party AAA Exclusives because the rest are 'valueless', pointless, not worth your time or the sub fee. I as a 'GAMER' play those AAA games too, but I also play 'other' games and Game Pass gives me access to a whole range of games that I just could not afford to play. I can still play God of War Ragnarok, Spider-Man or any of the AAA games but I also won't be 'ripped' off by paying £70 for something that will be 'patched, fixed and/or improved with added options/features' and cheaper at a later date, when I have 'other' AAA £70 games I can play for 'free' on Game Pass, other great games made by independent and/or 3rd Party studios. I wouldn't normally pay for 'some' of those games because I don't have an 'unlimited' budget so had to be much more selective on how I used my money - now I can play those games and get great enjoyment from them - I don't have to miss out - which as a Gamer can be 'annoying' to miss out o great games because you don't have the budget to play everything...

Your 'whole' opening line of how many 'top' third party exclusives are on game pass just proves my point - TRUE Gamers don't just play the 'top' rated games, they play a wide variety from indies to AAA, from 1st, 3rd or small independent studios across a wide range of genres, styles etc. Minecraft is just as important as Last of Us or Ghost of Tsushima - not 'worse' because it doesn't look as good or wasn't made by a AAA studio. Ori is an award winning IP too yet not AAA and the fact you dismiss them and ALL the other games 'old or new' (A lot of old games also were rated highly at the time.

So there are a LOT of 'top' games on Game Pass from a critical perspective - but again, that doesn't mean that some 6/7 rated games aren't 'good' games worth playing if you are a 'gamer'...

When you keep going on about AAA 'top' rated 'exclusive' games, dismissing ALL the other games because they are not within that very 'narrow' criteria, its not that difficult to come to that conclusion - call it judgemental if you like, but that's only because that's how you present, what you say - the conclusion is obvious. Like I said, I'll never buy MLB, Deathloop, Ghostwire, Back 4 Blood, Plague Tale or ANY of the other AAA 'multi-platform' game on Playstation because I can play them on Game Pass for much cheaper - which as a GAMER benefits me - more great games for LESS money. Deathloop is an award winning highly rated game on Game Pass as is Vampire Survivors, Hifi Rush, Pentiment etc. Therefore when the evidence points to someone being 'wrong' and/or extremely narrow minded to think that the 'only' games worth playing, therefore the only 'value' in Game Pass to be 'found' is in those AAA highly rated Exclusives despite all those 100's of great games. I can play Starfield, Forza, Vampire Survivors, Hifi Rush, Pentiment, and '100's' of great games for less money than you can play God of War and Spider-man 2 - it doesn't make them 'worse' games because they are on Game Pass and presents far better value to appeal to GAMERS who enjoy playing GAMES - not just AAA '1st party' exclusives...

Genuinely dunno what your problem is @BAMozzy I said Gamepass is great for indies and experimental titles you may not want to spend full price on, but you just keep rambling about how I only like triple A games. In the immortal words of Hulk Hogan, don't work yourself into a shoot brother 😂

Right? What is this guys problem, dude is so rude 😂 Less candid about Xbox's limitations than Phil Spencer. 😂

@Pizzamorg it is Phil spencer… 🎵 dun Dun DUN! 😎

That would explain a lot, to be honest. 😂

@Pizzamorg I've been on your side of the Xbox argument with him before. It's a very weird situation where he claims not to be a fanboy, owns a PS5, but then goes to Xbox's defense as if he was Mel Gibson in Braveheart. I know he'll read this as well, and that's fine, as it's nothing him and I haven't discussed in the past and moved on from.

If nothing else, there's no denying that Xbox had an absolutely horrendous week. A decent amount of good smaller games do not make up for making fans wait so long for the big games, only to have the first one since the Halo Infinite debacle be another debacle overall. Whether a person thought much of Redfall from what they saw, it has been marketed as the first big exclusive since their strong few months in 2021. I must be a moron though for paying $70 for Horizon Forbidden West, God of War Ragnarok, and Spider-Man 2 shortly.

@KilloWertz I agree with everything you just posted, which must be a first.

Which of course includes you being a moron.

@Kidfried The naming has been atrocious since the 360, it beggars belief what on earth the boardroom idiots were thinking. I say ‘Series X’ incidentally, if I do have to reference the console.

@KilloWertz I don't disagree that Redfall is Disappointing and its not just the 'state' of the game at launch - which to be 'fair' is generally inherent in UE4 games this Generation. Its as bad as Star Wars: Jedi Survivor but I'd say it is better than Gotham Knights. As for the Game-play, the story, the style etc, those are all somewhat 'subjective' but overall, it has missed the mark.

However, I do object to the fact that the 'only' games that bring 'value' to Game Pass are the big AAA Exclusives. Whilst the idea of playing ALL first party games - regardless of whether they are 'smaller' passion projects (like Pentiment) or major AAA next Gen Exclusives (like Flight Sim) is a major attraction, the promise of at least 1 'big' AAA a 'quarter' from MS (their words), you can't deny that all the other Games add 'value'.

To say Game Pass is 'only' for Casuals is also completely wrong. Gamers don't just stick to their 'favourite' IP/Genre, they play 'everything' - excited by some Indies as much as any AAA games. You are 'not' stupid/moronic for paying $70 if you feel that its worth it to you but in terms of 'Value' that is the 'worst' - just to be amongst some of the first to play it. Most games launch 'incomplete' (or lacking 'features/modes' that get added later - Photo modes, Performance, new game+ etc) as well as patches to fix bugs/glitches and balance issues etc. Depending on the game, it can be 50% lower in cost and 50% 'better' than it was at launch - if that's 'OK' for you, carry on...

As I said, I don't think ANY game is worth that much - just because its 'new' when months later its less than half that price and arguably in a better state to be played. In other words, they become better games and better value by waiting. Would you be 'happy' paying £70 for Cyberpunk, Gotham Knights, Redfall etc - games that launched in a 'poor' state - especially now as Cyberpunk is in a much better state and much cheaper too. The fact is I can 'try' Redfall, not get 'sucked' in by the Hype to 'pre-order/buy' at launch, and still have that '£70' to spend on great games in Sales. I also don't think that 'PS5/XSX' should charge £10 'more' just because it gets closer to high end PC visual Quality. Redfall isn't in great place, maybe never will be, but I haven't wasted money on it and can move on to 'other' games until its 'fixed' (or just never return).

Anyway, the point I was trying to make is that games like Vampire Survivors is a 'top' game on Game Pass bringing 'value' to that service, All the indies do as do the AAA games, 3rd party games etc. As I said, why would I play MLB, Back4Blood, Plague Tale, Minecraft: Legends etc etc too on PS5 when I can play them Day/Date on Xbox for 'free' essentially - meaning the money they 'cost' is in 'my' pocket. I still get the 'same' experience for a fraction of the cost adding to the 'value' of Game Pass - its NOT just AAA 1st Party Games like Forza, Starfield etc but Games in general

I will say that Game Pass isn't perhaps great (at the moment) for those who 'only' sub for AAA Exclusives nor Casuals because games get removed - you could start something and the next time you play, its 'gone' - as was claimed it was 'best' for - but for 'Gamers', there is great value. This year alone has had games like Goldeneye, AoE2, HiFi Rush, Atomic Heart, Wo Long, Valheim, MLB23, Minecraft Legends, Last Case of Benedict Fox etc etc with games like ExoPrimal, Lies of P, Starfield, Forza, Flintlock etc to come. Maybe not a 'lot' of AAA Exclusives but a lot of great games adding 'value' that would cost you a lot more to play without Game Pass or if you are on Playstation only - if you buy Atomic Heart and MLB23, that's the 'cost' of a year on GP and get more games inc those you bought on PS5. Maybe not all will be 90+ on metacritic either, but that doesn't mean a game isn't 'worth' playing because its only a 7/10. Maybe not all are AAA, but as Vampire Survivors proves, it can still be the BAFTA Game of the Year winner beating God of War & Horizon Forbidden West to that accolade.

I am 'defending' Xbox on a Playstation site to try and bring some 'balance' to the discussion as its a very one-sided and heavily bias towards PS. I am not happy with the state of Redfall, but I'd be a LOT more angry if I paid £70 and got that, got a game I can't 'play' for weeks/months because of technical issues - like I did with Cyberpunk 2077 for example. It's no worse than a LOT of UE4 games, better than some too from a technical perspective - but as this is a 'first' party release, its held up to more scrutiny and had far more expectation to live up to - and 'failed' to do so. I'd still rather play that than Destruction Allstars for example.

PS+ has 'no' value to me because the vast majority of titles - especially Sony's own first party, are games I OWN, I bought, I have played and/or finished by the time they are added. I could 'wait' for GoW:R (I bought H:FW anyway as they back tracked on the $70 and loved the first) to come to PS+ to add 'value' to me, but I expect to buy it before then in a sale, same with Spider-Man 2 - Black Friday is coming - same as I buy Ubisoft or EA or WB games for example, sometime after launch when they are cheaper and/or 'fixed'. I have never played a LOT of Game Pass games because they are 'new' when they come - games I liked or interested me and would have considered playing at some point (if my finances allowed) anyway.

Xbox has had a 'bad' week, but to say the 'only' value in Game Pass is AAA first Party games scoring 'high' on Metacritic to be 'worth' playing and only good for casuals is completely wrong. I believe ALL games have 'value' and some 'indies' are actually better from a game-play perspective than AAA games that look 'stunning' so to dismiss them too is wrong.

I am not denying Redfall 'failed' or that Xbox has had a Bad week, all I am saying is that Game Pass itself is still amazing value for 'GAMERS'. Casuals maybe won't play enough, lose access to games before they have finished playing etc to be 'put off' from paying the fee every month and if you are Subbing 'just' AAA 'exclusive' games that score 85+ on Metacritic because all 3rd Party multi-plat AAA 85+ games you'll 'buy' on PS5/Steam/PC anyway, its perhaps not worth it right now. But dedicated, hardcore gamers will always find something great to play, not be 'put' off because its not the 'visual' showcase and/or made by a small independent studio.

I am sure you as a Gamer don't 'just' play AAA games that score highly, enjoy playing a more varied selection, enjoy many indies etc and can see the 'value' in getting 'brand new' games every month to play. Its not 'stopping' me from playing AAA games not on Game Pass, in fact I have 'more' money to spend on them as I am not 'budgeting' to buy Starfield, Forza etc. I just won't spend £70 because I can buy a 'top' rated AAA game, albeit a few months or so after it launched for less and its likely to be in a much more playable state too.

All I said about the 'money' side of things - take MLB23, Wo Long and Lies of P - if you wanted to play on Playstation, that will cost more than 1yr of Game Pass yet on Xbox, you get those as well as numerous other 'new' releases so why would I 'buy' on PS5? Why spend more than 6months of GP for a single game I'll finish in a week or two - just to be amongst the 'first' to play it. Spider-Man 2 maybe a GotY contender, but so could Starfield and Forza will probably be the best Racing game of the year and Spider-Man 2 will no doubt be 'cheaper' when it comes to PC/PS+ (as well as places like Amazon, Game etc will drop prices too, and then there is also Ebay...

As a gamer, I play far more games, many of which I would of 'dismissed' because I didn't have the 'budget' so I too would only buy games I thought would be 'safe' purchases and/or highly rated AAA games because I couldn't afford to 'buy' everything that interested me. I would never buy Ori for example - an award winning indie game because its 'money' I could spend on something 'else' something 'bigger' in scale/scope etc on sale for similar cash that would present as 'better' value. Game Pass is 'better' value because for £12 a month, I get hundreds of 'great' games - some of which will be '£70' games, as well as all the £20-£40 indie/AA games, some of which do score 'well' on Metacritic and offer a wide variety of interesting ideas.

As I constantly say, each to their own - you have to decide what's right for you, your budget etc - but dismissing the 'value' of Game Pass based purely on AAA Exclusives - when its also providing numerous other AAA multi-platform releases, AA/Indie games etc too is somewhat ridiculous. Vampire Survivors (not really my thing) is BAFTA's 2022 Game of the Year - available on Game Pass.

I'm scared please protect me 😂

But yeah, I think you nailed it to be honest. Had Xbox's output been bigger over the last 12 or so months Redfall might have still bombed, but it would have also been probably fairly quickly forgotten about too, but for as much as Bam is saying otherwise, Xbox only fans are really starving right now if you are chasing that system selling exclusive.

I also felt so rough about paying full price for Ragnarok, but what a phenomenal game that turned out to be. I would have been gutted if that was on the level of Redfall, so thank Goodness for Gamepass in that regard 😂

@JohnnyShoulder I walked into that one, so I can't say much.

I'm still waiting on the day I can say I completely agree with something you posted.

@Pizzamorg Nope. You got yourself in this mess. You have to get yourself out.

Definitely. People would have been pissed initially, but then people would have fairly quickly turned their sights on to Starfield or just went back to the game they were playing previously. The fact that there was basically nothing in terms of major exclusives since late 2021 and Redfall was positioned as the first one since then made the whole thing far worse. Well, that and the fact that to most people it's a turd. A shame since it probably could have carved out a decent following for a while if it was even remotely finished. No matter how many awards an indie gem on Game Pass wins, it's the expected and promised major exclusives that would dig them out of this hole and is what a lot of fans want after all of the acquisitions and promises, and they are still gamers.

I only pay full price for the occasional major PlayStation exclusive, not counting the occasional indie title that releases far cheaper. I'll pay $70 for Final Fantasy XVI, but it's a game I want to play right away and Final Fantasy games that are timed exclusives might as well be considered PlayStation exclusives anyways.

The thing with Redfall is that its failure is a big deal in the context of Microsoft's own inability to release games at a decent clip. I think something like Pokemon Scarlet/Violet being buggy would have had a much bigger impact on the public perception of the Switch, for example, if that had been the platform's only major exclusive in 1.5 years.

@Kidfried If a console called the "Wii" can sell over 100 million units, I don't see why the Series X would have issues. It's far less confusing than "Xbox One" was, IMO.

I'm not personally of the opinion that the majority of consumers require simple numerical naming schemes to avoid confusion.

I do think they require games to be excited about, though.

@Ralizah Personally, I think Series S and X is a bit confusing, coming off the back of the already confusing Xbox One doesn’t help. Whether that’s actively damaging sales is up for debate. Consider that you may be right about “Wii”, but certainly the name “Wii U” did Nintendo not many favours!

@kyleforrester87 Literally nothing about the Wii U did Nintendo any favors. Most still think it's some sort of Wii accessory.

Anecdotal, but I've talked to normal folk who just sort of game casually, and they never seem confused about the Series S/X thing. I don't think it's a big deal.