Topic: You Died. The Dark Souls Series Discussion Thread

@HallowMoonshadow DS2 is going swimmingly, thanks. I still really enjoy it, but I’m playing it very slowly. I’m at level 105 and still just barely lit my first primal bonfire. I’ve done some farming and also taken time to play other games alongside. It’s great though. Not sure where it will land on the pecking order of From games, but it’s definitely worthy of inclusion.

I’m doing well with Hex build with a dash of Dex. The Lightning infused rapier has been dominating and the Hexes are a nice addition. I’ve had to pour a lot of points into Int/Faith to make the Hexing viable, but it’s been worth it. My next goal is getting Dex up to 25 so I can wield the Warped Sword I got from Straid.

You’ve made amazing progress in DS3. Would you say it’s overall easier than DS1 and DS2? I know it’s all dependent on the build and the player, but in general what’s your take?

@Th3solution I wouldn’t necessarily say DS3 is “easier” in the streamlined sense of the word. As a matter of fact, I’ll just come out and say I think none of the dark souls trilogy games are hard and most of the difficulty purely comes from lack of familiarity. I don’t feel DS3 is noticeably more challenging or noticeably more punishing. A quick NG+ run would take more time in DS3 than it would in DS1 and there are a few other things to keep track of that aren’t in the other two DSs, making 3 generally feel a tad meatier than its predecessors.

Since there’s a little more to keep track of and a little less customizability (no armor upgrades) and bigger maps.

Though you could argue DS3 is mentally more challenging cuz there’s no Emerald Herald to make you feel at ease every time you see her. : (

I know the question wasn’t directed at me but I’ve wanted to share my two cents! Hope this helps!

Jesus Sol level 105 and you've only took down The Lost Sinner? (I assume since she's the easiest and closest to reach)

I think I was maybe level 140~150 when beating the game! I'm only 84 in DS 3!!!

Good to hear the lightning infusion is working out nicely for you though! And as I said before hexing is great. I love hexing in DS2! I had a fun time doing a fairly similar build as you.

It may've seemed quick but the in game timer says 40 hours and I have played it twice before (Granted that was right at release) so I recall the general way of progression.

As for the difficultly? Honestly it goes in the order of release for me

Demon's (PS3) is ridiculously easy to tear apart. DS1 is a bit harder but still fairly easy. DS2 has some decent bosses and the ambushes make traversal more life threatening. Bloodborne is a good challenge and DS3 has a very similar speed to it and most enemies or bosses do have moves to deal with you trying to hug their bodies.

I've died a good few times despite having beaten over half the bosses on my first attempt (The most so far has been 4 attempts).

But ya know... That's me now of course with all those under my belt. Playing Demon's for the first time seemed insurmountable, restarting the game over 6 times and I got so frustrated with dying not being used to this new bood stain mechanic...

It's all relative and each game has always been a challenge the first time I picked it up.

I hadn't seen this when writing the final bit of my post but yeah, it's pretty much exactly this. Ya just have to learn the tells and patterns for attacks and such along with whatever new mechanics there are.

Nice Noire profile pic by the way~!

@HallowMoonshadow oooooh, thank you. :0
Nice Reload Aigis avatar to you as well!

@Yousef- Ah, interesting. I am really excited to eventually get to DS3. In my mind I thought maybe it was ‘easier’ because I’ve heard a lot about it being more aggressive and action oriented, similar to Bloodborne. And the fact that it is far and away the best selling of the trilogy, so I thought both of those things made it a little more mainstream. But it sounds like it’s properly tough and complicated.

And no Emerald Herald is definitely a bummer! Although I think I like the Maiden in Black even more, but the calm and soothing ladies that level you up are a nice change of pace.

And thanks for jumping in, I do love to hear about everyone’s thoughts and experiences. 😄

@HallowMoonshadow I have done a couple optional bosses like the Gargoyles and Ruin Sentinel, but yeah - I’m certainly overleveled for where I am. I’ve done several runs back and forth and it’s like you and Yousef said, when you know where you’re going and the general layout it’s a lot easier than the first time through. I’ve wasted a lot of time going back to a bonfire when I’ve accumulated a lot of souls out of fear of losing them on some crazy mini boss around the corner or falling to my death off an unseen ledge or getting ganged by an ambush. And often you trek back with your 10,000 souls to the nearest bonfire travel back to Majula, level up, only to find out you were just a short distance from the next bonfire if you would have simply just kept going. 😅 So what should have taken 5 minutes has now taken 20 with the trekking back and forth.

My PS4’s timer says 37 hrs, if that’s accurate. So I reckon this rate will get me a total playtime of close to 100 hrs. We’ll see. I think there’s a heavy investment up front and perhaps the latter stages will be quicker now that my build is close to being done.

And that makes sense about the escalation of difficulty with each entry. Certainly each game has become more complex as they go. Although World Tendency was just way out of line there. 😂

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A quick question for you both (or anyone else passing by):
What can you tell me about Power Stancing? I mean, I’ve read wikis on it and I get the gist of it, but like infusions, it seems quite complicated with the math of getting the stats right and so I had planned to just skip it and not worry about it this run, but now I’m curious to try it. When I get leveled high enough to use my Warped Sword I might try it out (although I’m not sure if it’s possible with the rapier, but I can use a dagger or something else if need be). Did either of you rely on Power Stancing much?

I think the difficulty in these games is a bit over stated at times. Making my through the Elden Ring expansion, and I've decided no to rely on spirit ashes so much.

I found I was using them for some bosses too quickly, rather than figuring it out for myself the best approach. The ones when I've done the latter I've enjoyed way more. So I will only be using them from now if I'm really struggling.

There's no Emerald herald (Or her delightful Irish accent) in DS3 @Th3solution but there is a firekeeper who's quite nice and comforting ala the doll or maiden in black.

And DS2 is long. Including the DLC's i wouldn't be surprised if it was closer to 150 hours the rate you're going.

As for power stancing... I only tried it briefly but it's a pretty cool mechanic from what I remember.

In DS3 there are dedicated "twin" weapons that when you decide to two hand them it means you dual wield another and they're fine but I think Power stancing is more unique about it?

@HallowMoonshadow Yes, the DLC’s for DS2 seem quite large. I see they are well received though and apparently give some really great weapons and gear, so I think I want to do them all, but I don’t know. As is typical for FromSoft, they are supposedly more difficult than the base game, which could be good or bad, depending how I am getting along when I get to that point. In DS1 I played the DLC prior to the final sequence to end the game and I was fairly OP which did make the end bosses a little anti-climactic. I’m fine with that though in games like these since there’s plenty of epic showdowns along the way.

I’ll let you know if I can find some place in my arsenal for power stancing. As far as late game effectiveness I think my issue might be lack of resources to upgrade my gear, so I’ll need to take advantage of every tactic I can get my hands on. I’ve screwed up all but one of my encounters with the Pursuer, so I’ve left like 3 Twinkling Titanites on the table. And I may have missed one crystal lizard. So I may have to farm those. 😅

Good to hear that there’s a nice fire keeper still to look forward to. 😊
As for DS3, is there a build that seems to be the easiest to capitalize on? Or is it just like the others where magic is slightly overpowered? I’ve done a couple magic builds and for Bloodborne I did a balance build. For DS3 I’m thinking of finally doing a heavy armor strength build where I just tank damage and smash. I’ve yet to do that kind of playthrough in a Souls game.

I believe you can fight the final boss is DS2 and it doesn't automatically go to new game + @Th3solution (And in DS2 NG+ actually changes up some enemies and mimic placements)?

I'm not sure if beating the DLC is a prerequisite that adds something to that fight though. I can't really say more without a slight spoiler but let's just say the intended final boss is ridiculously easy.

I couldn't quite tell you tbh. I've heard nagic is nerfed in every game but I still think it's pretty viable even then. I think the DLC's for 2 really ramp up the magic/elemental resistances from what I recall though?

And that's what I'm doing in DS3. I switched up my cleaver to a greathammer that can inflict frostbite (A new Bleed like effect) and having a grand old time obliterating everything.

I've only got the penultimate mainline boss and the final boss left to beat alongside the hardest secret boss... who I know will make me work to actually beat him...

@HallowMoonshadow Nice. 😄 Do you solo your bosses or use NPC and player summons? Do you do much PvP? Or don’t play offline to avoid such shenanigans?

I’m playing online and fortunately there’s not much activity online right now for DS2. I don’t really want to engage in PvP.

As for summoning, I have been using NPC summons a lot more this game than I have in others. I didn’t realize how much easier it can make certain bosses. Now I’m addicted to trying to find the NPC summon before each boss. 😅

@Th3solution hello there friend. I’m incredibly late since I had to rest a lot today. Super long Monday. I hope I can remember everything I wanted to write down when I saw ur reply this morning.
In any case, Ah, fascinating! The BB comparison is a classic and common one, and might have a little to it than you might think. Indeed Bloodborne has its DNA somewhere within DS3, but it’s now how you think or for the reasons you think.

Indeed DS3 did implement faster combat, but it retains famous elements that maintained the trilogy appeal’s appeal such as thought provoking boss and the methodical combat you’re vert much familiar, it just has a touch of speed added to it not to unlike the DLC in DS1. You may also encounter the classic problem-solving puzzle bosses. Not necessarily on the same scale as Gwyn who was practically begging you to use the parry, but you are still gonna be using your brain a lot in DS3.

I also agree the maiden in black is an elegant beauty!

This might be starting to get long, but excuse me for mentioning one other detail and it’s FS’s tendency to carry over stuff from almost any of their old games. In that sense, the BB comparison could actually be null. But it’s fascinating nonetheless.

Hmmmmmm I’d argue you don’t require it for the reasons you think. Power stancing is very complicated, very late game stuff and it’s mainly for stylish points. You don’t power stance to show your mastery, you power stance put people in their place, to send a message, to show who’s BOSS. it’s not a mechanic, it’s a lifestyle! That’s how you should approach it!

The BEST ds3 build to capitalize on is the build YOURE most confident and most comfortable with and the build that suits YOUR personality most. Nothing else matters, period. Str? Dex? Str+faith? Magic? Err no don’t use the last one it’s nerfed like hell but that’s besides the point.

The REAL point is is that it DOESNT MATTER WHAT YOUR BUILD IS

you play DS3 like it’s a part of your soul. The game has so much creativity, customizabity, accessibility and personality that it’s almost criminal to undercut it all by implying there’s even an “optimal” build. It might’ve been easier to find that in DS1, back when the series was in its infancy but how deeply matured the mechanics became, your builds are now an expression, not a gameplay mechanic. That’s the beauty of DS3, it’s more than a game, it’s a lifestyle, mate!

I do solo bosses… LIKA A BOSS!!! But that’s not me being elitist. As someone with almost a decade worth of experience of dark souls in her life, I can assure you. Solo’ing bosses is ezpz lemon squeezy.

Enjoy Dark Sousling! Don’t go hollow and remember dark souls has objectively the best girls in gaming!

I only use summons in DS2 because of how the end to Lucatiel's questline is tied to them @Th3solution (Even if she has a nasty habit of falling off the wharf. I love her though).

I solo them otherwise... Mainly cus I don't have plus but I also just like doing it for myself.

I have played DS3 online before in the past and helped others out with a number of bosses. It's quite fun and fulfilling. l'm not like "let me solo her" player from Elden Ring though... He's mad!

Just an FYI @Yousef- but when you did the last quote of Th3solution tagging me, it means I just got a notification saying you had tagged me!

I think it happened a few days ago in the game club thread too which meant everyone in the tag list there got pinged with a notification from you so you might wanna remove the @ or the entire name if you do that going forward!

Oh and... It's nice to finally have another girl around here regularly in the forums... Even if I'm old enough to be your mother

@HallowMoonshadow oh snaaaaap I really messed up there! I did actually later discover how quoting can ping others, but it was long after that message was gone from my conscience, so I never put two and two together. Now that you brought it into my attention, I’m swimming in embarrassment xDD.

Likewise! Glad to meet you as well : D
And funnily enough, I somehow DO relate to what you’re saying. Not even a month ago, I met another girl in these very forums whos… young enough to be my nephew xDDD. What are the odds!

@Yousef- Thanks for the information! I’m glad to see that power stancing isn’t critical to the experience. I’m not nearly at Boss level skills so I will save it for a curiosity later in my playthrough.

And it’s encouraging that all builds are viable. It’s amazing that FromSoft has kept such balance and yet so much individuality in how these games can be approached. In all my From experiences I’ve gravitated toward dodge rolling and maintaining quickness, through balance builds or magic and dex builds. However, I do like having varied experiences and sometimes I feel envious of those with a tank build who don’t have to worry about timing dodges and can just spam a heavy shield and heavy armor and whack away. I want to try that sometime. But like you say, I have a feeling that my inner personality will break through and I’ll end up trying to use magic or dodge rolling. 😅

@HallowMoonshadow Yeah, the AI on some of the summons has been unintentionally humorous. The last couple bosses what I’ve done is kill all the enemies myself on the way to the boss, then go back to the summon sign and pull in the NPC summon once the path is clear. That way there’s less chance of them dying to a random common enemy or to being pushed off a cliff (or walk off a cliff! 😂). Also their health bar is full at the start of the boss.

A couple of the bosses I’ve been able to have two NPC’s help me.

As for online co-op I haven’t really engaged, even though I have PS+. It seems like more of a wild card there and I just don’t know. Maybe I’ll try it out for the next boss encounter.

I also haven’t been rating or reading many of the player messages this time around. There seems to be so many fake and useless ones in DS2, more so than I recall from other Souls games I played.

Aww no I'm sorry for bringing it to your attention and embarrassing you! Though... What's a lady old enough to be your mother to do? Embarrassing kids is what a mother does no @Yousef-?

I guess that girl's over on NintendoLife huh? Over here on Push pretty much every regular here is a guy except me. They're all nice of course but it's nice to have someone here who gets being a girl gamer... Even if there's a bit of an age gap!

Oh really @Th3solution? I thought the health bars for NPC summons were rather generous in DS2... I don't really recall there being any problems with one dying (Except in the DLC) aside from the awful pathfinding and falling.

After beating your next boss maybe slap your summon sign down and engage in some jolly cooperation to make Solaire proud?

Though with how little it's being played you may not get a bite unless you do it outside a major boss?

The messages are bad in every game sol... You don't know how many times I've seen variations of chests, rears or worse strewn in front of female npcs 😅

@Th3solution apologies for not mentioning this but it might be important to highlight “gamefeel” across the the three the games. This won’t be something you’d immediately experience going from 1 to 2, but it’s extremely noticeable across the trilogy as a whole. As you’ll feel DS3 is closer to DS1’s gamefeel than 2 and 2 while start to finally stick out as the “odd duck” that you keep hearing about. I frankly believe DS2 deserves its “odd duckling” status, despite being a good game. It goes against many Miyazaki-isms, as you’ll notice with continues replays of all three games.

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@HallowMoonshadow No biggie! It was merely humorous, if nothing else. And you make a valid point about mothers embarrassing their kids, that’s one funky way to further cement the age gap xDD
But it’s pleasure to make your acquaintance anyhoots! ^^
Yeah, she’s in NL. She mainly hangs in Chit-Chat, self-proclaimed President, even! Our friendship is very recent but it’s a friendship I’m happy about anyways! She’s been quiet recently. A little birdie told me there’s a storm coming where she lives and there’s an outage too but it could be old news and it passed days ago. Hope she’s safe anyways.

Gamer girls for life indeed!

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This last bit is directed at both users. NPC summons, from my experience, are indeed extremely generous. They can be quite the MVPs in a lot of encounters. So if they die… well it’s awkward to say “get gud” here so uhhhh… “protect gud”?

I’m also gonna share another one of my more “wild” takes. The “bad” online messages are part of the experience! Sometimes you gotta toughen up! At least that’s one mentality I tend to carry in life from time to time xD.

@Yousef- @HallowMoonshadow The NPC summons are sort of a cheat code, for sure. I think I did lose one in a boss fight once though, although most of them are able to survive the fight.

I did a lot of things wrong in my first From game - Bloodborne (didn’t really follow a build, never understood how to use the firearms, missed some of the areas, never knew how to use magic, etc) but not ever knowing that I could summon help was maybe the worst shortcoming. Although, in retrospect I loved that game the most of any of them, so maybe soloing all the bosses made the experience sweeter.

@Th3solution reading what you've posted over the last few days, I think Elden Ring will be right up your street.

The open world nature of the game and things like Spirit Ashes (npc summons which you can equip and use in designated areas), make the game feel much more manageable than FromSoftware's previous games.

@JohnnyShoulder Oh, I had read the term ‘Spirit Ashes’ and didn’t realize that’s what it is. I figured it was some really powerful magic spell, but if it’s equippable NPC summon, that’s awesome. In the Souls games it’s easy to miss an NPC summon sign if you’re not in human form or don’t know where to look for it.

I have a friend who tried Bloodborne and hated it but has played Elden Ring and absolutely loves it.