PS5, PS4's New PS2 Emulator Fails to Pass Tech Test

It boggles my mind that big companies don't (more commonly) pay modders and emulator enthusiasts as consultants to build this sort of stuff properly for them. The communities are RABID and the companies have the money. Get someone to do it right or why even bother?

It sounds like I should my PS3 HD copy instead, that would be simpler and easier.

I just want to play the games of my childhood. I couldn't care less about most of what they are complaining about tbh.

@MFTWrecks because its about making money if they actually cared it would recognise your ps2 disc and let you play it. but nope subscription or buy it

money

@MFTWrecks They should just go with the legal/illegal route by paying for a well established emulator like pcsx2 or just use it under the radar, go to court over it, settle and then carry on using it since it's kind of tied to playstation. It would cost them less in the long run but hey ho.

@MFTWrecks Probably because of licensing, namely most emulators are open source and under license so using one of those requires giving it away as per the terms, i.e for free.

As for hiring the guys, maybe that's an option, but that's a lot of work to do with a disjointed GitHub based team.

There is also the risk of precedent. As with everything in the legally grey-ish area that hasn't been updated since technology was invented, there's a good chance that one person could go "see, they endorsed it by hiring these guys on" and then boom, you're in a place these companies don't want to be.

Regardless of your opinion on that, the businesses don't want that. It's the same with fan games. You could hire em, but you can also lessen your hold on your IP by showing that hey that's okay do what you want with it.

I imagine someone could reasonably challenge SEGA for being so lax with fan games after all.

But who knows, I'm probably wrong. Usually am.

It's clear Sony wants to do the bare minimum with these emulators.

I'm not saying that Sony needs to go crazy with enhancements, but having it not look right on a modern display is just not acceptable. Why not have a Smooth option and a Pixel Perfect option that both properly scale for a modern display?

Plus, why not have like an FPS Boost-style enhancement or a 4K-Mode for select titles? Not everything needs to become an expensive to make/expensive to buy Remaster in order to show some kind of consideration for your gaming legacy.

Though, my guess on performance is that things on PS1/PS2 are very much tied to very specific timings and boosting to 60fps could prove difficult (as even boosting framerate in emulators is buggy) - it's technically "smoke and mirrors" on Microsoft's side as the game thinks it's running 30fps but is running at 60fps at the DirectX level (which Sony doesn't have the luxury of leveraging in this instance).

I'm not saying every single title needs it, but the fact that fans with limited access to original hardware functionality can produce a better emulator that works on various hardware configurations than a company with deep access to the original hardware functionality and only one hardware configuration (maybe 2 if Sony wanted to spill over to PS4) is pretty sad.

Just use my steam deck.

So we've gone from a rubbish PS2 emulator on PS4 to a poor one on PS5. I'll just stick to PCSX2

If the PS2 emulator is this awful I should completely forget about a PS3 emulator as it would probably melt my PS5. Like the top comment mentioned why not hire emulator enthusiasts who would do a better job? Also PCSX2 runs on series X/S so they have a better PS2 emulator than PlayStation 😒

@Maubari a better controller , wow really

@Maubari huh is this a satire post or something? The PS5 is an amazing console overall. You gotta be craving attention to say this.

While not the absolute worst, this is sad to hear. Does the average consumer care about PS2 games? There must be some demand from gamers like us, otherwise why would Sony even try at all.

My question is, can I play Scarface with it? That’s the one PS2 era game I really felt like I missed out on.

I thought they looked fine imo. 🤷‍♂️

@JohntheRaptor No, it's really not. Especially compared to the PS4; In the three years I had the console I've only had two games I really liked.. Ratchet and Clank Rift Apart and Hogwarts Legacy. None of the other titles appeal to me or I found enjoyable. Meanwhile, on the PS4 I loved:
Uncharted, Sly Cooper, Gravity Rush, Knack, Mass Effect LE, and many other titles. The PS5 is lacking in variety imo. However, this is probably slightly solved with the release of Astro Bot in September.

I feel like this continues to be an issue at Sony's end. They launch the games, they run like crap, then an emulator update comes out that fixes the problems. Legend of Dragoon had something similar back when it launched.

I don't care any visual enhancements, just give me working PS2 emulator. And of course original 4:3 picture scale (I hate 16:9 stretch of 4:3 format). I have so much games it is sin to let them sit on shelf...

@AdamNovice It's not uncommon that companies delist racing games. In recent time, Sony has delisted Gran Turismo Sport and DriveClub.

https://www.pushsquare.com/news/2024/01/pour-one-out-for-gran-turismo-sport-now-delisted-from-ps-store

https://www.pushsquare.com/news/2020/03/feature_driveclub_delisted_and_taken_offline_-_lets_talk_about_one_of_ps4s_best_racers

They'll most likely delist Gran Turismo 7 as well down the line once the next entry comes out.

@Haruki_NLI
I think you totally nailed it.

Weird since all the PS2 games on PS4 that I have run perfectly fine. The only issues being things I dealt with on the OG hardware...

@Maubari there is something hilarious here alright.

I just can’t fathom why they can’t get this right. So much of PCSX2 has been reverse engineered by some of the smartest devs out there, so why are Sony so outclassed considering that they have the original documentation and engineers still at the company who worked on the Emotion Engine?

@Maubari xbox fanbouy alert.

It's on my ps+ account, so.... not bothered.

As always sony doesnt care about their games AND the customers. That happens when there is no competition

You know, I was still perfectly happy playing sly cooper on PlayStation emulator despite Sony apparent lack of care and looking at the user reviews, the vast majority of people were as well.

@J_e_f_f__D I share similar sentiment that PS5 has been the worst PlayStation by far. I got in with PS3 and loved it. PS4 took awhile but eventually became a fantastic machine in its own right with a great library. But PS5? It's nearly 4 years old and it's exclusives that appeal to me, compared to past generations, is paltry by comparison. Off-hand, I believe I have 6, and over half of those were already on PS4, like Spiderman MM and Ghost of Tsushima. Sony is wasting their talents making multiplayer titles no one wanted, like that cancelled Last of Us Factions, or awful-looking live service crap like Concord. Develop an original Uncharted for PS5, or bring back Infamous, or Twisted Metal, or Warhawk, or Syphon Filter, or prioritize a sequel to Tsushima, stuff like that.
The part about Xbox and BWC is just an objective fact that MS has done the best job this generation, compared to Sony and Nintendo. It's one of my favourite Xbox features.

Sony ensuring that I remain uninterested in the higher tiers of their service. It'd actually be worth it if they put some legitimately rare stuff on it like Haunting Ground or the Xenosaga games.

Why not speak nicely to the pcsx2 team.

@djlard doubt they'd make any emulator disc compatible, they'll be looking for us to buy them again. Don't know if you've noticed, but a lot of the big emulator rom sites have delisted PS related titles.

@trev666 yeah buy games you already own, I've got a drawer with all the big ps2 titles. Think I'll stick to emulating ps2 on my pc, it's lightyears ahead of anything Sony has done for backward compatibility. Whole thing is just a money grab. This will be why hundreds of playstation titles have been removed from rom sites. They've finally realised there's a market for retro.

@S727 the studio behind this emulator was founded by former PCSX2 developers.

I do wish Sony would take at least a little bit more interest in their backwards compatibility. The weird thing is the PSP emulation looks good. I just hopped on Killzone Liberation for a quick play session the other day and it looks really great actually. Sly on the other hand is a bit ugly, which is sad to see because the Sly collection on PS3 looks leaps and bounds better.

Hopefully they figure something out.

@Shepherd_Tallon the emulator being used here has the same interface as the ones for PS1 and PSP. They are updated fairly often with new features so it's a given that the PS2 emulator will be updated in the near future, hopefully.

Sony should definitely talk to the company which made PS2 so they can give them the specs for the console in order to emulate it right

Given that Sly Cooper is the biggest PS Classic hit so far, surpassing Legend of Dragoon, I guess people care less about pinpoint performance than Digital Foundry does.

But then again, DF does complain if there's a 1~2 FPS fluctuation bellow the 60FPS threshold so...

@Maubari Sure, okay... O_o

@Maubari The Xbox controller is not better it has not evolved a bit in ages it's the same thing with no extras for a long time.

@jrt87 You still have to buy the older titles the new consoles don't have a DVD drive.

@yohn777 Haunting Grounds I own a original copy that is still in seal bought it last year new. 😂

Was it that bad???

I mean. I bought a bunch of PS2 classics for PS4 like J&D 1 and 2, Wild Arms 3, Ape Escape 2, Rogue Galaxy, Psychonauts, and Dark Cloud 2 and all of them works just fine.

I also bought some for my PS3 like Maximo, God Hand, P3 FES, SMT 3, Shinobi, Contra Shattered Soldier, Fatal Frame 2, and Odin Sphere and i didn't notice any tech error.

I guess i need to buy Sly Cooper to found out if it's that bad...

Its a shame we can't play the old games, but at the same time I understand why Sony don't throw funds at it because the reality is most people only play the new things. I recently set up the PS3 emulator on my PC tho and thats pretty damn good.

RESISTANCE FTW

@Flaming_Kaiser How much you spent for a brand new Haunting Ground? I check price charting and it cost $600+ so you're lucky if you got it less than that.

@PuppetMaster It was the only PS2 game they had and it was €30. 😂

@Jaz007 That version is actually worse. Better off playing the original.

@Fartingale then they shouldn't be having issues although the dude that made duckstation really made a big impact on pcsx2, optimised it really Well.

PS3 & PS2 are the king and queen of the playstation family , ps5 is pretty much just a peasant

Personally I'm not to interested in emulated old games, especially ones that were quite common. Now if this was used to bring back rarer titles, or things that went under the radar for me I'd have a gander. However I do think digital foundry is ass, does anyone my age care as much about all of this (I'm the big 4-0) I of course want the game to work but it seems to feed into the visual side nitpicking everything. Guess it's why visual/artistic style seems to have all but disappeared to be replaced with as hyper realistic characters and environs as we can get while people whine about how a game like rebirth looks like its from a PS3 apparently. Sorry off topic a tad and I am old now lol

@LowDefAl I think you're confusing "subjectively" with "objectively" here. I love the Xbox controller's rolling d-pad. It reminds me of the d-pads on Sega Mega Drive and Saturn controllers. Makes playing something like the original Streets of Rage trilogy (especially 3) much better. The PS4's d-pad is pretty damn great too, mind you. It's just Nintendo's d-pads that are absolutely abysmal right now.

@S727 then they would be having issues because PCSX2 still has issues itself. I haven’t been using pcsx2 for long but pretty much every game I’ve played so far has had problems, random crashes, broken AI, Those 60fps patches have a habit of breaking gameplay, so even though implicit conversions/Sony new ps2 emulator may be missing a lot of bells and whistles of pcsx2 right now at least it’s been stable for me so far and the ability to rewind gameplay is fantastic, i’ll take it over being able to play in 4K any day of the week.

The irony that Xbox can run* PS2 games better is real.

*emulator running in Xbox developer mode.

There's been some comments (& not that I don't agree with the sentiment),about why they don't hire modders that are involved with PCX2 & others to write the emulators?

One of the co-founders of Implicit Conversions that have been tasked with the PSP/PS1/PS2 emulation efforts,Jake Stine apparently was involved with PCSX2 in the past. So there literally is a modder of experience involved.

I agree its annoying when the OG company that made the consoles should have the documentation of its old hardware but to what extent we don't know. The PS1-PS3 engineers like Ken Katuragi have long retired from their roles. Matk Cerny as a developer no doubts knew how to get the best out of the older gens having helped make some of their top games. But as lead on PS4,PS5 & possibly PS6 he's busy with next gen work & its never a clear cut thing.🤔

Though we're not going to see Implicit bag their employers or imply they only funded a cheap emulation effort,it would be interesting if Push Square did an interview (or DF),& discuss the challenges of official emulation design.

Sony have always used a mix of hardware or at times software efforts BITD. Eg: PS1 emulation on ps3 & PSP were pretty good from memory. But is this PS2 effort based off the so-so emulation that was used on the original PS2 Classics on PS4?

My phone emulates better than these consoles

Personally think Tomb Raider looks and plays great. Never played the original so it's all new to me. Can't say I've noticed the blurryness. Especially on an OLED.

@Flaming_Kaiser the ps5 disc version does play dvds so it would be able to recognise a ps2 game

@Maubari Ah, so because it doesn't have enough games you personally like, it has to be a trash console that people shouldn't defend. Have you considered the possibility that those people are actually finding plenty of games they enjoy on it?

@Ainu20 Yeah, I most likely just don't like Playstation anymore; they don't offer nearly as much variety anymore than they did 10 or 20 years ago, which is a shame. And this happens with people all the time too.

@Maubari I would argue there's more variety on offer than ever before, just not in the AAA space.

I just wish they had better upscale/res in PS2 classics.

Rogue Galaxy in 4k looks great on emulator! Why can't I do the same thing on PS5?

Sly cooper was 60fps on PS2, and from the bit of new footage I've seen, it's still 60fps on PS5. Rare screw-up from DF, it seems.

They've barely got any PS1 games out and just started PS2 games and now PS3 maybe.so many PS1 games that could still be added

@daveofduncan @daveofduncan yeah me 2

@Flaming_Kaiser It has it's ergonomic differences but I mean it's people's fault for not knowing Impulse Triggers (rumble triggers of sorts) existed before HD Rumble and Haptics on the Xbox One controller since 2013 launch model controllers even if in so few games use it that I can tell (I own what 30 or so 1st/3rd party games for it then my 100+ PS4 library and that's my largest console library) same as the few that use the Touchpad as a touchpad for gestures or half buttons (4 quadrants on Vita) then a big Select button. Or scaling the vibration levels I came across in Azure Gunvolt collection for PS4, other games may do that I don't know. Besides the few that use gyro as well.

It wasn't just design changes again for the Xbox One controller, it did have a hardware feature upgrade just no one paid attention when they did it because of the start of the Xbox One launch people talked about more.

It works fine in Gears gun reload minigame to time it or Forza/Project Cars 3 for accel/brake guidance. Those are the only games I have experienced it in so far.

Other than that if the gyro in the next console controller happens sure it will be inline with Sony/Nintendo but otherwise it's still fairly caught up more than people realise but yes not as much as the other two because of lacking motion controls or as much vibration/haptics as the Dualsense or HD Rumble offer.

But to say it's the 'same' controller is inaccurate. For people that skipped the console I don't blame people but just saying as when playing multiplatform then 1 platform as all can afford or all of interest (makes sense) just jumping in the more I've experienced collecting for all 3 platforms to inform/point out politely.

Is unfortunate but didn't have high expectations either. Whelp PS2/PS3 still works so good there for the future.

Then again what gets offered. I don't assume Capcom will offer Under the Skin for them at all. Who knows what will be offered really, and the time and care better uploads to the service either and updates as they go/news to gain hype.

I was surprised Push Square put the PC/Android emulator options at all, but at also not wrong either, at the same time it is what audiences would compare that are deep into games or were already doing is original hardware or fan emulators and brave journalists willing to say whatever the case other than say archive type news sources like Time Extension part of this group of new sites.

I mean no one wanted to compare Mario 3D Allstars to fan emulators because getting on company good sides or to the originals when fans will go yeah nah better options even besides mods/PC port.

That sucks. I support legal emulation but it is always annoying when the software isn’t up to the task. Here’s hoping sony will improve their emulators over time.

@trev666 really i thought it didn't going to try it right away. 😅