As an old games media meme once pointed out, the problem with Sony’s games is they’re too good. Okay, we’re being facetious, but there’s a nugget of truth here when it comes to the PS5 Pro, as this analysis of Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart illustrates. Ultimately, the problem is the game already looks incredible on base hardware, so you’ve really got to search for the improvements.
This analysis from tech experts Digital Foundry does a good job of digging out the details, but this isn’t a Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth situation, where the performance mode is so poor that PlayStation’s new proprietary upscaler is transformative.
Instead, in the Performance RT mode – which balances raytracing with a 60fps refresh rate – you’re looking at some cleaner edges and improved details. In a YouTube video, even on a 4K screen at full-screen, you really have to look to see the differences.
The improvements do close the gap with the original game’s fidelity mode on base hardware, and it’s running at double the frame rate here, so it is an overall win. But as we noted at the start of this article, because the original game is already so well optimised, there’s a lot less to be gained here. And that’s a problem a lot of Sony’s first-party titles are going to find.
[source eurogamer.net]
Comments 128
Can you pass me a magnifying glass please to give me a fighting chance of seeing a difference
$700 well spent.👍
Though at this point as humanity enters it’s death spiral and money has lost all meaning I suppose if you haven’t purchased a PS5 yet but you want to join the party what does an extra $200 or $300 matter, might as well buy the best hardware you can.🤷🏻♂️
Its the lazy 3rd party devs this will help the most not the in house stuff.
If anything, the fact that Rift Apart was revolutionary in the performance capability for PS5 only builds my concern that developers will use the existence of the PS5 Pro to optimise less than many already do, and the full power of the base PS5 will still go unrealised.
Insomniac's games have great art-styles and tend to be well-optimized for everything they release on, so you're not going to see really transformative differences compared to other releases.
I finally played Marvel's Spider-Man this year on PS4 and was blown away by how good it looks on a 4K set, even on ancient hardware.
The game looked great on the base PS5. I played a little bit of the PC port a few months ago and it looks great there as well. I feel it's more props to Insmoniac for being able to have the game just look so good with the art direction.
Exactly the reason the PS5 Pro is a waste of money.
I bought the PS4 Pro and regretted it the entire time I had it. Could barely tell the difference in games and it gave me way more problems than my base PS4.
For a little extra industry context, Microsoft just released "new" versions of the Series consoles. 2TB Xbox Series X costs $600. Aside from the extra SSD space, there are no improvements to the original Series X. Sure, that model has a disc drive, but $700 for a mid-gen PS5 refresh doesn't seem so crazy with that in mind...
What I get pO'd with....they never doubled down on PS4 pro enhanced games, Sony were clear from the start, no Pro exclusive games, it was up to the Devs, and in the end, we got very little improvements, and games still plagued with performance OR quality settings. This time it feels like they are forcing a drive for PS5 pro exclusive PS4 games as some sort of win. !!!SKCOLLOB
Ps5 pro is only for the super hardcore not for the average gamer.
It’s pathetic. This just shows that we won’t get any games that push boundaries the way that Rift Apart did on launch. We’re stuck with PS4 level games boosted to PC level specs. A colossal disappointment of a generation, and honestly the death knell for consoles. Roll on Nintendo to give at least a glimmer of hope.
PS5 Pro wasn't really made for games like this though, was it?
It's made for games where you prefer 60fps but consequently have to suffer a drop in image quality.
Ratchet & Clank is not one of those. Loads of other games are.
I'm certain it'll be worth it.
So why'd they even bother with the base model then, should've just waited and released Pro as actual PS5 in say 2023. Because it's not like people are missing a lot with most games still on PS4. Major games from ND or R* haven't even released yet. Hardware releasing faster than software, cart before the horse tsk.
Insomniac is already very good at optimizing and giving you options for playing whoever you want. I played R&C in performance RT mode and it looked amazing, but there's also performance no-RT, Quality, Quality 40fps, Performance 120fps. And they're all well optimized so none of them look like a blurry mess from normal viewing distances.
@nessisonett I’m a bit confused, what do you mean by PS4 level games? The example you gave is a PS5 game
For me personally I haven't seen enough improvements so for with ps5 pro to make the upgrade worth it for me. And I can't be bothered with the boxing/ unboxing process and having to sort all the wires out again ( OCD nightmare 😂 ) I've only had my ps5 for just over a year anyway, perhaps i might upgrade at a later date or just wait for ps6 🤷♂️ also in these early comparison videos they don't seem to mention the 40fs option on some ps5 games. Personally I would rather play ratchet in that mode as the fidelity mode looks better anyway based on this digital foundry video. I know most people don't have compatible tvs for the 40fts mode though, but it works great on base ps5 for a lot of the playstation exclusives. Unfortunately I don't think many third party developers have 40fts mode in ps5 games. I think avatar game does, I do have a boxed copy of it but not got around to playing it yet though.
@nessisonett Nintendo, who are still releasing games that could run on a PS3?
I don't get the issue. Are we gonna ignore FF7 Rebirth? Ratchet & Clank was already optimised very well, running 4K with ray tracing and all.
Obviously games that run worse are gonna see more improvement than games that already run well and look good
@nessisonett "We’re stuck with PS4 level games boosted to PC level specs."
"Roll on Nintendo to give at least a glimmer of hope."
But the Switch 2 is set to have specs close to the PS4 so where is your hope actually going towards? 😅
It's an enthusiast's console for those who want one. Why do we need to keep demonising it as a waste of money? Nobody has to buy it. Most products have a base model and improved models. Why are there gamers who actually want to disparage a platform holder for offering a premium version of their console. Such odd behaviour. Complaining seems to be something people who are clearly not the target audience do, and I can only guess it's because they wish they were.
@Tecinthebrain @wildcat_kickz @LogicStrikesAgain The specs change, the actual core design methodologies remain the same. This is the problem, games evolved between even PS3 and PS4 in terms of scope and scale. Games between PS4 and PS5 have not had a meaningful bump in ambition, just focusing on meaningless details which brings us to PS5 Pro, a console entirely focused on those stupid details. The Switch is old old hardware but Tears of the Kingdom focused on extreme optimisation and creative, new gameplay elements that haven’t been seen outside maybe Dreams, which got taken out the back and shot. I go back and forth with modern Nintendo but they’re pushing evolution of games in a much more interesting direction without focusing on just visual boosts.
Yeah games like R&C and The Last of Us were never going to look that much better as they already looked near perfect. Its Rebirth, Hogwarts, Dragons Dogma 2, hopefully Black Myth and such that shell see the biggest improvements.
The frame rate on ratchet looked very noticeable though in Cerneys demo
@wildcat_kickz actually there are some improvements over the original launch series x. Microsoft have moved production of the SoC to a 6nm process meaning that newer series x consoles run more efficiently than the original systems. They have a slightly reduced power draw and can be cooled more easily. I do agree that $600 is still a terrible price point for the 2tb model.
@nessisonett Alan Wake 2, Spidey 2, Avatar, Baldur's Gate 3, GTA 6 (we all know it will) and more all push these so called "boundaries". Like let's be honest what exactly are you expecting to be pushed? People expected way too much out of this gen.
@nessisonett to be honest the ps4 was pretty great so was always going to be a small jump to ps5. For me the biggest jump was the frame rate boost and the SSD. Its a shame that only really Astrobot has taken the gaming experience to a new level by its fantastic Dualsense use.
@Fuzzymonkeyfunk Astro’s Playroom is unironically still the highlight of the PS5 for me. What a game. I’ll get Astro Bot when I can!
Speaking of the PS5 Pro, it's just been announced in my territory, and pre-orders go live in about a month's time.
It will cost gamers here around £850 or $1 104 to get the PS5 Pro, without factoring in the cost of getting the Disc-Drive add-on as well.
@Neither_scene I don't really consider your electric bill going down a bit as a fundamental improvement to the console, at least in terms of games.
@Ken_Kaniff Does the power supply on your PS4 Pro make a buzzing sound? Is the disc drive starting to have issues reading discs? Do you get randomly logged out, causing the game you're playing to close and you have to log back in?
Yeah, even though I like my PS4 Pro (it's the red Spider-Man one from 2018), I miss my old regular PS4, which had none of those problems.
The issue unlike with the PS4 pro you had a 4K resolution that you had not seen before.
With this new generation PS5 you can get the high resolution and actually see it and use but at 30fps.
The Pro is just giving you that with an upscaled at 60fps.
But you still have that 30fps mode with that Pro resolution on the PS5.
Which you did not have with the PS4 to the PS4 Pro.
@zidane4028 Sorry you have those problems, but that just sounds like bad luck. I keep a PS4 Pro in my bedroom and have had no issues since I bought it years ago.
@Ken_Kaniff Did you have a 4K TV with your PS4 Pro? I think that and HDR were the big differences between the two models, so if you didn't utilize 4K, then I would agree that there probably wasn't a marked improvement.
Zero temptation to get a pro
Doubling the framerate of fidelity mode is pretty significant, IMO.
Im 100% sure I’ll notice a difference in person.
I play on a high quality OLED, and I notice even minor issues with presentation and other displays. I always get the urge to fix people’s setups when I visit them. I don’t ever mention it though. I’m okay if they are happy living in ignorance.
@Ken_Kaniff Square-Enix disagrees with you.
On the base PS5 with a 120 Hz display, the Fidelity mode outputs dynamic 4K / 40-60 Hz with ray-tracing, so the gap between this and the PS5-Pro is even slimmer.
@zidane4028 never had a PS4, but have a PS4 pro. No buzzing sounds, no problems with disc drive but...I guess the hard is going out, since every time it goes into sleep mode, I can't turn it on and have to go through the "cold" start. I am happy with it. Very good console, which I still fire up now and then (more likely to start my PS3, but that's another story)
I have the ps5, but I'm not sure if in going for the Pro, unless I can get hold on a anniversary model...
@nessisonett Those ‘meaningless and stupid ’ details is what fuels the global GPU card industry. I guess it does matter to some people. Just sayin
@TheArt Good luck selling this when everyone was paying insane amounts for their energy bills and uncertainty with their jobs.
@zidane4028 If you have these issues I don't know how king you had them why would you not send it back?
@Atreus97 @Gunnerzaurus
Get out of here with your Logic and Reason.
Only irrational hyperbole is allowed in discussions of the PS5 Pro
@LogicStrikesAgain An industry that saw price spikes due to mining which didn’t go back down when mining died. So the only winners are shareholders.
Well, this is most certainly one of the games i wont be replaying soon on the pro.
They couldn't even reach fidelity graphics. That is not good selling point for the PRO
So basically the problem is sony has some of the best engineers in the world. That's a good problem to have.
I was always pleased with the graphics in Ratchet and Clank games. The problem with those games specifically, for me, was the slowdown. If it fixes that, it’s a win.
The main benefit I saw with my PS4 Pro was it was quieter and didn't struggle in longer gaming sessions, it was also better with PSVR, although it was definitely more of a want than a need, ultimately I was very happy with it and encouraged all my friends to make the switch. None of whom had an issues whatsoever (although all have been stripped, cleaned, repasted and repadded at some point).
Although I don't think the base PS5 is being taken full advantage of, I want games to look as pretty and run as smooth as possible so I've pre-ordered a Pro (and because Nectar points I haven't had to shell out £700) because I'm able to, and have a display that will benefit from it. Is it the wisest thing to have done? No. But neither was £1500 on a TV last year or nearly 3 grand on HiFi recently.
Although I still need to find a disc drive in the next 3 weeks.
I hate YouTube compression the stark difference from when u download a digital foundry video from there patreon is insane its so much better looking
@Ken_Kaniff for you. Dragon age and FF7 Rebirth alone show the worth for me. I refuse to play at 30 fps and that's the difference
@rjejr I mean why use this game as a basis and saying a waste of money? It already looked amazing in 60 fps on the base PS5. Use a game like Rebirth as a metric which didn't. Differences like that are where its worth my money.
@TheArt because it was already very well optimised on the PS5...why does that mean last gen should have gone another 4 years. Not as if they cut the gen short. Who wants to wait over 10 years between a console gen. I've probably played 20 games only on a PS5 console wise...worth it to me
A lot of people on strong doses of copium right now.
@Loamy Your to close to the TV my man. There are normally recommend viewing distances for each size of screen. Yours is 1.7 metres so your a little to near the screen me thinks.
@LowDefAl
Yeah true, I'm happy with my base ps5 for now. Maybe in a year from now if there is many games that are significantly better on ps5 pro then I might consider it. Looking back i didn't get ps4 until 2015 and then upgraded to the ps4 pro two years later, although I did get a good black Friday deal on the ps4 pro and sold my Base ps4 after.
Most devs not going to bother with this
Technology should be created to solve a problem, we shouldn’t create a problem to justify a technology.
Some fuel for the naysayers to keep making blanket statements.
@nessisonett Essentially, because Nintendo have (respectively) poor tech, they have to look to being more creative in their approach to games, because graphics are not their primary concern. Which brings us to PlayStation, where the most innovative feature is the dualsense, and that's criminally underutilised, even in first party games.
This is exactly why the PS5 Pro is a waste of resources and fundamentally a useless upgrade.
PS5 games already look good. There's no need to add extra details that is pretty insignificant to gameplay.
Be smart and either don't upgrade if you already have a PS5, or just get the base model if you're planning to upgrade from last gen.
Oh man, the salt is flowing now. The PS5 Pro is pointless until they drop PS4 support. The base model PS5 still hasn't been fully taken advantage of due to being held back by last gen. Anyone who thinks the Pro model is needed right now is just lying to themselves. I know, I was one of those people last gen. PS4 Pro was almost just as pointless as the PS5 Pro is looking to be.
@J2theEzzo I really love (elements of) the DualSense and that’s part of why Astro’s Playroom felt so good on launch. The 3D rumble stuff was great, the bit with the rain falling blew my mind. The spongey buttons, crap D-Pad and massive problems with drift are less fun but I really think the controller should be the star that it just isn’t. Small things like the wind in Ghost of Tsushima was just a cool touch that makes the console feel more unique than playing the games on a PC. Consoles should have an identity and that’s what’s been missing from Xbox for over a decade and has creeped into Sony these last few years. If they’re releasing games on PC and consoles become a soulless box, it all blends into a corporate mess.
@JokerBoy322
Nah, PS4 Pro did offered legitimate advantages by at least improving performance on many games. Plus the price was extremely respectable for $100 more from base PS4.
PS5 Pro truly doesn't offer anything new aside from extra details on games that still won't be 4K. Now that's a waste of money.
The pattern I'm mostly seeing from the PS5 pro demonstrations is that what it does best with is poorly optimized games that already had insanely low rendering resolutions. It's not significant in games that already ran well, which makes sense because it's main difference is simply a better scaler.
It still presents a strange situation in console though. In PC a better GPU just means you can crank the details for "moar everything" compared to a lesser GPU. In console it means devs can make this better looking/performing mode for Pro owners, which is going to be a smaller-than-Xbox-portion of their market, and they get the choice of just not caring about Pro, bump the targets up and leave it at that, or use the Pro as an excuse to make a badly made game on console justifiable, while making their games a terrible experience for 80+% of their customers. It's an awkward place, because it defies the whole nature of a console - you pay your money, you play your game as it's meant to be, unless you pay more money and get a different experience. The whole point of console is "you buy a PS3, you play PS3 games that run as they're supposed to on PS3." Now we have "what specs do you want on your console build?" and almost announces to the market that there's the "good playstation" and the "lousy budget one", which also breaks the nature of what has made console a staple item.
@zidane4028 Wow, literally the exact same console and everything you said. Haha
@nessisonett Preach! Totally agreed. I've been using the dualsense at odd occasions when I play remotely on my laptop, and even recommended my friend (who's a pc and xbox gamer) to get one, to try out- but it really is all the little touches that make the difference.
Case in point: I went back to playing LotR: Shadow of War, and for nearly every little skirmish in the nemesis system, the orc's name gets read out of the controller speaker, and the sounds of clashing swords, or nearby secrets, all come through while playing, and it makes me smile and think- this is why I play on PlayStation!
@EbolaGW Fair point. The price point was very respectable considering what we got. If anything I'd say the PS4 Pro was worth more compared to what is being sold to us with the PS5 Pro. There was merit to claiming the PS4 Pro was needed. There is no reason the PS5 Pro exists other than for Sony to farm more money out of its fans. The fact developers are still holding the PS5 back to appease PS4 users proves this.
@JokerBoy322
Exactly! PS4 was criticized for using a Jaguar CPU, which was already old when the PS4 and Xbone released. So PS4 Pro was definitely a welcome upgrade, was noticable and wasn't too expensive at all for what it offered. Especially amazing that it dropped the price of the base model.
So a patched game, from insomniac who produce games that run at 1440 resolution, at approx 80fps, with Ray tracing (and <2s loading) - technicals 3rd party devs can only dream of; doesn't show a massive improvement on Pro... Im shocked.
Dont think I will be cancelling my pre order just yet.
@nessisonett Astrobot is absolutely fantastic! I’m not a huge platformer junky, but it is SO much fun!
Really? The blur effect, the way the crowds are, other decisions.
It's not like the Last of Us 2 extra flora and sharpness wasn't the case in the showing either?
Rift Apart has more than a visuals problem the game design is Tools of Destruction 2021 (many remade levels, more dull then than 2007 counterparts in cough again gameplay for the sake of boring overly saturated yet again visuals) then what Tools of Destruction did in 2007.
Crack in Time was ambitious, sure you just teleport to differtent areas, sure you have skyboxes that change, sure I can look at Spyro 2's low and high res versions with a swimming in the air glitch but I mean Rift Apart is wow Blizar is great, the rest is boring, generic and unexciting.
When No Man's Sky and SW Battlefront 3/Elite Squadron as the scaled down version/reworking to salvage the product. Like those games had the space travel approach well, Crack in Time is the most different in the series and in a way the best. Besides the other older entries that did fair on the original formula.
They handed it well besides the writing/shorter dev time and Rift Apart is as pathetic and unambitious in longer time, who has passion for this game to make it I don't see it because staff and their values/times have changed.
I can't wait for a boring story, a cliffhanger again for a story line since 2007, I don't want God of War story telling as Ratchet/Clank mentor their alternate selves or others like come on were in our 20s Insomniac, stop mooching off the other studios under Sony and put your spin on things, oh right Spiderman 2018 happened, Sunset Overdrive flopped but was brilliant of only a game they would make to put a spin on an open world, same as Resistance 3 then Resistance 2 being so trend following trash why? Just why?
If I can play Glover and go oh rolling a ball, transforming it for puzzles is more exciting let alone other games to inspire me for Foamstars/Biomutant, anything else then your garbage story game with sub par basic gameplay for idiots, eh emotional message that is for the furnace and staff making a waste of a time product to support Marvel games more and their 'experimental or last IP they have they actively focus on as Ratchet' isn't worth my time you have a problem as a studio.
Yes I will appreciate an old game with simple but fun gameplay and better linear gameplay focused design with good pacing, whether an Uncharted or otherwise but not superciial presentation, themes so boring and forgettable, characters put in positions for this garbage story and gameplay for a story driven animated wannabe that isn't worth any time.
Part 2:
When Knack has a bad story I don't care as the gameplay is good. That's enough for me sometimes. When both or more suck your product is just plain bad and your priorities on story/graphics are making a product so bad I don't care what the studio does next they are dead to me.
A product for boring people with no taste.
Alternate multiverse stuff that's ok but just nostalgia milking garbage like Astrobot does, Sony or any others I don't want you to but you continue to anyway, STOP DOING THAT!!!!!!
Ok female alternatives of Rivet/Kit I am fine with, but Blizar is the only good level that's ambitious 'by a little bit' (it's like comparing Ratchet 2 crystal hunts to 3, or arenas in the 2 games as well, it's not 'how many' it's how you do it and Rift Apart fails on all fronts as a piece of garbage, it's new ideas are eh, stop trying to be a movie, get back to gameplay).
Akimbot is the same way a Ratchet/Jak inspired Indie but just as generic, nothing exciting, just recycle vehicles, jetpack and other nonsense from games then anything actually worth while playing, yawn seen it all before. If I can play an old game with more fresh ideas and staff want to push boring messages I don't listen to Insomniac your message to the fans in Rift Apart, the sucking up with cameos, I rip it up it's a piece of garbage.
What a waste of a product.
I get the whole 2016/Future saga/OG fans audiences to tackle but this is the more boring way you could have done it.
Astrobot is a museum of nostalgia, emotional nonsense and people with no brain that eat up whatever is familiar, I don't play PS2 or older era games for 'oh it was better or the nostaglia' I do because GAME DESIGN HAD MORE FOCUS, they did well because they put effort into prototyping, the prototyping now, trends and more have the worst competition, even PS3 era competition was still fair between games ideas, now they are all so bland and forgettable.
Astrobot doesn't take me back I already go back, it just reminds me how pathetic AAA is an nostaglia inspired Indies with no talent that waste my time hearing/looking at them.
Astrobot is everything I hate about Indies and AAA and being unoriginal. It's a bad product. There are cameos and original game design, of Playroom, Disney Infinity or others and then there is being so blatant and lazy of original ideas lets just milk past games ideas and not even try. I'm sorry who let you get away with that. It's as bad as games that don't learn what's bad in new trend setters cough Lords of the Fallen older entry or shovelware that reskin, repeat the same box art and more aka Data Design.
Milking/rip off garbage anyway, Playroom/ Rescue Mission I can appreciate, Astrobot itself is so pathetically unoriginal and a waste of a product by the most creative to be the most uncreative in what they have made. The desperation and nostalgia milking needs to stop.
@Rich33 Seeing as they and I think other 1st party (I haven't played them they don't interest me so I have to guess) 3 modes says a lot when 3rd parties don't and seem to want to milk visuals, particles ground clutter/flora and a lot of unnecessary, the lighting can be hit and miss, the environments vary, art styles and more.
It says a lot of balance of things on the hardware by 1st party and they still look good in smartly designed ways of visuals then shoving too much visuals, not limiting themselves or being smart about developing and it just looking worse, having unnecessary particles on screen like Outlaws/Space Marine 2 do for some weird reason to how other elements of the environment are, let alone the game design.
@kevinm360 Until I see dynamic level design to suit those generic rifts (aka something to load a new area even Spyro 3 did, let alone the portals in Crack in Time the same way and just as quick on an HDD same I've played other PS3 era games even early gen that ran well on 1.0 versions even if bad Fear 2 50%s then loads well in seconds, open worlds sure take a lot I don't deny that but Ratchet is linear still with wide areas, companies push graphics, others balance it out) it wasn't in my book. XD
Seeing the sharpness or the more flora (unless was just the camera angle) for Last of Us 2 in the presentation for PS5 Pro, made me laugh.
Rift Apart it looks sharper but did we need to see crowds anyways? I think other things could have been shown off in the presentation really I don't think it was that necessary. Even then whether fog or other aspects do we need to see distances/have better render distance. It varies on the goals of the game and what you need to see/can go without seeing too I think, up close sharpness sure but distance I don't think so. Then again for fog in a horror game or particular levels that need fog for their atmosphere it doesn't matter of course.
I mean I can say the same for a racing game I don't need to see the 2D/3D model characters, do the Spiderman boat people matter no, the TVs on race circuits are more exciting when it's not made up footage and a live camera, even Mario Kart 64 did this and it's interesting seeing other sim/arcade licensed car racing games do it the many I've played with fake footage made up for it and others tracking the player, it's exciting stuff. Seeing people move on a track if a rally stage sure they feel a bit more alive, but less repeats of the same character models sure, but 'more' of them I couldn't care less let alone what details they have or a few more leaves on a tree or grass/ground clutter.
I think some devs need to stop doing so much grass/ground clutter focus, it doesn't add much, only so many objects matter in the world as well, prioritize those instead is what I think they should do or focus on the core design not additions that add nothing or so little and I already find the handful of grass immersive enough as it is. XD I don't even care if I see a grass texture on terrain anyways. But devs seem to go nope not immersive enough. Ok then. It's a them problem not the customer's at that point.
Loading them faster was not innovative, wow it's faster with higher quality textures, who could predict this, like wow who cares, it's expected if handled well, hardly out of the box different or innovative in an exciting way, wow we went from black and white to colour sure, we went from different forms of camera film to digital, other aspects were more exciting then higher quality and balancing visuals/load times, like duh.
Part 2:
Dynamic level design would be innovative, what happened to some decisions even that are actions and not by a dialogue box, Infamous 1 had it in it's intro, Specs Ops the line does later after it's forced disastrous theme moment, other games PS3/360 era I've experienced have it in little bits in ways they play a scene out I just can't remember right now
Those are still creative enough of player input then the generic result the game offered of forced scripted overly boring moments, how they handle a Blizar with the 2 sides shifting is the best level in the game and that's not saying a lot for it only does so much really even compared to Spyro low/high res 2 levels or 3's challenge areas, or Crack in Time's multiple skyboxes, 3 of those moments than Blizar as 1 and it does it fairly well still of course it's quality not quantity.
Heck if a survival game I can do a lot of actions and less restrictions besides crafting then well clearly a lot of dynamic situations can happen.
Multiplayer shooters with moving maps we barely see of level design moving shipping containers on a moving ship or a crane or evolving tracks (not the best example but LBP Karting had a different 3rd lap path in 1 track I remember).
A dynamic jumping through different locations boss fight for Rift Apart even or jumping on buttons to cycle them, it was repeating the same design, remaking 2007 levels with less exciting moments to do in them, forcing it on us then for sure (if I can use Portals in Portal to have control it's more fun, forcing the player through Rifts, eh invisible walls in Nefarious City mini boss to the monk planet later you meet Kit on, wow not like I haven't seen that before in a small region to force the player into, before in ToD's ending or others it was just a small window or a Spyro portal but now you are forced through it huh sure I guess but I mean it's still not that exciting, that design is NOT FUN or innovative) but higher quality visuals wow how not exciting at all. Or NMS/SW BF3 (Elite Squadron the reworking was just cutscenes, like any other game would do but for PSP made sense why) with seamless planet transitions on older hardware.
A typical level select, Rift Apart is Tools of Destruction with Crack in TIme sprinkled besides it's own ideas but worse, ToD was 2 & 3 mixed besides it's own, No Man's Sky or SW Battlefront 3 already did this, Crack in Time did it's limits better.
The 3 quality/performance/balance of the 2 modes for sure they did a great job with that, accessibility and such but otherwise, no. XD
@nessisonett You’re describing an ambition in better gameplay and creativity. That i agree with. But this is not something consoles will change. Its up to studios and developers.
You say games evolved in scope from PS3 to PS4. Of course games got bigger and better. Its because technology sucked before that.
And i’d like to argue that this generation of games do look better than the last generation. It might not have the biggest leap. But some of these next gen games look so much better than last generation. It’s not even comparable. Games having realistic ray traced lighting and reflection was a pipe dream in the last generation of consoles. Yes we’re in the zone of diminishing returns in terms of graphics, but thats only natural as we approach photorealism.
@EbolaGW yeah, however I get the feeling Xbox will release their next console in the next 2 years and Sony will probably be right behind them. My base PS5 will get me through the wait til PS6. Then I'll be able to play the latest PS4 titles on that console lol! In all seriousness though, I'm probably more likely to go PC next gen. If the PS5 Pro is $700+, then the PS6 will be even more. Probably closer to $1000. At that point consoles are pointless.
@SuntannedDuck2 Dude, you might wanna try condensing your comments.
Lol, just playin. Do whatever u want, I appreciate the thought u put into it, but damn those are some long multipart responses
@LogicStrikesAgain I disagree that a jump in scope of game is only possible because of technology sucking before that. Without devs willing to make a leap, technology can be cutting edge and the games won’t evolve. You just have to look at the PS1, where 2D games were incredibly common at the beginning of the console’s lifespan and the massive evolution in 3D gaming without any increase in the specs of the console. And it’s not about graphics at all, we have so many PS4 remasters on PS5 that are exactly the same game but cost more and look better, in place of actual sequels that are a step forwards.
Ratchet and Clank Rift Apart is the best example of the direction Sony should take with their output. Take a series and look at what the PS5 could innovate and improve on, that really only the PS5 could. It’s even just things like Uncharted 4, which benefitted from a newer physics engine which the grappling hook was tied to; visual improvements and gameplay improvements hand in hand. Cross-gen definitely plays a part with the games being neutered to cater for the PS4 but Sony have to make the argument that the PS5 isn’t just a box, it needs to carve out the exact reasons why people should play them on this console, and not on a PC. That’s what Nintendo do well, the games may vary in quality but there’s a marriage of controller uniqueness and gimmicks that make devs want to develop unique games for that audience. If Sony push forwards, other devs will follow and that’s always been the role of first-party studios.
@SuntannedDuck2 You are the only poster that consistently out -text walls me... 😂
I agree with you about Rift though. I didn't line it as much as the PS4 r&c game. That one I replayed repeatedly to max everything. Rift,I got part way through the second replay and then just stopped. It wasn't as fun to replay. the levels were mostly built around gimmicks that were fun the first time through and then got old trying to do them again. They only work once, or did infrequent playthroughs
It seems disingenuous to use R&C as an example of why the a Pro is a waste of money. You can't look at a massively optimized game as a representative of the entire library. Infact I'd say games like R&C are a tiny minority optimized games.
And no the pro won't make devs lazy. The pro will be a tiny minority of ps5 sales. Games can't be designed for just the pro. I'd say it will have no impact on how a company optimizes their games for the base ps5.
But lets face it, we all know GTA 6 will be the real showcase of what the pro can offer.
@nessisonett Well its just facts. The technology in the PS3 made it possible to create bigger games with a larger scope, something that just wasn't possible in many cases in the previous generation because of technical limitations. Same goes for the PS4. I dont really know what the argument is here.
As for the other stuff, its basically what i said:
“You’re describing an ambition in better gameplay and creativity. That i agree with. But this is not something consoles will change. Its up to studios and developers.”
So yeah ure right, better gameplay and creativity is not tied to technology and hardware. Im just saying complaining about the Pro is a weird basis for arguing better gameplay. Hardware doesn't have anything to do with creative games.
The Pro is purely for making things run better and look better, theres a market for that. Obviously its not you
@nessisonett Let's also appreciate that Tears of the Kingdom was done on a system with 3 accessible CPU cores clocked at..what..1Ghz per core!? And only 3.5GB of useable RAM.
You can traverse to 3 different planes of the world map without every seeing a Loading Screen (except for going into the Shrines). Heck, even going into buildings doesn't have a load screen.
Then you look at something like Starfield that has a load screen just about everywhere - and that's on hardware that is exponentially more powerful!
Sure, Tears of the Kingdom has some concessions that needed to be made: it's only 30fps, the "world state" is reset after traveling only a very short distance, and technically using the Towers to propel to sky/Falling down a hole to the underworld is masking loading, etc; but the level of interactivity and fluidity of exploration is simply insane for the hardware.
Nintendo engineers are going to have an absolute field day with something close to a PS4 because rather than seeing new hardware as a means to overcome challenges of previous generations, they see new hardware as a more powerful sandbox to play with.
i'm planning on putting my base ps5 in my room and my ps5 pro on my main tv down stairs. so it works out pretty well for me , because i was actually considering a digital ps5 at one point to put in my room.
I am gonna play in slow motion mode with a magnifying glass. 700 well spent. 😂
Whenever I read the comments it seems to me that the vast majority here are PS5 haters.😁😁😁
@JokerBoy322
Completely agreed. I'm not having much faith in PS6 already.
@kevinm360 been saying this since day one. People gonna get lazy, we’re gonna get AI developed textures, industry is gonna downsize before it gets better. This is the beginning.
@Ken_Kaniff I went back into the PS ecosystem with the PS4 Pro and I regretted getting a PS5 two years after launch because all the games I wanted to play were still coming out on the PS4 (and still are).
30 frames is nice, but 60 is where it’s at. Certain games it would be nice to have it all, but I can live w pop in for far distances is that’s my trade off of not upgraded to a pro
@EddieGallad maybe they are coming from the sister site for xbox , but its never been this bad as of the past few months.
@SuntannedDuck2
Its true of course that insomniac are incredibly good at optimisation, which as you say includes not going over the top on things - eg the RT reflections are very cleverly very low base res, upscaled in clever ways (DF spent a lot of time explaining how they did it at the time).
However, they just seem able to get SO much more out of PS5 than anyone else - although other 1st party devs also get far more than most 3rd party devs, insomniac just seems top of the pile.
I remember listening to an interview where they explained that their engine tends to max out both CPU and GPU at the same rate/time
In terms of modes, they normally do the following now i think:
Performance - uncapped fps for 120hz VRR
Performance - capped 60fps
Quality - 40fps for 120hz screens only
Quality - 30fps
(I think im right - i dont ever use quality modes. The 60fps & 30fps allow for very slightly higher base res than their counterparts).
Anyone who thought that a patch for Rift apart was going to show off the Pro, was always going to be disappointed.
SM2 may be a different case, but only at times - whilst still keeping above 60fps, the framerate and base resolution clearly dipped in some areas of the game, particularly when the city starts to get remoddled near the end of the game.
@EbolaGW people need to show Sony we (as a PlayStation community) aren't going to pay $700 for a console. It's absolutely ridiculous. I own a base PS5 currently, so when the PS5 pro was announced my wife asked if I was interested since I had a PS4 pro last gen, I explained to her it was a $700 console that is redundant at worst and a minimal upgrade at best. I explained that it doesn't come with a disc drive, it doesn't come with a stand and it's just not worth upgrading from my base PS5 imo. Once I told her it was $700 she just laughed and said, "wow that's ridiculous."
Sony has really lost touch with its community. 1st it was the live service push that NOBODY asked for and now it's a $700 console that didn't need to exist. IMO it is wasted resources, they should've put that money into making the games we ALL bought a PlayStation 5 for in the first place!! I'm not going to lie, the amount of cross gen games & remakes Sony has pushed this generation has really made me feel like Sony just doesn't know what its players want. We want the brilliant games that made the PS4 so popular! Bring on the damn single player exclusives that we LOVE!
Instead of selling my PS5 and paying the $350 difference to get a PS5 pro I just bought an Xbox Series X instead. Now I have the best of worlds and let me just say it's been great. Every game I bought digitally back on 360 is in my owned games library a long with the few Xbox One games I bought digitally back in the day so I've got a nice backwards compatible catalog built to go with my current gen games I've already bought on my Series S since 2021. My PS5 will serve as the machine I use to play PlayStation exclusives on and my Xbox Series X will be what I play everything else on (including a bunch of brilliant exclusives releasing over the next 18 months).
The end of the day, I'm a PlayStation fan yes. Always have been, however even more than that I'm a gamer who isn't obsessed with being a console warrior. I just want to enjoy games and while I am disappointed with PlayStation this generation, I'm hoping the cold reception to the PS5 pro and the utter failure of live service games like Concord show Sony that we (the PlayStation playerbase) want better. We don't want a $700 console when there's barely enough current gen games to even justify owning a base PS5. We don't want live service games, we want the exclusives that made the PS3 and especially the PS4 so popular in the first place. Hopefully we'll see some change of direction from PlayStation. Until then, happy gaming ✌️
@cali_kush70
Well said. Sony's arrogance from PS2 to PS3 is back and it's even worse than ever. I truly hope the PS5 Pro serves as a wake up call for Sony and start being pro consumer again.
@Neither_scene We got the same with THE PS5 slim though.
@cali_kush70 I looked at a nice video from a guy who said he could make the same PC for much cheaper well that didn't go really well.
With a 1TB SSD, worse graphics card, with a cheap case, with a cheap mouse and keyboard. But he did complain about the stand and the lack of a discdrive which he also didn't have.
In the end of the video I turned around from the pricepoint argument because it was quite a decent price for what you got.
So in the end you got mad because they made a optional upgrade for people who wanted it and can afford it? The liveservice push is/was hard but the games are not getting cheaper I can understand the need to diversify.
And with the rising prices of singleplayer games and no extra revenue there needs to be something to support paying the bills. Because we won't be accepting a little less detail in games.
I love singleplayer but I do understand the fact they try to get a good liveservice game out there.
Microsoft did release a new set of consoles with no upgrades besides the 1TB upgrade extra at a €100 extra oh yeah it was black with with some dots.
What is the point in moaning about the Pro, just be content that your happy with the base PS5 and move on with life. PC gamers make upgrades all the time and generally to improve performance of games they already play. This is just a little taste of that in console form. Don't want it? Do not buy... simple.
The fact that we now have these options should be a positive, there was a time when it would take up to a decade to purchase an improved console.
i think a lot of people forget that the PS4 Pro even running on a 1080p display offered improvements, mainly due to its super-sampling option which effectively rendered a 4K image before squashing it down to 1080p , reducing 'jaggies' (smoothing edges) in the process. That and it had a boost mode - anyone would think that was a PS5 Pro only feature.
Personally, with a 72xx series PS4 Pro with a fast SSD inside it, and given the monotonous/remastered games plopping out on the PS5, I find less of a reason to use the newer (I would say better but...) console over the old one.
@maxinrelaxin No we can't have that we can't have a extra option for people who want to have a choice because they have cash.
I think we got the same with the PS4 Pro were people went mental because of the option while the base PS4 played all the same games just looking less good.
@sanderson72 I really want to understand the problem here there is a optional upgrade it's not mandatory it's optional. It's makes things looks better and run faster what's the issue?
I have so many games to play i can't even keep up this generation. The worst thing about this generation is the state that games get released in and that is not a Sony exclusive issue.
Monetization and the insane push for free to play liveservice games which everyone wants a piece of the pie from.
This is the reason I will be waiting for the PS6, there has hardly been any PS5 exclusive games yet, most are PS4 games upgraded a bit. Game development takes so long now that I can't see any publishers catering to PS5Pro specs, they will be making games for the PS6.
It’s yours for ONLY £825 including drive AND stand!
@cali_kush70 Feeling a bit presumptuous today? Who made you spokesperson for the Playstation fanbase. Maybe just say you dont want one, that seems to match reality a bit better seeing as there are people that do want the Pro
@Flaming_Kaiser Don't have a problem with the 5 Pro - if people have the money and can justify it to themselves, then by all means go for it.
Seems a bit odd that Sony are having to release a console to counter all the short-comings in the original.
PS4 Pro had a point (4K display) but this?
Personally, and this is maybe just my view, I have a problem with the PS5 - it just isn't living up to expectations. Hardware-wise it's fine (if fat) but the games coming out seem very 'vanilla' compared to the PS3 & PS4 era (bar a handful of exceptions) and the amount of remakes/remasters of PS4 titles is just plain irritating while some PS3 titles that we want languish on the old hardware with dead servers.
Games have been released in a dubious state from back in the PS3 and PS4 days with Day 1 patches being mandatory so having even more to patch/overwrite on the PS5 is sort of expected these days. It does make me question how any game can reach a state to go gold when what is burned on the disc is knowingly broken.
@Flaming_Kaiser yes ps5 slim did exactly the same. My point was that the newer released series x consoles aren’t identical to the launch editions, there has been some changes to the SoC and the designs of the boards.
For the record, I have a pc so have no horse in this race. I have a significant cpu upgrade over all current gen consoles, including the pro and a decent gpu which is more powerful than anything offered by consoles and has access to all the latest Nvidia ai tech.
I was tempted to upgrade my base ps5 to the pro before knowing the price - over $800 with the stand and disc drive. Instead I put the money into a gpu upgrade. The ps5 pro improvements are marginal - especially if you play on a 1440p 27” oled like myself.
@cali_kush70 You call the Pro ridiculous, that nobody asked for. Say Playstation needs single player exclusives, totally ignoring the 8! single player exclusives that came out this year alone.
You then go on about how great Xbox and amazing their features are and that “stellar” upcoming lineup. While totally ignoring the multiple critically acclaimed exclusive games Playstation has, again, this year alone. Not even talking the whole gen so far. U bring up live service and speak for all of us that we hate it, ignoring how big of a success Helldivers 2 is.
Then you say u’re not a console warrior, but u’re the one bringing up Xbox and how great it is, with a general tone of only negativity towards Playstation. Last gen didnt see the big exclusives coming out till the latter part of the gen, so dont worry we still have years to go in this gen.
But to balance things out you conclude by saying you’re a big Playstation fan. Lol, how transparant can you be. Dude, everyones welcome here, even if you lean more towards Xbox. No shame in that
@LogicStrikesAgain I'm not trying to piss anyone off, at the end of the day I've been playing PlayStation games since I got my 1st PlayStation in 1997 for my 5th birthday. I've owned every PlayStation since then. I've pretty much grown up with PlayStation apart of my life through the console generations. That's why I reiterated that I am a fan of PlayStation, I always have been.
As far as speaking for the "community" I don't speak for everyone else. It would be extremely narcissistic of me to spew my personal beliefs thinking everyone else feels the same way. I know there's a spot for the PS5 pro, a certain niche group within the community will surely live the console and that's great for them.
When I was referring to the "community" I was referencing my own experience and discussions within the community. To the hundreds of comments I've read from PS5 owners, my own discussions in the YouTube comments, to my own discussions within the PlayStation subreddit. When I take all those comments and conversations with people into consideration, I can say from what I've seen, a lot of people feel similarly in regards to the PS5 pro, as well as the pivot to live service games, a lot of PlayStation fans aren't happy with that.
I'm not here to argue with anyone man, I'm here to share my fondness with PlayStation along with all their games. Yes, I recently got a series x, yes I am happy that I now have both, and just because I expressed those sentiments doesn't mean I'm trying to put down PlayStation. I was just sharing my experience with PlayStation 5 this generation and what I've perceived as a less than stellar generation compared to previous generations.
I didn't say PlayStation didn't have exclusives, I said PlayStations pivot to live service games isn't what a lot of people got a PlayStation for in the 1st place. As far as 1st party exclusives go, the PS5 has some absolute bangers. Spiderman 2, Returnal, Horizon Forbidden West, and Ratchet and Clank Rift apart have been my favorites so far. It's 2nd party exclusives have been great as well with Helldiver's 2 & FF7 Rebirth consuming hundreds of hours of my time in 2024 lol.
I appreciate you saying all are welcome no matter what games they enjoy, I'm right there with you on that. One thing we all have in common is we love games. Most of us have enjoyed the same games so we have that in common as well. To the people who took offense to my response earlier, IDK what to tell you other than, don't get too upset. I'm just a dude who enjoys gaming. I'm not looking to argue, I'm just here to chill and talk about the medium we all enjoy. Happy gaming ✌️
I'm starting to think DF was somehow paid to do these PS5 Pro videos
@cali_kush70 Nah, was nothing offensive about ur earlier post at all. Wasn't upset or anything, i just like to call out inconsistencies when i see it sometimes. Guess its sometimes hard to get the intention behind written text so i might have misinterpreted ur comment, my bad. But i appreciate ur reply. Happy gaming!
Edit: Btw, i was going for a bit of biting but lighthearted sarcasm. But i can see it might've come across a bit more antagonizing lol. Wasnt my intention, so again my bad
@Nakatomi_Uk Why? Ofcourse they're going to make videos about it. It’s a new console. And it’s literally what they do.
@rjejr Bro, what death spiral? Are you always such a doomer?
Why do so many people care what it looks like, unless is a pixelated mess a game should be based in its actual gameplay not how fkn shiny it is, this is the problem with gamers these days, too worried about if textures aren't hd and rt is making fancy lights, if that's all a game has it's trash in my book, I'd much rather a game that looks slightly sht and has a fantastic story than some overly produced shiny piece of trash with no soul.
@Andy22385 Good point. 👍
@Lanmanna "Are you always such a doomer?"
Well I'm too young to be a Boomer and I have to do something with all of this pent up negativity to get it out of my system so "Doomer" it is. Thanks, I like it. 👍
I'm including you in that category too @NEStalgia 😂
@rjejr I'm not a doomer, I'm a realist. It's just that in reality, we're doomed
@AfroMario doing fine, just what if ideas sigh boring people I am perfectly fine and balance what I do. I overthink yes but I balance hobbies more. TVs or rockets to moon exist would you go back in time/cancel, things stagnate? Art teachers opinions? Historians?
Psychologists for input when making games but customers can't think out of the box, for gameplay ideas want to see in games it has to be employee how is that fair? Sigh
Just because most customers want to roll over, original then copy paste. I post long comments but give reasoning not a tweet for fish, if want story/graphics go for it.
Haven't play old games in a while & how they handle content/don't care, want 20+ hours of filler and don't care what the filler is. I care about gameplay, just because I like 6-11+/10 scale of ambitious/solid ideas attempted & everyone else wants a story/graphics & a 1-3/10 easy gameplay experience to hear the themes/see the visuals & doesn't care.
They don't have to be a superhero just a human with items for puzzles/combat is enough for me.
If you want cartoony animals/boring humans to talk & be cinematic sure. I play games for gameplay, puzzle to action to whatever. Not always listen to the same messages songs/movies/books & games tell kids/adults over & over 100 different ways.
If I was an employee you wouldn't hear about it & while staff would question it (would be more reasonable in how to get the ideas across of course) I mean in meetings if I can give ideas, they get rejected that's fine.
Customer space people look crazy just because play every genres, understand tropes, seek creative ideas then others content with how things are/their boring lives play if it feels 'fun' or easy to understand, hear messages heard 100+ times kid/adult then gameplay, hype & so on.
Exploring game type phase 20+ years later, to see what can be done, what creativity has been tried, is still left to be explored. Just because most people play popular games & have no taste that's on them & don't care on that level doesn't make people or collectors crazy because they understand more then others.
I just seek creativity the same way any creative would.
Or think outside the box more. Why else does stagnation happen, history repeats because boring people do nothing & let it happen. Not everything needs to change but I mean sometimes it does.
If I gave valid understanding of how from Spyro (swimming in the air glitch, look it up) to Ratchet Behind the scenes game design & you don't or understandable ambition or your priorities are story/other games that's your focus.
(it varies, same with lyrics, if a love song has been told 100+ times what new ways are they going to tell it, if content sure, if wanting more in every genres/song & it's repetitive & easy to manipulate audiences with weak products) or boring align with a movie & this audience. I already know what they are offering as a business so why bother exploring it.
If I can see how gaming is on a decent technical/content handling level can I not be particular about what I want to see in games? You are when you pick up a game/play it, see if it's for you but I can't?
Creative ideas (not good ones but still the right track devs have when prototyping to think up an idea, expand on it, scrap it, etc. I'm not that full of myself I know my ideas aren't great) & customers can't come up with one/understand tropes, move on.
Tech has come ways over time then phones for socialising casuals.
@NEStalgia I have a habit of doing that yes. XD
Lot on the mind, some I need to cut down sometimes but when you have a lot to say/think about and not just say a tweet/text level comment it's worth spreading.
You say a lot of great stuff though I always enjoy reading though. Mine go a bit all over the place in comparison.
@NEStalgia Yeah, honestly I almost said something like (ie realists) but I knew you already knew. 😂
Does kind of suck to be this way though. Thomas Gray was right. 😝
@nessisonett It's fair to disagree it isn't that great an opinion/comment thinking it over anyway and is messy. I did go overboard this time oops. I research a lot of old tech, old games, this and that of failed to popular to whatever I can so a lot has built up of weird ideas over the years. Wii U successor ideas to whatever else. XD As one does that overthinks/thinks creatively in their spare time.
Tech going forward is a good thing for sure. How they use it does matter. I was happy with Kya Dark Lineage wind level design & appreciate BOTW's wind from WW to now.
I can look at limitations or whatever was current of the time and it's how devs/pubs went about things. PS3 era the competition I can tell from racing, shooters & platformers I'm buying up that yes some have cover based but they also had other mechanics that were just as great to play now as were back then. It's not nostalgia for the time period I still buy modern games after all.
When can we get an AI that has a hive network in the game, whether literal or a learns, unlearns, copies the playter's moves. Sure things like Dark Link exist to copy the player but what about on a wider scale per robot/insect enemies? I think that'd be awesome. Do I ever see it happening, nope.
PS1/Saturn/N64 was the era for 2D having effects, voice acting and other stuff for sure it was great advancement for 2D games I don't discount 2D games when I know what they did in that era for sure, 3D wasn't the only spotlight of advancement even if the focus more. Same with HD 2D is great to see in the modern era as well for sure.
3D from Jumping Flash (or others, but the different levels and less about more objectives and more about the goal/exit) to Mario 64 (limits of carts so objectives in the same worlds different ways) or Crash 2D to 3D approach of platformer design in 3 different ways, from Gran Turismo to even great arcade racers of the era.
I won't deny physics or lighting or other stuff doesn't matter but I don't really see it as that great either. They can push them but unless it feels that way and in many cases I'm not a fan of heavy characters I find it very annoying. Uncharted 4 I felt it helping a family member play it and I was like wow he is heavy.
Spyro reignited I get why they did but even then I make jumps easier in the original and not just because of muscle memory Spyro is just heavier in the remake.
The Uncharted 4 grapple example for sure it was a good use of the grapple hook in that game I agree with you there. To me in a way momentum hasn't been pushed that far for me in how you use a grapple hook in other games. It's why I think Chameleon Twist's tongue while not ground breaking to spit enemies, suck them up, pole vault with it is still kind of cool. Glower crystal to ball transformations aren't that amazing either.
The grapple in Splatoon 2's campaign felt like Ratchet 1 to me in a way it really tested my understanding of it in the level design that's why even in played it in 2024 I was like wow this is so much fun.
I get Ratchet series is for kids/families but sometimes I go I wish the swingshot would be used better. Even if for secret areas, for core levels I totally get it. Same way I've seen open worlds have the story be pretty easy to play, focus on the dialogue and the side missions are more out there but I find myself doing those and if I find the side missions boring or the character's moveset boring I just won't buy the game.
Part 2:
Like the gaps are way too basic and we don't see more higher or low gaps or how often we wait for gaps to use it. Halo Infinite I think tried to push grappling a bit further but I don't know how useful it was. I have seen that 2D Indie grapple game but I forget the name.
Ratchet 1 maybe with Oltanis did it well I think but later games sort of don't push it as far.
If you just mean in physics for realism that's fair but of course I can't help but think further than that. XD
I don't want like Spyro 1 tree tops levels of no idea how to get stuff to be the norm, for sure I don't. I do think that's a bit far sometimes for any player but even still it is interesting how far they'd allow mechanics even if a speed boost power up and 'how do I get there and use the level design in creative ways to get places' when the fling your self over there or run on blends in the background/walls parts of the levels some people wouldn't think to go oh you need to this experimental thing with it because some people just aren't going to solve a puzzle like that. Some will of course but not all but it also depends how they present the mechanics uses too.
Even some of the most average games to me the mechanics weren't' great but still presentation wise good enough or the types of enemies. In Legendary a PS3/360 shooter the healing is ok and fighting griffins. It was ok. Could have done more but was still fine. While in something like Fracture it's very strict in its use.
Kind of how I felt about the yellow swing around one in Rift Apart, the swingshot has momentum so more going on for the player to deal with. The swinging around to hold felt like the jump pads, very controlled didn't add much I find to the gameplay.
Crossgen does but I mean even then ToD's damage in Metropolis is scripted, Size Matters armour system or Deadlocked's weapon mods besides Crack in Time's isn't pushing hardware but was more exciting then Rift Apart's wow % for that enemy I wonder which one I should pick.
At the same time you look at a Battlefield and it's a very different game for a destruction system then Tools of Destruction no doubt.
I miss BF2's swap feature, glad a similar was in Driver San Fransisco as well.
Power helps things, limitations and creativity is not always true either I'm aware of that. Nintendo does the old and creative but of course they only have so many ideas. Or it suits them to save money and make a profit on the hardware but even still the controller gimmicks when used are hit and miss still always will be depends what ideas someone has.
Well they make it just a box is how I see it. It fits for games, other media and such. Of course the media side isn't anything to ignore regardless of being on a Smart TV, phone, etc. it still has a place. It's a multimedia deivce. Not as CD or others than Spotify expansive as Xbox One/Series consoles are but it doesn't have to be either it's not made with that in mind. It can't do everything and doesn't have to.
I'm even just happy they support gyro in games that didn't on PS4 as had to get third party niche games that did and pushed touchpad halves then Vita quadrants or the vibration levels weren't as PS5 expansive but Azure Gunvolt has 2 settings for vibration levels so I don't know any other games that do that.
Part 3:
How many care for Impulse triggers on Xbox or even knows they exist even? Thinking oh from 360 to Series X it was wireless to share button/new design, yeah they missed the Impulse triggers advertising or in Gears/Forza or Project Cars or something or own a PS4 so why would they know or care. Whether next Xbox even has gyro who knows.
I don't think they have to re-invent the wheel of course not. But I mean they could make Portal be dual screen and not a remote play device that is just that. What if Indies wanted to do more with it they can't. That sounds like 'just a box' type logic to me. Sony doesn't have to get first party to support it.
I get PS3 era they had many things they had to support of 3D TVs, Move, PSN, PSP connectivity, online to justify the service like PS2 did with online/Eye Toy, Singstar mics, Buzz and more but in some cases London studio did well for that with at least 1 studio doing it same as 1 studio for remasters/PC ports. Very different time, lot for them to support in one game of sorts.
They have PSVR they try and go Vita with the third parties have it to support but they can't. That's understandable. I don't think that's that bad, it still has devs that want to work on it that can. It's why I never complained about Vita and oh big games, the Japanese AAs and western Indies were great, but other players aren't that way. I did same with Vita as Wii U eshop, the Indies were great.
They offer a fair mix of controller features like Nintendo does. But the games are just so safe for audiences to make money on, it works and makes them money, they can branch out to TV/movies/books for sure. But Lego Horizon happens and I'm like sigh, so reusing an IP for an audience because Sackboy/Ratchet didn't sell enough and audiences will play the younger rated one then the teen/mature rated one........ Sigh it will probably be a great game but even still it is just sad.
Is it staff or is it the players and what they seek as to why games are this way?
So if going off customers then well if they want movie games fine, if we want puzzle games, fine, if we want a combination fine, if we want racing game devs to stop making basic modes and offer us the variety we used to get for graphics and tire simulations I don't care about. Content handling.
Part 4:
If Ride 4 can offer region system Forza Motorsport 1 & 2 like tweaks to the formula had (even if harder so I can't play it difficulty/AI wise) then why is Turn 10 so lazy to make any good ideas anymore either?
We have shooters/racing games too limited on locations/settings, shooters with generic play, WW or modern, what happens to sci-fi/fantasy ones we have Borderlands/Bioshock/Aveum I guess which is besides ok magic & gun categories the fantasy look drew me in. We used to have games with gravity/other stuff for vehicles but oh cars.... in contemporary areas? I mean the Dead by Daylight (Behaviour who I know for Wet/Scaler/Jersey Devil and licensed games) had a concept for vehicles in varied fictional locations.
Racing has so many mechanics I'm excited by playing Apex on OG Xbox as enjoyed Pure PS3/360 ATV game with customisation, Sega GT on Dreamcast was great for it too. But real car licenses sell games then fictional or I guess reusing their assets to make new custom ones? Or marketing of other games/100s of car models in comparison like a GT/Forza? Rewind and RPG elements of Alfa Romeo Racing Italiano to Grid's 1-5 or none rewinds that were fair, to Forza Motorsport 3's use it freely besides certain range of the track or any collisions to same rewind system for 20+ years later. Juiced 2 has so many modes that probably arent necessary but still varied and fun. GT7 kind of still has that with fuel, cone and more challenges but I just don't like the progression system/campaign of GT7 but it still keeps that creativity at least somewhere.
PS2/Wii/PSP you go Wii unique versions, you got old gen with fair different content then PS3/360/PC. I prefer the old gen versions because their content was fair and the presentation wasn't that big of a deal to me in most games cases.
It's like a DVD to Blu-ray, if the blu-ray had the videos in menus sure it's nice. But now a DVD/blu-ray are the same other than what bitrate/resolution, they don't even try anymore because they don't have to. DVD games aren't that big of a lose but still it showed effort.
Sony has a fair new direction I won't deny that, their audience is happy (with certain things of course not everything). I enjoy Sony's old experimental games or the 'handful' they have left and I go to Nintendo because they continue that type of design of course.
Even if in many cases besides families most Nintendo fans are happy to see the characters, or decent enough gameplay then they care about the controller gimmicks or much else. Nostalgia/happy or not in some areas with the brand. Some fans will be critical like Mario sports games being weaker or other aspects, but it varies.
I would like a balance, at least what 2-3 games that are experimental enough. I do so with third parties, I don't Xbox/Sony though as they sort of killed them off and Xbox IPs have variety but not that exciting of content.
True but 1st party showcase the hardware sure but they can also showcase gameplay yet I don't seem them doing it as much.
The physics and other stuff sure but if not so much in other aspects & for a mostly easy to please audiences that's why I get disappointed.
@LogicStrikesAgain ay man, I got mad respect for you simply because you hit the hammer on the nail. It's hard to fully grasp someone's intentions behind the text, which is also why I kinda misinterpreted your response as well. The reason I got respect though is because instead of jumping to conclusions you allowed me to respond and explain my thoughts a little more in depth along with the reasoning behind them.
Trust me man, I get it. Sometimes I start biting at people myself lol especially when I think there's like negative connotations in regards to a subject we're speaking about.
So anyways, that all aside.. what games have you been enjoying lately? Doesn't strictly have to be PlayStation or even console games for that matter. For me personally, I've been obsessed with Diablo 4 again. Vessels of Hatred is more than just DLC, they completely revamped the game for the better imo. When I'm not destroying demons in D4, I've been playing MW3 Zombies. I set out to complete everything in Zombies and I finally succeeded about a week or 2 ago. I have every mission done and I've unlocked every schematic in the game. Now when I load up zombies, I try to help other people get their stuff unlocked lol it's a fun time though. Let me know what you got going on in the gaming realm!
I just want more 120hz/fps games. 1080/120 I don't even care.
Only game that looked like Night & Day was FF7 Rebirth.
But I'm not spending $800 + tax, just to fix one game...
It takes almost a year for AAA games to be fully patched.
DD2 just got fixed and now they can fix FF7 Rebirth too.
@nessisonett got to say that I agree. Got my ps5 on day 1 and apart from ratchet and clank, we're still being served ps4 games. To top it off, when I bought my ps5 I thought it could do 60fps 4k, because that's what it says on the box. Before launch no-one ever said we'd had to to choose between one or the other.
They're the same picture.
@sanderson72 Not really with the prices back then for the parts it would have been way to expensive. And Sony is not going to take such a big gamble with that. Now people can play on the PS5 and if they want they can get a Pro version of the console.
@EbolaGW yessir, couldn't have said it better myself. Sony is extremely anti consumer nowadays and it really shows
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