Psychonauts 2 Will Also Release on PS4 This August

I think they said it would come to other platforms back when MS got Double Fine but then they didn't mention it again!
But still, free on Gamepass, can't beat that lol

Yes, yes, free on Gamepass. We get it.

Very good news for people with just a PS4/5. The first is a classic so I’m really looking forward to playing this on GamePass.

Been waiting years for this. Loved the first and was gutted when Double Fine got acquired. Will be a fitting send off to their games on Playstation hardware

You just remembered so Microsoft are hiding it? Yeah, sounds legit. They're hiding nothing, it was always known to be multiplatform.

@Rob_230 I don't see how it'll be anything but great

@Shigurui Yeah, we have always known it will be multiplatform. But good luck finding Sony or Double Fine actively promoting the PS4 version. It is very easy to forget about it.

If it's on GP then I'm not interested.

It's just trolling gamers that don't use this platform.

Where do I sign up for this free on game pass malarkey?

@LiamCroft well it is on double fines website states all the platforms available,also with you being a ps site shouldnt that be your job anyway ,you know to inform your user base of upcoming releases on their favourite platform.

Ah that’s great news. Yep, Microsoft sure did make it look like an Xbox exclusive. Then again, why would they advertise it as available for the blue team, too?

[Answers my own question]: Erm, sales?

Slightly off topic but with several people here mentioning playing it on gamepass made me consider subscribing for a couple months and playing it on my phone or tablet using xcloud (since I don't have an xbox). Impressions on xcloud beta have been quite good. Anyone have first hand experience?

@Col_McCafferty I don't think that's how it works...

@Jayslow I've tried it, it works pretty well. Don't expect it to be a full replacement for consoles though, but if you want to play Xbox games without an Xbox, this is your best bet. Still pick up an Xbox controller, those are great on XCloud.

Hopefully it can get a dedicated PS5 port. But we'll have to wait until we see.

@HotGoomba thanks for the quick reply. Yeah definitely tempted to try it out, if my backlog allows it. Once the series consoles become available or xcloud comes to LG smart TVs this would be my primary option

I geniunely thought this was the first true Xbox Exclusive coming out this year but if it isn't, what is ?

@MightyDemon82 well, if you want to be pedantic, technically this game with the others, roughly costs about .04999999996 cents. Not free, but damn near.

August is looking fantastic with Kena and Psychonauts 2!

The Xbox conference noted that the Series X version will get enhanced features, but doubt they will in any way come to PS5 (would love a native PS5 version, but also unlikely now).
But even without said enhancements, the game itself looks amazing!
The 2006 original holds a strong place in my heart, so hopefully Raz's adventure's in this sequel will be just as fun.

@Jayslow You not have a PC or laptop? Not judging, I don't have cable tv or any live streaming tv service, just find it odd. We've been using Gamepass on and off for awhile now, currently doing the 3 months for $1 yet again. So technically not free, but $1 for 3 months I can live with. We can't play every game, our PCs are like 5 and 8 years old respectively, rocking 5 year old video cards, but we play a lot.

Haven't tried Xcloud. We have wired 300Mbps internet - haven't cut the entire cord yet, just the Tv channels - but I just don't like the idea of streaming. All the games we play on Gamepass on PC, and my son on his laptop, we download.

If you can sign up for the 3 months for $1 deal it's really not much to lose whether it works or not. 🤷‍♂️

@Col_McCafferty You are not interested in any game that comes to Game Pass or just this one?

@Enigk Any game that launches day one on GP but expects PS owners to buy it full price.

It's case of having your cake and eating it; receiving a nice fat cheque from MS so GP subscribers can play it for 'free' whilst charging gamers on other platforms full price.

That's just how I see it.

@Col_McCafferty Fair enough, makes more sense now. Vote with your wallet. If there were more like you then that could upset the system and force Sony's hand to counter. Although can't ever seeing them doing anything but charging for their exclusive AAA releases day one.

@Enigk Hmm, I think you miss the point. It's not aimed at Sony but third party developers getting a quick buck from Xbox but then expecting PS or Nintendo gamers (where applicable) to buy their games at full price.

I have no problem buying a big Sony ASS game day one at full price as I know I'll be getting my monies worth and then some.

Edit - ha just noticed I wrote ASS instead of AAA. D'oh!

@PhhhCough for it to be free Phil Spencer needs to send me a series x or a decent PC plus all the accessories and a life time supply of game pass subs that I'll need to enjoy all those free games!

No one hid it. It was made clear years ago, and even after the buyout. Come on do some reading.

@rjejr I actually don't. Since I started working an office job 10 years ago the last thing I want to do is spend free time behind a PC. Also since Sony abandoned the handheld market I wouldn't mind setting up an Xbox controller with my phone being a defacto Vita 2.

@The_Pixel_King they Never hid it. Double fine was even talking about it all over Twitter.

@AFCC
'Free on GamePass' is an oxymoron.

@Mergatro1d I'm with you.... it is annoying how some of users here keep repeating that same BS about "it comes to GP, so I will play it there" or "it is "free" with GP" like they were part of a PR machine for MS. It happens all the time, to the point it becomes tiresome and it is annoying as heck. Those guys should just give it a rest already...

It's another game that looks quite good but the trouble is if the next one isn't coming to PS that will most likely make it skip this one.

@Col_McCafferty With third party games I guess this is going to happen more often than not as as the Xbox user base is lower compared to PS and it seems that, regardless of what is said by MS, more Xbox people are waiting for a game to be on GP rather than buying it.

I can see your point about how it makes those publishers look greedy though as people said the same about Sony with MLB going on GP. In that sense they might actually be losing more money than they are making from the MS deal.

@Col_McCafferty Sorry, I misunderstood. You don't like Game Pass. I get it. Unfortunately that is the way the world is going. Spotify, etc for music. Netflix, etc for movies and TV shows. Amazon even do a digital and audio book subscriptions. People are owning less and less media. I haven't bought a CD or DVD/Blu-Ray in years. Games and books are the only things I still buy these days.

Really hyped for this game. Still need to play the first game but I really enjoyed what I've seen when watching a friend play it.

@rpg2000 gamepass is clearly brilliant value and I’m actually quite jealous that I can’t use it, I just don’t need reminding at every opportunity that a 3rd party game will be on it!

@Enigk It is the way everything is going, you are correct and I think that people are now conditioned to accept a small monthly payment for so much content, hence why we keep hearing the "best value in gaming" slogan bandied about.

Those on here that speak out about that model do have valid reason for concern though. Spotify is a good example of what does actually happen with these sub services. There's only so much money in the pot to pay out to all the artists, based on how many subscribers there are, so the more content there is on the service means that that money is spread over a larger number. The larger labels / artists end up getting a reasonable payment but smaller artists really struggle and get such a small cut to a point where they might not even bother to pay out to them.

If GP is going the same way then it basically means that the more games there are on the service / the more deals that MS make the less each game makes. Over time less and less people will be buying games as they will end up just playing that curated list of things on the subscription service and stating that they will wait until it's on GP so publishers will just have to accept that in order to make money they have to sell out to whoever it is running the subscription services. Games are likely to change quite radically to fit that model, with less AAA games being made etc.

Hopefully it won't come to that but that's how I can see it playing out.

@Col_McCafferty you do know Psychonauts is a first party MS game and not a third party thing? Of course it’s going to be on Gamepass the ‘publishing deal’ is that it’s owned by MS.

@LiamCroft - Here's the thing. Sony not promoting it does not equate to Microsoft hiding it. That's on Sony.

I look forward to permanently owning this and playing it whenever I want for decades to come! (rather than having it locked away whenever Microsoft deems me unworthy.)

Perhaps they'll even release a physical copy and I can resell it to recoup most of the cost - that's a very cheap way to play video games!

@MightyDemon82 to be fair I dont think anyone has said "free". Not Phil, purexbox or pushsquare. I think what you're misinterpreting is "at no extra cost"

The butthurt around Game Pass on this site is becoming incredibly petty and unbearable.
If you love PS so much and are against GP, why fill your mouth with this nonsense? Just buy the game when it comes out and be happy, since you prefer it that way 😃

Nice, although I probably play it on gamepass pc.

So #@&* annoyed this isn't going to be getting a full PS5 release, hate when Microsoft and Sony lock off things from other console owners. Scummy behaviour.

@KippDynamite buying a physical copy and then reselling it to recoup the cost; is kind of the same outcome as playing it on gamepass. Just saying!

@Jayslow I use my PS4 controller on my PC to play Gamepass games bc/ we dont' own an Xbox anymore - traded it in for a Switch - so I know the feeling. 😁

Don't own a PS5 but I have the red controller coming this weekend so I can use that on PC and move my PS4 controller back to my PS4 which I still game on.

Looking forward to playing it although I have to play the 1st one.

@Jayslow xCloud is good. And gets better each day. I do not have an xBox so pay for Ultimate only for PC/xCloud.

I use xCloud all the time the last 10 months as my handheld around the house, hotels, Bus, Acela and office . I have a PC so cross save to it for home

I use Shadow PC on my 4K Android TV and that works well - so excited for an xCloud Android TV app.

Still $1 for 3 months up for Ultimate. So can try it out! 👍

I'll just leave this here:) Games shown at Xbox conference - Yakuza7 - already on PS, 12 Minutes - Coming within 3-6 months, Psychonauhts - Coming to PS day 1, Fallout 76 - Already on PS, ESO Next Gen - Coming to PS day 1, Party Animals - Coming to PS within 3-6 months, Hades - Coming to PS day 1, Somerville - Coming to PS withing 3-6 months, A Plague Tale 2 - Coming to PS Day 1, Slime Rancher - Coming to PS within 3-6 months, Shredders - Coming to PS within 3-6 months, Atomic Heart - Coming to PS day 1, Replaced - Coming to PS 3-6 months, Ascent - Coming to PS 3-6 months

@SwittersB Let's not act like Sony is literally doing the same exact thing with stuff like FFVII Remake, FFXVI, Deathloop, GhostWire, Forspoken, Godfall and some indie games

Them being timed doesn't really change that them being on Game Pass is still pretty big in of itself and will secure them some sort of audience out the gate before they come to Sony's platforms

Probably gonna either play this on Steam since that's where I have the first Psychonauts, or on Game Pass PC. Either way really excited.

@Shigurui They're probably thinking what's the point, better to promote something that isn't going on their 'enemies" platform Day One and 'free' to GP subscribers.

@feral1975 Lock things off? Microsoft OWNS Double Fine lmao

That's why it's getting a next gen upgrade for Xbox but not PlayStation lol. Same reason you won't be seeing Bethesda stuff on PS after GhostWire Tokyo

@Col_McCafferty Except they never use the term "free on Game Pass". It's only about playing it Day 1 on Game Pass alongside hundreds of other games since that's what people subscribe to GP for.

Is there a physical release or is Psychonauts 2 stuck in a digital only hell?

Great Psychonaut 2 is on PS4.

Same reason Sea of Thieves is in the top 10 best seller on Steam right now... Not everyone wants to rent games on Game Pass.

@TheFrenchiestFry the company might not but the fanbase and subscribers certainly do!

The point stands, boycott any third party developers that drops their titles Day One on GP but expects Sony and Nintendo fans to pay full price.

This game may not be made by a third party developers but it still takes the Michael expecting PS owners to buy it just to help further swell their coffers.

Sony need to start looking after their players, made a good start with the quality of some of the games put on Plus and the Free to Play Initiative but they can certainly do more.

Hadnt played the original but it's pretty good, playing it at the moment free on gamepass. Looking forward to this one free on gamepass soon. God I love gamepass.

@Agramonte awesome! I just ordered a razer kishi to use with my phone as my handheld. Look forward to it!

@JJ2 yeah like Free on PSPlus x)
I know, but it's cheaper than buying the games full price!

I think it should be mentioned a lot about games being on game pass maybe then Sony will stop sitting on there hands and actually do something apart from counting the money when Thier gamers are paying full price on day one , it's one hell of a move by Microsoft ,ppl don't want to wait ,oh yeh wait a short time like 6 months to play a game it may only be six months but by that time when the rest of the world has played it completed it and moved on isn't good , a few years down the line Thier gonna realise they aren't at the top anymore ,most of thier fanbase are off getting game pass day one additions on their TV/Xbox/pc/ mobile and lost it while they did nothing ... Remember toys are us ? Blockbuster ?

@Col_McCafferty If boycotting is a solution you clearly think is going to work so well, go for it but considering Game Pass has the backing of third parties like Square, SEGA and EA you're probably not going to get very far

Game Pass isn't even meant to be a proper replacement for full priced games since they disappear from your console/PC as soon as you cancel, so it's basically just Netflix or Blockbuster for games. If you want to actually own your games you're still paying the same price you would for a PlayStation or Nintendo game. Game Pass just has extra convenience but it's not necessarily spelling the death of people putting their games at retail. If you want to buy a game like Psychonauts, Starfield or whatever else from Xbox's first party devs, you're still going to be forking over the extra cash

Sounds like you're only suggesting this out of fanboy spite

@TheFrenchiestFry some company's have even said it's helped them get more income because ppl try the game for free ( included in their gamepass fee ) ,like the game amd buy dlc /more Interest in the game builds the fanbase of the game

@TheFrenchiestFry Well, if enough people do it these companies would be forced to have a rethink. They're assuming they can put titles Day One on GP and still get gamers on other platforms to stump up the cash. Hit them where it hurts!

@SwittersB and all of it at full price.

@K1LLEGAL Yes, that's what I was getting at. People talk about how GamePass is great value but forget that simply buying and then selling to recoup costs is similar and has been available for decades.

But with that method you can keep what you want to keep, it doesn't remove the concept of ownership, it helps people buy games second-hand for cheap, etc. Though I'll acknowledge it's more hassle than GamePass.

Microsoft tried to remove game ownership (by eliminating reselling) with the Xbox One. There was an outrage. They've now found a more palatable way of accomplishing the same goal. Game media eat it up (and take money to promote the underlying concepts), and fans do the rest of the PR work.

@Col_McCafferty I mean, it didn’t hurt outriders at all. This site said it would crater, but it didn’t.

@KippDynamite. So Microsoft get the blame for this ? Hmmm do Sony not do a digital only console ? Any Xbox owners can buy second hand discs of older consoles(360/original Xbox ) and still play them on Thier new consoles ,can playstation 5 owners play PS3 games on Thier ps5 ? If you want to blame company's that destroying the second hand game market look at Sony Instead of just blaming Microsoft

@Col_McCafferty If anything I think third parties are kind of reacting the exact opposite way.

It's fine if you personally don't use or prefer Game Pass or have your own personal reasons for disliking it but a lot of people probably wouldn't have even gotten into the Xbox ecosystem had it not been such a tempting proposition as long as new-gen games keep hiking in price and it's becoming increasingly harder to save up for specific games on a regular basis

This whole situation likely wouldn't have happened at all if the Xbox One actually stuck the landing and didn't almost completely decimate their reputation on day 1, but now it's clear they no longer just care about the hardware side of things since trying to best Sony in that regard would be extremely difficult with how much consumer goodwill and recognizability their brand has in comparison. Their whole strategy now is it doesn't really matter what way you play the game because if it's on a device that they have control over, you give them the money. Xbox isn't just the console anymore and that's more what third parties realize. Hell it's because of Game Pass Xbox is finally getting good JP content so they are improving in a lot of ways

@AFCC
Yea. With PS+ I could see that perspective of people saying it because you pay for online. Anyway I didnt want to sound off, sorry if my comment was dry, buI just feel nobody would say a game is free on PSNOW even though its cheaper.
🤷‍♂️

@TheFrenchiestFry
They didn't own Doublefine when they were getting money off the public to get Psychonauts 2 off the ground.
Microsoft must have really had to go out of their way to find the loophole that means PS4 backers will get their copies delayed. That's just mean and another example why these companies buying studios or exclusivity agreements to ring fence games and/or release dates is completely anti-consumer.
I really don't understand why people in this day and age support this and act like Microsoft, Sony or Nintendo are like their favourite football team. This behaviour affects us all adversely.

@feral1975 Did you know without MS backing Double Fine the game would've cut boss battles and wouldn't have had access to consulting actual psychiatrists that know about the various mental disorders that'll be in Psychonauts 2? And that it's still coming to Playstation regardless?

Microsoft literally made the game better and no promised platforms are getting left behind. That isn't anti-consumer.

@Jayslow Oh nice. You can use either - you do not need the Xbox branded one if you want to save a bit of money.

Only thing I did not like was that the USB Type C is only for charging. My TypeC headphones did not work.

Yakuza like a dragon is like the perfect jRPG for streaming. Check it out (if you play jRPGs)

@feral1975 Actually even post-Microsoft buyout Double Fine committed to the game being multiplatform. The game was never going to be cancelled or delayed for PS4 owners. Microsoft also acquired InXile and Obsidian ahead of their respective releases of The Outer Worlds and Wasteland 3 as multiplatform games and they remained multiplatform, with Obsidian also given the go-ahead to continue development of the Switch port that would launch a few months later. The only thing that happened after the MS-acquisition was that when the game received its latest delay it gave Double Fine time to prepare a Series X|S version alongside the existing console and PC platforms

@LiamCroft And this is definitely Microsoft's fault that even Sony hasn't bothered to mention it... Even though they could

@Martsmall
I agree that Sony also does stuff I don't like and that isn't great for customers. I think paying for the privilege of online gaming is BS. I myself wouldn't buy the digital-only PS5. If I had my way they would ban loot boxes on their system (but they don't because they get a 30% cut).

Nintendo also does dumb crap, like manipulating markets to create demand.

That doesn't mean Microsoft isn't guilty of the things I said. I personally see their actions - including their goals with GamePass - to be the most egregious against customers and the industry as a whole.

@SwittersB Nice, looks like just about everyone will get to play all of those

@KippDynamite oh no I would agree Microsoft do it too but at least u can play Thier older discs still on Xbox consoles (which I do myself thank you eBay lol ) they don't wipe out the earlier second hand disc market completely like Sony have done with the older titles which im sure u can buy all over AGAIN digitally

@Sakisa
If they really did want to support the game then they should have made it equally available to all and recouped their costs with profit on all formats. Sony should do the same when they choose to buy or support a developer's vision.
If there weren't legal issues stopping them from not releasing to PS4 backers they wouldn't have and if there's a third game it's likely to be ringfenced. If you think that's reasonable then it says enough
I dislike company stooges no matter the master and there's a few on here.

@TheFrenchiestFry
It's likely they already had legally binding agreements they couldn't default on.

@feral1975 I told you active ways they made it better and they aren't holding anyone back from playing it on different platforms. Only thing that changed really is it's going to gamepass and might look a bit better on an Xbox. There's really no hypothetical that leaves Sony players out and if anything you're the one that looks like you're rushing to villify Microsoft on this. The game was targeting PS4 and Xbox One to begin with.

@Martsmall
Totally agree with you there. I wish Sony would allow the PS5 to be backwards compatible with all prior systems. It seems like their talented programmers could make emulators.

@Sakisa
Not at all. They should have made the best experience available to anyone just as Sony should in similar circumstances, I disagreed with the exclusivity agreements for Death Stranding and FFXVI etc.
If they want to support the games support them for all and if they have enough confidence in their consoles or infrastructure then customers will gravitate to it on their own merits rather than holding things hostage.

@JJ2 I took no offence, I understood your comment. But I gotta be honest, at first glance I thought you were calling me a moron lmao
We just can't deny how good of a deal Gamepass really is, though!

@KippDynamite
Yep Sony really should have followed Microsoft's lead.

@KippDynamite you can still buy games on Xbox - everyone seems to ignore that point. Gamepass is an additional choice; which is great. More choice the better.

To be honest, “ownership” on both PS and Xbox isn’t the best with disks being like unlock keys. I feel like every game I buy I don’t really own anyway (realised this too late for sure). So Gamepass works great at reducing the stress of the whole thing.

Still buy physical for Switch though as I love a good cartridge 👌

@K1LLEGAL
True, GamePass isn't the only option, though I do think that's what Microsoft wants and is trying to move toward. Each sub strengthens their plans. In this case I think the offered choice is bad. We have to be shrewd enough to see what corporations are trying to do.

@Col_McCafferty Not looking to argue or anything, and I won't bother to say my opinion your stance with multi-platform games on Game Pass because I know that won't go well and there's no need for it, but in the case of Psychonauts 2, of course it's going to be on Game Pass. Double Fine is owned by Microsoft. I would think something like this should be the exception to your rule, but obviously you are welcome to do whatever you want.

@SwittersB You're comment displaying all the day 1 gamepass games that are also hitting playstation is the perfect selling point for gamepass...and Microsoft should adopt it. Why pay up to £70 for a game on PlayStation when you can play it as part of your gamepass subscription? It really makes you think.

Also, why does every Sony fanboy hate on gamepass because they prefer to pay £70 to own their games? It's an option given to Xbox gamers...it's not denying them the ability to own physical versions too you know? It's odd...if Sony offered the same value with psnow we'd all be lapping it up. Imagine getting the chance to try games before buying them...do you know that once you download playstation digital game you can't even get a refund. £70 for games that still need patches. You're pretentiously scoffing at the option of the likes of Gamepass to protect the ability to get to play broken versions of these games years from now.

@KilloWertz In a way that's worse, you're giving MS more money for this game than GP subscribers do so in a way you're the reason it will turn a profit!

It's not just about this game, it's about every game that drops on GP Day One that other platform users have to fill price for.

It's just a matter of principle my friend. I'll be consistent and boycott whatever game follows this model.

Maybe one day I'll cave in and either buy an Xbox or subscribe to GP through other means but that day remains a long way off.

@Col_McCafferty it's good to have principles. Always vote with your wallet. Do you keep the same energy with your principles when it comes to games offering more content on one platform but charge the same price for less content on the other?
Do you voice any objections when a publisher has one set of gamers wait longer for a game than an other set of gamers...yet wish to charge them the same price?
I hope you do as it's not practices that show we're all valued equally.
Or do you praise Sony for being 'for the gamers' when they do it?

We should all be more vocal for things that will ultimately benefit us all. You can ignore gamepass all you want...it would be better to make it known you want a playstation alternative though. You would benefit from this. Paying £70 for the same games you are not benefitting from.
I also notice other than gamers mentioning the value of Gamepass fanboys seem to hate it when the £70 price tag is raised. Imagine complaining about something that if has enough pushback actually benefits you...that's a new kind of idiot right there.

@Col_McCafferty You can boycott all you like but it’s not going to change anything, it’ll be just you losing out on not playing the game while the company still makes a lot of money from sales and MS for putting it on Game Pass day one. Recent games like Outriders and MLB The Show 21 still sold really well despite both being on Game Pass day one. The model is obviously working, Game Pass has been around for 4 years now and it’s just getting bigger and better.

It’s all about choice, no one is forcing you to pay full price for a game on PS4/PS5 when it’s on Game Pass day one. Your just a Sony fanboy who is hurt by the fact that people who use Game Pass are getting the best deal in gaming right now. Don’t blame the people who subscribe to GP or the devs who put their games on GP or even MS themselves. Focus on getting Sony to respond but I honestly don’t think they know how to, they simply cannot compete on that level with a trillion dollar company like MS who can definitely afford to have Game Pass at a loss.

@Col_McCafferty Microsoft would still be happy even if was an Xbox exclusive as the subscription fees more than make up for what they pay out to get exclusive games. In this case, it's by a company they already own, so that's still a bit different. It's also different because they are owned by Microsoft, so technically Psychonauts 2 isn't really what your boycott is about. At least by my understanding, it's about the games that will be on Game Pass that Microsoft paid to get on the service outside of the companies they own. If you expect Microsoft to not put a game they own on Game Pass, or expect PlayStation owners to also get it for free for no reason, then you're crazy.

Do you honestly expect publishers to just give their game away for free to people for no reason? The only reason why publishers are willing to do it is with Microsoft is because they pay them to have them on there. At the end of the day, you can do what you want. I just don't see how you can expect things to really be any different.

@Katsuhono

The next xbox exclusives:

Flight Sim - July
Forza Horizon 5 - November
Halo Infinite - Holiday 2021

Psychonauts 2 is a first party title, but the game was announced before MS acquired the studio so its multiplataform.

New IPs starts 2022 with Starfield, Contraband and Redfall.

@Bleachedsmiles Very few games on this list will be $70

@Col_McCafferty The problem I have with your statement is the "free" part. Game Pass isn't free, most people pay $15 a month and for the best experience paid for a new console. Right now it's a good deal but it's not free and many games come and go

@MaccaMUFC Game Pass has to get better, it's in the red, not making money yet, and needs more subscribers.

@rpg2000 don't see why that's a bad thing. It's letting players know you can just drop 10$ a month for GP to play it then paying 60$ on PlayStation. Maybe you don't like seeing it because fanboyism? It happens to the best of us lol

@Jayslow Xcloud is actually pretty solid. I tried Ori on my phone and performance wise it was really good.

@Enigk I really hope that isn't the case... at least based on the current setup. Subscription is already diminishing the value of individual IP's. At least with the Xbox user base. Anything above a £10 a month subscription is seen as daylight robbery. People were paying £60 per game and happy about it a coupe of years back.

If all current games dropped their spend to a maximum of £120 annually on games (give or take free trials and a £1 for 3 month deal) I'd be interested to know how that would affect the current market.

Imagining a World where it is mostly subs and Sony decided to counter like for like with their own service and existing IP. The two would need to either ramp up the game quality which means more money or drive the price down which no doubt would impact quality.

It will go a lot deeper than this of course and there's a lot more I would need to consider for the argument but from what we are seeing with Netflix they are hiking prices to account for that. My 4K sub just want up from 9.99 to 13.99. That's a 40% increase almost.

These are just things to consider I guess and I would always prefer to own my games and I'm sure there are more people like me.

@MaccaMUFC Well exactly, Xbox can afford to do this because they have the weight of MS behind them. If both Xbox and PlayStation were separate companies then Xbox would be bankrupt!

I don't care if Xbox own the.studioes but these third party developers are wanting their cake and eating it too.

Timed exclusives aren't great BUT on PS we are still being charged full price. Very very rarely does a game come out on Plus Day One and now only on PS5.

Look, I realise I'm probably a lone voice yelling against the tide but it's just how I see it. I'm not against a GP equivalent on PS but in all honesty I can't say I'm begging for it. I always have a backlog, I very rarely buy games Day One anyway and I've been getting good value from Plus over the past 18 months or so. Once I get a PS5 I'll be a very happy gamer!

@Mergatro1d former 3rd party...unfortunately...

Why was my comment deleted and flagged as inappropriate? There is zero evidence that Microsoft are hiding the game being multiplat and my calling that a bizarre conspiracy theory is inappropriate how? It's an absolutely nonsense claim.

@Alpha_Pulse I'd like to know how subscription services are diminishing the value of IPS? If anything they're supporting more unique new IPS that don't have big publishers marketing behind them by ensuring they get money for their work as well as ensuring their games get into more hands. Take 12 minutes for example, or one of the other indie games shown as coming to gamepass day 1. Slap a £15/20 price tag on them and it may put some off from trying these...especially the casual audience (which makes up the majority of a consoles install base). Having them as part of your subscription offers more opportunities for them to be played by a wider audience.
Or take flight simulator...looks awesome visually but still pretty niche. Slap a £70 price tag on it and that might put people off from picking it up. Place it as part of a subscription and you're more likely to give it a go.
How many times do we here 'i'll wait for a sale' on games that gamers are curious about but don't want to take the chance and spend day 1 asking prices? Happens all the time with all of us. When most of us understand that the sales within that first month are most important to the publishers in considering if something is a success or not and investment in a sequel or the studio itself will be there going forward. If that game gets someone subscribing to a service though day 1 I think there's more likely to be interest in there for further funding than if gamers wait till it's heavily discounted.

I get what you mean about Netflix raising prices. They use the excuse it's because they're investing more in their own original products. Whether that translates into quality products is another matter.
I'd expect the same from the likes of Gamepass ...as the service grows the price is bound to grow with it. But with success (which is what gamepass seems to be) comes bigger investments in it. But also, more importantly, comes competition. Having a world with Prime and Netflix ect hasn't harmed us as the consumer. It's offered us more choice. It's made them invest in more original exclusive products to gain subscribers. We're not locked into contracts. We can opt out and not pay the prices. We can still buy movies. And if we want to watch that next season of Making a murderer or what ever you just pay for a month of Netflix. Netflix are going to continue to make Making a murderer because those people dropping in for a month to watch it is going to earn them more than if they just released it on Blu-ray.

@Bleachedsmiles that is actually my point right there. The value of those games are diminished because the only way people will play them is on a low monthly sub. My point comes from my own experience which I should have added to my point really. In tons of comments paying full price for a game is considered insanity at this point. If its sustainable then fair play I will shut my mouth but we are in the honeymoon period so who knows what the impact will be once MS have to start making a profit on this service. If people don't want to pay high prices for content then they cannot possibly operate at a high quality or would have to look at reducing the content somewhat. The fact that GamePass is making some gamers feel that paying full price for games is an idiot is exactly what I'm driving at.

I have GamePass. If something is on there that I want play I will play it. If I stand to play a better version on my PS5 I will buy it on that. If a PS exclusive comes out I will buy it on my PS. A subscription service does not suit everyone and buying games at full price is something that is still very much OK and shouldn't be seen as Sony or Nintendo punishing their fans and Xbox is the only consumer friendly company. Its just not. They have created a model which is hopefully sustainable but there is no reason for the whole industry to move in this direction.

MLB the Show is a cracking example. MS secured it on GamePass and the Sony fans were mocked for paying full price. No doubt some of the xbox gamepass deals are subsidised by Nintendo and PlayStation consumers having a larger player base than MS.

This is what I am driving at. If you get a game on GP then amazing, that is great news and a great perk. But that doesn't mean the game is only worth your £11 per month sub. The ecosystems need each other to strike balance and drive value and quality for the players. Standardisation is not what the gaming industry needs or wants. It's all about diversity in portfolio and engagement.

I agree with the diversity in GamePass offering. They have reported that gamers are trying more than they ever have since GP which is of course a massive positive and shows the model isn't just negatives as many believe.

@Alpha_Pulse What makes you think gamepass isn't making Microsoft money???

People not wanting to pay full price for their games isn't a 'side effect' of Gamepass. Gamers have always, and will always, seek out their games cheaper, and purchase them cheaper if the options there. It's why pre-owned gaming market hurt publishers so much to the point that they used to have one time activation codes included with some games. It's why there's countless websites dedicated to finding games at their cheapest prices. Offering discount codes. It's why gamers have always sat on games uttering the words 'i'll pick it up when it's on sale'. Gamepass hasn't suddenly made gamers not want to pay full RRP for games. That's a bit of an odd thing to suggest.

Who said Sony and Nintendo are punishing their fans? And also, why do you guys soon this narrative that it's gamepass or nothing on Xbox...when you know you can purchase physical too? It makes no sense. Gamepass is a gateway to giving you the OPTION of trying games as part of your subscription. Remember a few gens back when demos were the norm? You didn't think anything of trying a demo and then not purchasing the game if you didn't like it did you?
I see a lot of posts from playstation fanboys like mgb and crapgamer posting those exact words..."it's OK to buy physical" whenever they feel threatened by positive reactions to gamepass. At the same time I see them put up videos praising the months psplus offerings. It's OK to also enjoy a subscription services that benefits you too. Why get so defensive and act like you're battling for PlayStation's honour because they're not offering their games day 1 on their own subscription services yet?

I honestly don't get your point...as you're arguing that the likes of Gamepass could harm diversity one second...yet acknowledge it introduces gamers to a more diverse range of games the next.

End of the day Microsoft are investing in gamepass for a reason. That reason isn't because it's losing them money. And not is it because they're not wanting to keep subscribers. They're going to make sure decent games are on there if they want to keep growing it. And the vast majority of those games are going to go on to other platforms and other subscription services. It's not removing anything from anyone. It's allowing more people the chance to play new games. Games they never thought they'd like. This is not a bad thing for YOU as a gamer. It's also likely to spawn more creativity in games...Devs will have less to worry about when it comes to finding a publisher.
Maybe we'll see more episodic games...
But it's choice. Digital and streaming and subscription services ARE the future. There's no getting around that. Both Sony and Microsoft release digital versions of their consoles for a reason. Invest in streaming for a reason. Digital games far out sell physical right now. But for now we also get the choice of physical. So if you want to buy those physical games then cool...it's OK. Just be realistic about them - they're sold at a premium price and still need patching. Still need you to be online. Still require the console to be working or backwards compatible. Still have a paywall locking online play. Still have lootboxes and locked content on the disc. Still have all the other ways publishers have been trying to screw us over for generations ensuring you never really own them.

@Bleachedsmiles honestly I cannot be a**** writing paragraphs to you so I will try and keep it short.

Firstly when a company doesn't report profits to its shareholders in 4 years is a pretty telling sign it's because there is no profit. It is very clear they are going through a period of needing to sustain so will be taking a hit until they have the right amount of subscribers. But if you have the source for the profits then fair play.

Hopefully you are not referring to me as a fanboy. I am literally platform agnostic. Don't have an issue with MS (apart from big ugly Phil). I play on my Xbox and PS and I have GamePass which is a nice supplementary service to my PS5 where I enjoy my PS exclusives which I have to pay for at full price usually with it being new. Loved spiderman and bought miles morales at full price whilst getting ridiculed for it by Xbox fanboys claiming it is a rip off and Sony hates its fans and this gen is the end of Sony because of Gamepass. Bought Valhalla and Cold War for full price on my XSX too.

Now hopefully I am being clear. I do not hate gamepass and I think it is a good offering. I also think that some xbox fans who are very vocal don't see gamepass as something that supplements our gaming hobby but see it as be gamepass or die. This mentality is what will diminish IP's.

Also I don't buy physical I buy digital and have since ps3 and 360. I play both sides of the fence and I'm entitled to my opinion of not wanting to see a sub only industry, its not like I can stop it. Those who are paying full price play a part in subsidising those getting games at a discounted rate. If you eliminate that and publishers are forced to cut budgets you see a lower quality of game. Maybe that's what happened with Halo Infinite who knows.

You are talking about Sony fanboys being very defensive but you too are being very defensive because I voiced my own opinion about the subscription model being the norm in the industry. If you actually read my original comment I had also added that there is a lot that I probably hadn't considered as part of my thoughts but it is something to think about. I also pondered about the impact of reduced average spend from the gamer on the industry as a whole. You have specifically targeted GamePass as your argument back to me for a very valid point. My point wasn't that GamePass is diminishing diversity AT ALL. My point was that this mentality that not paying a sub and paying for games in full (or on sale) is old and tired is diminishing the perceived value of the IP's that don't reside on GamePass.

Yes yes devs might not have to find a publisher and that could spawn creativity I agree but again you are looking at one side of the argument. It could also spawn an era of lazy development. There is no incentive to drive sales so as long as a game ticks so many boxes for the game to go on gamepass they can crunch dev time and increase margin.

I am sorry if I hurt your feelings but the subscription model is still very new and we don't know the impact it might have on the industry. Trying to convince anyone that this is the way the industry is going without tangible proof that it is sustainable is naive. Bringing a condescending attitude just makes you come across as a d**k.

Well look at that I wrote paragraphs anyway....

Apologies to all having to read this. This will be the last response from me :/

@Alpha_Pulse Ha spawn an era of lazy development?...you're already living in that era without subscription services pushing it.

Halos problems wasn't due to gamepass...it's due to xboxs continued lack of decent management over their studios. They spent a whole generation with poor management leading to delayed games/cancelled games. And they're showing that when it comes to keeping on top of their studios they're still falling short now (still no first party games for their new console, Halo having to be delayed a year, studios required 3 years ago and still having nothing to show, games revealed too early etc).

Questioning why you have fears about gamepass isn't me being defensive. I wanted to know why you have them. Questioning your claim gamepass is losing Microsoft money when they may not be showing you personally their earnings (are you a shareholder?) but do regularly boast the growing subscriber numbers. Isn't me being defensive. It's me questioning why you think it's failing?
And I specifically target gamepass back to you because gamepass was your focused concern...'at least with the Xbox user base'...remember?

And you definitely haven't hurt my feelings so don't worry there.

And I don't need to convince anyone the future of gaming is ultimately streaming subscription services. You'd have to be a damn idiot if you can't see it. Movies, music...you honestly think games aren't going to follow? Even though you've seen every major player invest in subscription services last gen and continue to see digital sales outgrow physical ones. Continue to see gaming stores close. Continue to see the best selling gaming products being top up cards?
Whatever impact it has on the industry there's no escaping it.

@Bleachedsmiles OK I cannot resist a response so I will add a response to each paragraph.

I agree there is lazy development but hopefully a subscription service in every corner of the industry wouldn't see this enhanced but it could regardless of what you say.

I didn't say that it was because of GamePass I'm saying it could be. Again I am playing devil's advocate rather than believing this is the way forward before it's proven. And I agree with your view on Xbox Studios currently.

Again I don't have fears about gamepass I have concerns around subs in all corners being the norm. Who is to say every publisher wouldn't want in on the action? As far as I know GamePass is losing money but intentionally as some investments do until they start recuperating the investment. This is basic business. Yes I have shares in MS so I guess I am a shareholder so I have a right I guess. But that again isn't my point. It's not me PERSONALLY who hasn't seen reported profits its THE shareholders because there are no profits to report. They need X amount of subscribers to continue as they are would be the assumption and they've not hit it yet. Which I'd why they continue to curate high profile games to draw us in.

Gamepass is the only real example to reference that can cause disruption to the industry due to its popularity. PS Now is not a disruptor just like EA Access isn't. My point is around subs like GamePass being the norm with the current Xbox userbase being very vocal about the fact that if a game isn't part of a 10.99 sub service then it's a rip off. I can change my example to "popular subscription service" and "users of said service" if this makes it easier. This is why I keep telling you I I have an issue with GP itself but if more of the same model and user base perceptions are adopted this is what could happen.

I'm glad I didn't hurt your feelings.

I know streaming is coming but this argument that this is the only way to consume games is false. You keep touching on physical which I honestly don't give a crap about. I have an all digital PS5 and thebobly reason my XSX has a drive is because I want to watch my 4k Blu Ray's which I have to buy because the compression is garbage when you stream. Digital sales are on the rise as your said which isn't a subscription it is still consumed in the same way it is just a different format. The end result is you don't have to continue to pay for it like a sub and it remains in your library. I keep eyeing up dragon quest on GP but its been on there for a while and I don't know when it's going to be leaving the service. With a game that's 100 hours plus starting on GP knowing it could be gone in two weeks makes me just want to buy the game. There is always going to be an argument for buying games.

To sum up I have concerns because I am a pragmatic person. I can see the pros but I can also see the cons. And don't get me wrong I have reservations about some games and how much the industry is charging for them as a one size fits all model. There is plenty of room for both but I don't want every corner of the industry to pop up with subs. I already have Prime, Disney, Netflix, Now TV, GP, PS Now and PS Plus. They are valid concerns and I've explained to you in each response why. I accept that you think this could all work put because it could and I will happily eat my own words but there is nothing wrong with speculation and not taking everything at face value.

@Alpha_Pulse Streaming isn't the only way to play games right now...the future, who knows. But neither is gamepass the only way to play Xbox games. You're denying yourself playing a game you fancy trying because you fear it will be taken off gamepass? Why not just play it now and buy it if it is taken off? You have options... Take advantage of them!

@Bleachedsmiles that's actually my plan. Trial it and see if I like it then buy it on Switch most likely for the handheld option.

This one is specific to those that have been there for a while not kind of new games on the service. And with this being a big game I don't want to get half way through and have to start again. A cross save function from the developer would be welcome to alleviate these occurrences. That would be nice indeed!

@Cherip-the-Ripper No, I pay for Plus so I'm just getting what I pay for.

One caveat though is that I don't have a PS5 so most of the games that come to PS4 Plus are old.

😝

@Cherip-the-Ripper I think it's just perceived familiarity, platform preference or just bring more comfortable on one console if you ask me

I personally have no problem with buying different games in a franchise on multiple systems, and Psychonauts definitely ain't stopping me either. I guess it's convenient in my case that the original is also on PC

@TheFrenchiestFry alright thanks for the answer.

@Col_McCafferty Imagine paying to Kickstart this game 4-5 years ago only for it to launch "free" on Xbox when it finally came out. I would be ticked if I was an Xbox gamer with Gamepass who already paid for a copy of the game years ago.

@The_Pixel_King Microsoft don't care about sale, they want Game Pass subscribers and they will not put a PS4 logo on their events, Sony does the same, but in fact Microsoft makes it clear if the game is exclusive / timed exclusive/cross-platform it always appears before each trailer, different from Sony that usually speaks something like " the next few games are PS4/5 exclusives then shows 2 exclusives and 1 cross-platform and u have to look on the small letter to fund if the game is a full/timed exclusives or cross-platform