Marvel’s Avengers should have been the most straightforward of slam-dunks for publisher Square Enix, but the backlash against the release has been substantial to say the least. Many fans have been left frustrated by the cloak-and-dagger approach that Crystal Dynamics has taken towards showcasing gameplay, while others feel like the cast look like poor imitators of their Marvel Cinematic Universe counterparts.
Troy Baker, who plays Bruce Banner in the game, feels that people are overreacting: “We’ll always be on someone’s sh*t list, right? So when they launched the latest trailer and put it out there, the immediate backlash from fans was, ‘It doesn’t look like Chris Evans! It doesn’t look like Robert Downey Jr!’ Well, you know who it does look like? It looks exactly like Iron Man. It looks exactly like Captain America. It looks exactly like Bruce Banner.”
Speaking at Manchester Comic-Con, the star added that “there is nothing we will ever be able to do that will top what you saw in the MCU” so expressed his desire to do something different. “For me, the second they showed me what Bruce looked like, I was like, ‘Oh, you stole from the Ultimates.’ It looks 100 per cent like the guy from Ultimates. And I’m like, ‘That’s my Bruce Banner. That’s the guy that literally ate New York and cannot reconcile the guilt.’”
Nolan North, who’s assuming the role of Iron Man in the game, added that the developer is really respecting the source material. “I think we’re doing real justice to the true nature of the characters and to the real fans of the comic books,” he explained. “What we did growing up, imagining ourselves in those panels – that’s what the game lets you do,” Baker agreed.
You can read more from our chat with Nolan North and Troy Baker through the link.
[source News: Feature: Gatecrashing Gaming's Greatest Bromance with Troy Baker and Nolan North]
Comments 53
Accepting feedback is the key to success, in any venture.
In my opinion, if the game-play had stood up and made people excited, they wouldn't have been so disappointed at the character models. I felt that the reveal of the characters was the final nail that pushed people over the edge into anger and disappointment.
Had they modelled the characters on the film versions, I bet people would of still been disappointed by the Game-play - turning round and saying its yet another failed film tie-in game. We all know how games based off of films generally disappoint...
I was looking forward to this - Crystal Dynamics had done a great job with bringing Lara back but when I saw the first game-play, I was left feeling disappointed. I couldn't really care about the Character models because the game looked 'Meh' but for others, the character models pushed them over the edge into outrage...
@Mega-Gazz Depends on the nature of said feedback. People are quick to point out issues but don't provide solutions.
Its not just about looking like the character. It looks like a ps2 game.the ps4 is reaching the end of its lifecycle
@johnny30 That's not fair. It clearly looks far better than a PS2 game!
Troy Baker... I've seen that name somewhere before... Oh right, on every single PS4 exclusive! Great voice actor though.
Of course Captain America doesn't look like Chris Evans, he looks like B.J. Blazkowicz of Woflenstein fame.
At least in the above pic lol.
@AdamNovice It isn’t their job to offer solutions...though that would be nice. The “wisdom of the crowd” is not usually wrong, that is well documented. Even if it is wrong, the developer should be humbly accepting feedback and thinking about it instead of being defensive or dismissive.
The issue is them hiding the footage and now showing us exactly what the game is. After viewing the he leaked footage I still do not understand what the gas me is outside of the combat nor do I feel positive or negative. With Batman and Spider-Man we knew exactly what we were getting. The micros transaction for costumes is a HUGE turn off too especially when Spider-Man has unlockable suits. The lack of characters is another issue where as Marvel Ultimate Alliance 3 has tons of already playable characters.
@get2sammyb I’d love to see someone actually get this game running in at least 30fps on a PS2 if we wanna be literal...
@Mega-Gazz The issue with the "wisdom of the crowd" is that the loud minority who complains is usually an incredibly small percentage. In trying to please everyone (mostly the aforementioned minority of eternally unhappy players), they would end up with a bland and boring game, or a copy of the MCU.
@get2sammyb i was exaggerating, just surprised considering its the same team that made deus ex human revolution/mankind divided. not the same quality
The thing that bothers me a bit more is how overused Troy Baker and Nolan North are. I get that they're great at what they do, but guys, hire someone else for a change.
@AdamNovice But it isn't people's job to point solutions.. A game is a product like any other: the clients tell what they don't like and if the devs listen to critcs and find the solutions, maybe at the end they have a good game and will sell well. If not, people simply won't buy the game.
@johnny30 lol ok
I have been gaming a long time. One of the most annoying things about this era of games is that people make harsh judgments about games based on a few minutes of footage before anyone in the public has even played it. Varied opinions are great, but over the top vitriol can get annoying.
That being said, the very talented Mr. Baker owes his great career partly to the hype surrounding big games. It is a double edged sword. People get really excited about this stuff, which is part of what makes games big business The early criticism/disappointment is the downside of hype, and would appear to come with the territory.
@Mega-Gazz There's an old Sufi tale about the wisdom of crowds, suffice it to say, it does not end well for the innocent victim.
The character models aren't even the problem for me. The gameplay just looked...basic. It looks very good graphically, but the gameplay itself just didnt click with me. And yea its what I was hoping it would be: a third person action adventure but idk man. Maybe I'm just burnt out from all the movies or something. But hey cant maybe I'll actually end up loving it when I eventually play it
I don't get why people thought this was gonna be based on the movie versions of the characters. It would have been very difficult to get the MCU actors time wise let alone pay them lol
I do agree that square Enix should be showing more uncut gameplay tho.
It's Black Widow's ton of hair that gets me. Is it in place of a crash helmet?
I really don't care either way, the game looks like a 5/10 Xbox 360 game from 2006, but this is a situation of their own making. The game has hype purely because of the MCU yet they were too cheap to pay for the likenesses. The backlash shows this; if people were interested purely based on it being a good game, no one would care if they look like the MCU versions. It does stand out, even to someone like me who has no interest in the game, because all the hype is dependent on the MCU's popularity.
I don't get the frustration. To me the characters look like characters from Marvel's Spider-Man - the PS4 exclusive. Which got some criticism as well. People complained about Mary Jane not looking like a porn star and instead looking like a girl next door.
I think, if the original Marvel's Spider-Man E3 debut trailer focused on character faces like Peter Parker's, aunt May's, Octavius' and Mary Jane's, people would have had more or less the same reactions.
The action from the leaked Avengers' gameplay looked solid and AAA to me. The guy who claims the game looks like a PS2 title is either delusional or insane. Or simply exaggerates to a ridiculous degree.
I don't care about the visual design. I care about it being yet another tiresome live service in an era flooded with them.
I just don't think the gameplay looks terribly exciting at the moment and it just kind of looks like a poorer version of those games it takes inspiration from
Another thing I'll say is that I don't recall this game ever billing itself as a part of the MCU, and neither was Spiderman. So if nobody was upset about that game not using Tom Holland's likeness, why are they upset here?
I mean they do look like they're "AVONGERS: EARTHS STRONGEST MEN!" or some other Chinese toy knock off but I hardly care it's their own version of something that's been done dozens of times. Just try making the game good.
I want to see more gameplay, I don’t care how the characters faces look. If the game is good I’m fine with that.
honestly i would rather they do their own thing instead of making it like the MCU so i'm fine with them not looking like the actors from the films
@Mega-Gazz Depends how you give feedback a lot of gamers act like little ****ers with downright abusive comments.
@johnny30 So, this is what a VERY late PS2 Marvel game (2009) looks like.
It's just that MCU has set some serious standards and although biased, it's understandable why people were expecting them to at least look close to the Hollywood version.
Gameplay-wise it looks really solid, it reminds me of God of War a bit, so on that regard, I think it's perfect.
I'm not bothered with the character models, but am worried that the gameplay footage they've released so far hasn't looked that interesting. Either the gameplay is going to be mediocre, or they've done a bad job so far of showing just how good it is.
@LowTech It's also not the job of consumers to pick out every single issue with a game but they do it anyway.
@Flopsy What do you mean by people being "bored of the MCU" last I looked Avengers Endgame is highest grossing movie of all time and Spider-Man Far from Home made over a billion. And both were well received by critics. If anything the MCU is as popular as ever.
@AdamNovice Yeah although to be fair that's only if you don't adjust for inflation. The value of a dollar isn't constant throughout time so it means modern films seem to be making more than they really are compared to older ones - a dollar used to be worth way more. If you adjust for inflation, it's only 16th - still really good though.
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/alltime/adjusted.htm
I really don't get the hate for this. The gameplay looks fine - not amazing, but not terrible either. The visuals also look pretty current gen to me, so I'm confused by the accusations of it looking poor.
@Flopsy Not even close to the truth, despite how many people keep saying it. The latest Spider-man movie, which has already outperformed every single Spiderman movie, says otherwise. Interest in the MCU is alive and well.
@Orpheus79V people tend to follow the herd. If enough people say x, many others will believe it because others are saying it.
If they would have been confident enough to show actual gameplay during the reveal (instead of relying on breakdowns and leaked behind closed door footage), it might have been different. If they had taken a leaf out of Insomniac's book and really made the characters their own version, it might have been different. The reveal raised more questions than answers, which is probably not the feeling they wanted to go for when they were ~11 months away from launch at the time.
The character models are clearly inspired by the MCU, but are definitely not the MCU characters. That puts them in a sort of uncanny valley-like place for me.
I'll keep an eye on this, but I am more interested in the inevitable Spider-Man 2 on PS5.
As was said above, nobody seemed to complain when Peter Parker didn’t look like Tom Holland in the recent Spider Man game. I personally like the fact that the developers took some inspiration from the Ultimates comics. This title’s a long way off from release. I think there’s a lot to see before any kind of firm judgements can be made one way or another. That said, I’m sure there will be a number of Marvel fans that will be disappointed because one or more unspoken wishes weren’t met by the final product.
My only issue is that Cap looks like crap. He looks like he could barely lead a SWAT team, much less The Avengers. Other than that, I'm optimistic enough to wait for them to show what they want when they...y'know.
Want to.
People can not form their own opinion today the look for a group to make it for them. I have loved games the crowd hated and hated games the crowd loved. I will make my choice in 2020 when the game releases. I am still on the BUY side today.
@AdamNovice Maybe his comment is more on how Marvel (and to a lesser extend DC) are not letting us breathe from all this super hero crap, feels like were are getting these movies every couple of weeks now.
The people just want more spandex, give them what they want dammit!
@Juanalf Honestly, we’re getting less now that we were. The current slate is definitely lighter as they’re wanting to push the streaming service and all that. I think the super hero fatigue thing is more wishful thinking from a group of people than an actual trend, given that Endgame’s the highest grossing movie ever (not counting inflation).
I don't have an issue that the characters don't look like the MCU movie versions. I wan't even expecting it to be based on the MCU versions in the first place. My issue is that character designs aren't very good in general.
Also, Troy Baker clearly doesn't know what he's talking about when he said the Bruce Banner from the game looks 100% like the one from the Ultimates.
Actually, the game's version looks bit more like Mark Ruffalo's Bruce Banner from the first Avengers movie.
https://d13ezvd6yrslxm.cloudfront.net/wp/wp-content/images/ZZ27A9B4E1.jpg
Here's the thing, the MCU has been a resounding indisputable success. No matter your personal opinion on the MCU you cannot deny it has been one of the most successful series of any fictional product, book, comic, game, movie, whatever, of all time.
The MCU is iconic. There is no way you can release anything Marvel, ever again, and NOT be compared to the MCU. Never gonna happen. Like it or not, Robert Downey Jr., Cris Evans, and Chris Hemmsworth are the most well known faces of Iron Man, Captain America and Thor now. They just are. And that's not changing anytime soon.
@Rhaoulos he wasn't Spiderman, or Cloud in the ff7 remake, Kratos, or Nathaniel Drake etc, etc. I could go on, but I think you get the point.
@AdamNovice No, but it's their right, as consumers.. This is political and economical "thing", not a matter of games.. If you are not happy, you can allways point what you don't like. Even if you don't have the answer to the problem.. That's a free democracy my friend.. In terms of economy, a companie that doesn't listen to the consumers, is doomed (or, at least, the future is not that bright)
I just think the game doesn't look all that good. Or exciting.
@Matroska I don't think adjusted box offices should be taken into account really cos I think you can only judge a film's success by the era it came out in.
@WallaceRudolph Please do go on, I need a complete list to understand your point.
@WanderingBullet There's actually a good bit of resemblance between the game character and that comic panel, tbh, especially in the chin.
Honestly though using the "just like the comics" vs "nothing like the comics" argument doesn't hold too much real weight, given that different artists can draw the same character very differently.
Case-in-point: Mary Jane Watson.
John Romita:
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/9a/8d/b5/9a8db565868e5b9875fbc9b73ff4fb83.jpg
Humberto Ramos:
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/2b/53/53/2b5353a959d5547d9a1d3ae45a17301d.jpg
J. Scott Campbell
http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/236x/d4/b4/78/d4b47874468da5341990e72ed8f5dbe7.jpg
Mike Deodato Jr.
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/69/1f/af/691faf0777756c1fa2997335160f393c.jpg
Really, the best they could do is their own designs. Which they did.
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