PS5 Pro's Proprietary Upscaler PSSR Is Looking Very Promising

Now they can focus on pushing games on a mechanical standing rather than visually…. right?

In Mark Cerny I believe

This stuff just makes me sad. We have put the emphasis on the wrong technicalities these last few generations.
I don't care about frame rates, particles, shadows, image quality or whatever. None of this stuff makes the core game or gameplay any better.

I'm more impressed seeing the various physics systems in GTA IV on PS3. Something we've left behind and something even PS2 games do better than PS5

@McTwist There are plenty of games that try to innovate, just look at all the indie games or B title games available. Outward for one has a terrible review score, but I placed a lot of hours into the game because - once it clicks, it really sukcs you in.

These games are usually overlooked due to the critic review scores. But you can find a lot of hidden gems out there if we simply judge the game by its concept, and not by its graphics. The game market is no longer tied to big developers 10, 20 years ago. Indie devs and B-title studios are where the innovation lies.

I watched this last night and was pretty impressed on how far this is along - its no DLSS yet looking at the evidence, although it compares reasonably well, but from this and the other (many) videos DF have produced it blows away the non hardware based upscalers the base PS5 can use.

PSSR will likely be absolutely essential for PS6 - which in terms of raw GPU power wont be anywhere near as far ahead of PS5 Pro as PS5 was from PS4 Pro - well, not unless we want £800+ consoles.

Now it just comes down to adoption of Pro from 3rd Party (as well as obviously 1st party), them feeding back to Sony any limitations in PSSR, and Sonys ability to improve PSSR over the next 4 ish years before PS6.

Such an improvement. This is going to be a big difference maker. Its worth every penny. The normal PS5 just doesn't compare

After being sick over the price reveal I’m now over it and excited for 7th Nov for my preorder to arrive!

Holding off starting any new ps5 games until it arrives!

@McTwist That’s also why Astrobot is super fun. You can interact in real time with the physics. You even have real time fluid simulation, it’s not prerecorded. Of course it’s not engineering level, but it’s there. All of this graphics stuff is more about watching a movie, not gaming…

@Mikey856

Supersampling is a little better then megasampling, but not as good as ultrasampling.

I watched this video yesterday and was quite impressed with the confetti and grass, and then I realized that I couldn't remember what the confetti and grass look like, because despite playing and completing the game, I don't stop to look at confetti and grass.

At this point we really are focusing on superfluous things.

This is the big selling point of the Pro for me and a great showing so far and it's a good step up from the latest version of FSR. Plus we've already seen what it can do with games like FFVII, where the developers implemented a rather crude upscaling method initially.

@ZeroSum yeah we’re way past the point of diminishing returns. This is all cool and dandy, but at 800€ it all seems pointless and shallow.

If we need back to back to back 4x magnify compare shots to make a point, what really is the point anymore? It looks better? Yea it does, but is it in service of better games?

Where are the games?

@Medic_alert “ likely we won't see true benefits for years”
Very true, but at that point we’ll be well in on PS6. For wide adoption by the industry maybe 7?
The Pro just feels like they’re putting a dev kit on sale, without any dev capabilities

I'm very excited to get my Pro's on November 7th! Two of my old PS5's are going to young family relations and the third is going to a local animal welfare charity.

Been gaming over forty years and still love that 'new hardware' feeling when you unbox, connect up, power up and become a kid again for a while. 👍

DF's content on the Pro has been extensive and I've watched most of it. It seems PSSR is crucial to the upgrade, but I'm concerned that person's whom adopt the Pro are essentially beta testers for PS6, and if it doesn't work out as expected within a few months it'll be quietly forgotten, as Sony so often like to do with their hardware.

I think the main problem facing consoles (and to a similar extent, PC gaming) is we're way past the leaps we're used to seeing in fidelity so the focus is becoming more immersive which the little things become more important for, higher frame rates and consistent visual performance help as well, of course.

@Carck that's just to emphasise it. When you look at what it's done to FF7 Rebirth you can spot the difference instantly

I did my own little weird test as I was on the fence about buying a PS5 Pro.
Summary.
Took Final Fantasy VII rebirth. PS5.
Stood still in lots of testing locations.
30fps at native 4K
60fps at 1080p

I could hardly tell the difference apart from a bit more sharper, I even got the same spot as DF did.

Anyway I asked a few techs on here and the reason.
My TV a Sony x95l 65” of course has its own upscaling chips and system like most top end TVS and it’s doing an amazing job of being a PS5 Pro from an upscaling point of view.
Ok the techs on here said it will probably upscale a little bit better on the PS5 Pro but essentially the TV is upscaling to make 1080p look 4K to fit all the pixels on the 4K TV screen.
And we know who is the best at that and motion Sony TVS. It’s a big part of what Sony advertise about with their top TVs

So for know I’m not getting a PS5 Pro until I see far better results and it put to more use graphically.

I would not expect to much if you have a top end TV that is scaling things up amazingly as it is.

@Andy22385
See my message below.
And what TV were DF using probably a none upscaling monitor that does not upscaling itself like top end TVs do, especially Sony TVs like mine.

@McTwist I fired up my PS3 last year on my new TV (which I bought for the PS5), and played Last of us (on the PS3) it looked amazing.....

@OldGamer999 great input. I was wondering about the same, guess you did it for me (and a bunch of other people...)

I found DLSS to be a much bigger deal than raytracing when I still had my gaming PC. RTX on usually meant the picture quality (sharpness especially) suffered and IMO RTX is a gimmick not worth the processing power and the heat it makes the machine generate. That said, FSR is pathetic in comparison and PSSR getting its first trial run in PS5 Pro makes me seriously consider getting the PS6 in the future (not getting the Pro).

And that is why I will wait for the PS6. I’ll say it again, I’ll never buy mid life console updates, they’re always half baked and usually trials what the next generation has to offer, only better and perfected.

@OldGamer999 I've got a Sony A95L and can't wait to use the Pro on it. FFVII Rebirth doesn't magically look better even with my top end set! The Sony upscalers even on these kind of sets are still not AI based in the way that DLSS and PSSR work. Plus, it's also about the frame rate and detail improvements. Looking forward to Dragons Dogma II at 60fps.

I think a high end OLED is the perfect set for a Pro! Then again, I'm a tech nerd who retired at 52 (thanks, 2013 me who bought bitcoin when everyone was laughing at it) with plenty of disposable so I was never not going to buy the Peo.

@GamerGuy1970
You have an amazing TV OLED as where mine is mini LED. Not that it makes an upscaling difference.
Try my simple real world test if you want.
Yes you can notice a difference but only a tiny bit sharper.
These Sony TVs are well known to upscale and with motion the best in the world.

@OldGamer999 the real test will be once the Pro is my hands!

@GamerGuy1970
You enjoy and I’m sure you will especially on the e A95L, I’m think of getting one but will wait until Black Friday.

I have the new Sony sound Bravia sound bar, with sub woofer and rear speakers, sound amazing for a sound bar. Sony are really hitting it home with these products.
So you can see I’m a big Sony fan, so not dishing the Pro, but it’s setting itself up or the media are.
Yes when Sony release a new big AAA then I think you will see the Pro at its best then.

@OldGamer999 I could spot it instantly from the textures, grass and models.

@Andy22385
So did I on the DF video but not on my TV when I did my own little test with FF VII Rebirth on my PS5.
I’m sure the Pro will do a better job than my Sony TV at upscaling then there is other benefits which will show more when Sony release a new big AAA that can take better advantage of the Pro.

@McTwist Right? Like why are those the only things that people seem to care about anymore? Why can’t we just enjoy playing a nice fun game? I just got a Game Boy Color, I could care less about all this high resolution high FPS stuff.

@throwmeaname I feel people invest too much stock in going off reviews. If you want to know how a game is, just play the damn thing. I’ve seen my brother enjoy and have a lot of fun in games that are negatively reviewed. Hell, I enjoyed Sonic 06 with him! The only thing I do care about in reviews is if a game is truly glitchy enough that it actually makes in unplayable.

@Andy22385 no, I can’t. I played 100 hours of the game, and unless I’m watching a side by side comparison I wouldn’t be able to tell one version from the other (not with online video compression at play anyway)

Wow. Can’t wait for what the ps6 will offer. Im skip the pro though.

@LowDefAl @Mikey856 The PS4 Pro uses super sampling so it's not a new invention - just more advanced on the PS5 Pro.
The PS4 Pro, when connected to a 1080p display and super sampling is selected in the settings, renders screens at 4K and then scales it properly onto a 1080p display and thereby you reduce jaggies and other graphical artifacts.

PSIX is going to be a beast.

@sanderson72 that's not at all how PSSR works! It's an AI trained upscaler like DLSS, not a linear model. It's going to be brilliant especially bearing in mind how good it's looking in these early iterations.

Can't wait for 07/11. And with Stardew Valley 1.6 update dropping on the 4th, it's gonna be a very good week!

As a pc player ai upscalers sounded fantastic when they were first introduced - free extra performance at the same resolution targets, great.

The reality is, most devs now use upscalers as a means to reduce the resources that were once allocated to optimisation. In the past pc games targeted native resolutions, now pretty much every game lists recommended and minimum settings using upscalers with projected frame rates achieved through ai frame generation. The “extra performance” promised from these technologies has been completely eroded to the point where they are being used to achieve baseline performance at the expense of optimisation.

Ratchet and Clank is practically unplayable for me without PSSR so I'll wait until PS6 comes out and the technology matures

@Carck you seem to be the only sane person hear there all like pssr is going to be amazing like ok yeah that's nice weres the games I rekon Xbox is going to have some form of Ai upscaling this time around but people are still not rely paying attention it still dosent mean you anit being ripped of so many people hear also thing the PS5 pro will output 8k 60fps and stuff like this it is quite amusing to see people that have no Idear what there buying or what there talking about I think this is a big L on Sony part If the PS5 was so grate why do they need a pro to begin with oh yeah to suck dry there fans as yet they have no Idear what there talking about and will just believe any thing Sony says as gosbal.

@Czar_Khastik pssr isent even outttt yet ?

@Neither_scene you are correct just look at squrd and it is rely sad that there basically selling us graphics chips that can't do f all with out dlss/Frame gen things haven't got better AI Upscaler+lazy development= rubbish profromance and the amount of energy these chips consume for the little return is quite sad

@Mikey856 what it dose it's takes a lower Res imagine and increases the resolution simple so your system doesn't take such a profromance hit at say running at 4k native so you can upscale a 1080p image to 4k artificially so it looks like 4k doesn't mean it is 4k thow just makes it look like witch is the end result anyway this may induce artifacting thow if done poorly

Another ps5 pro sales pitch. Notice all these articles singing toe virtues of the pro after the initial backlash about pricing.

@Carck can tell in one second by looking at the character model. I play on a monitor maybe it's different. Performance mode was muddy as hell

@Andy22385 maybe if you sit at a desk to play, at that point you’d be better off with a computer than a PS5 Pro

I just feel like this AI upscaling never looks good. Especially frame generation.

@OldGamer999 Your TV isn't making Rebirth look better, that upscale tech your TV has doesn't really impact games that much because stuff like that only works when the consoles actually support it. DF use the best tech they can get and if they knew there's a TV that can get a 4K image from Rebirth we would know about it. Honestly features like this are a con to jack up the price of the TV's.

@DennisReynolds
Well I’m not total convinced by the whole thing Pro wise.
You can see games at native 4K now just at 30fps.
Pro is just taking say the 60fps 1440p image and PSSR upscaling.

Some TV top end are really good, but then again if TVs or that feature are just a con, including Sony TVs then so could the PS5 Pro.

I’m just totally not convinced right now.
Also there is screen size and tv watching distance that all come into play with what your eye actually sees in the picture. That’s well known and includes 4K movie viewing distances etc.

Looking forward to seeing how this plays out. Also looking forward to how the new game boost will help PS4 games.

@silversteel91 isn't exactly sucking the fans dry when they aren't making any money on it. And it actually does do 8K/60 even though 8K is pointless.

@Carck I have both, but my monitor is on a bracket next to my sofa. I have the PS5 for exclusives and cheaper games

@throwmeaname I agree with you. Can you name some innovative action or rpg titles? Thanks

@silversteel91
Do us all a favor and crawl back to where u came from.
You listed 6 straight times and all of it was gibberish

Ok, I know everyone knows I have a lot of issues with the pro, but that's neither here nor there. What I have the biggest problem with is the appearance that DF has become the primary marketing firm for this product and has appeared to give away all credibility as they continue to be nearly the only entity really taking about it all while having special favored status to play with the hardware granted by Sony on a leash. Nothing about it seems on the level. I don't expect Push Square (interestingly my autocorrect just suggested "Liam" as a replacement for "Push"... 🤔 ) to be unbiased and impartial but, why doesn't Push have this access? Why is push left to just republish special access by the vendor that's clearly oh so not conditional, to a single outlet or two? It's not like we've seen this sort of thing in gaming before, of course not.....

@DennisReynolds high end video scalers are nothing new. Back years ago it was all about getting DVD to 1080p. TVs had good better best internal processors. Receivers went deeper down the rabbit hole. And external processor scalers for separates cost thousands in 2006 money. The trick for games is always making it good AND fast. The classic Anchor processors you could fry eggs on was the defacto choice for getting 1080p. Had 360 and PS3 setup behind an anchor. Output at 720p though processor to 1080p, boom, much better quality. And could get a room over 100F in the summer in half an hour 😂 Same thing at work in modern tv processors (or rack).

@Bigmanfan usually ai upscaling looks great in general. Not perfect, but better than native low res. Nothing beats native res but it's still good enough to be better than lowering res for the same performance.

@Neither_scene This. And it's also why console games run so bad, as the devs just plan on dlss and whatever happens on console happens.

@GamerGuy1970 Nice giving a PS5 to animal welfare. Too many animals go without video games despite the constant playtime seeking we see from cats laying on keyboards and controllers. People often forget the importance of games to animals. Cats seem to love Doom. The whole rip and tear thing speaks to their fuzzy blackened souls.

@McTwist It's depressing that the most physics based game we've played since Half Life 2 and Portal 2 are the new Zeldas that run on a 2011 tablet processor.

@Mikey856 Exactly, if I can't see a clear reflection of my car in my opponent's car while cutting corners, then I'm out of immersion which basically means it's a PS2 era game.

My only worry is that devs will start to rely heavily on this instead of optimising games like they seem to be doing with some PC titles now.

But if used properly (especially with VR), we should hopefully get some great results

@2here2there I dont know anything current, but there's a lot of indie/B-title games out there.

Valheim is a very innovative action survival game, which received a lot of great reviews and updates since. Another one of my fave is Project Zomboid - another indie title that simulates what its like to survive in a zombie apocalypse. Highly recommended with friends.

B-titles like the Trails Of series are great JRPGs to also dip your toes in. Push Square provides positive reviews of Falcom games, and specific to Trails Of - I'd argue that this series offer amazing world building that is much stronger than established AAA games like Final Fantasy. Interestingly, Metaphor ReFantasio's mixed action/turn-base gameplay was actually inspired from Trails through Daybreak's model. So as you can see, B title games are inspiring other game devs to adapt to new and creative ideas from B titles.