Topic: Push Square Formula 1 thread - F1

@BearsEatBeets I know... As I said a Fairytale ending. As I said things 'could' work out with Max taking Penalties and things working out in their favour over the rest of the season - unlikely, but not 'impossible' considering the number of Races & Sprints to go....

it's nice to see him still getting wins and breaking a Record now with 9 wins at a Circuit and iits his Home Circuit too.

Been reflection on how good this race was, it felt like anyone of 5 drivers could have won it with the right strategy or luck. When was the last time you could say that about a race? Utterly brilliant! It would be fantastic if Mclaren, Red Bull & Mercedes were all competing for the rest of the season, even better if Ferrari or anyone else was in the mix. However we've had 6 different race winners after 11 races, which is great.

But now I've calmed down a bit I think it's too early to say Mercedes are quite there yet, they have to do it week in week out on different tracks and in different conditions. Silverstone suited the Mercedes car as did the damp/cold conditions. I suspect they probably also turned everything up to 11 too, risking parts for future races, to secure a win on 'home' soil. Will be interesting to see if they can keep competing consistently, I REALLY hope so as it could make it a thrilling second half to the season, but I still expect Max to keep pulling away, he's just too good right now.

E.g. Despite looking like the 5th fastest car for most of this race Max ended up finishing in P2 and extending his Championship lead yet again. He really is remarkably consistent, got to respect that. It would take a lot to prevent him cruising to another world title while he keeps maximising points.

@BAMozzy Best chance for a close title would be Mercedes and Mclaren taking up P1 - P4 far more consistently and pushing Max down the order. He's only not podiumed at Australia (retired) Monaco (P6 after poor qualifying) & Austria (P5 hit Lando), every other race he has been either P1 or P2. It would also take his closest competitor (likely Lando) maximising his own points every race, which he's not doing, rather than all the other drivers squabbling over winning rest.

A few engine penalties like we discussed a few races ago (link here to parts usage) might help close the gap, or him tangling with other drivers and DNF'ing. It's not personal, I just want a tight title fight!

@themightyant I don't think Mercedes are 'back' to being the best car and likely to finish 1-2 in the remaining races - and I also think it would take the likes of Piastri, Sainz and Perez keeping Max & Lando from accumulating the 'best of the rest' points. Even with Max's likely penalties, its still looking like Max's title to 'lose' at this stage as he keeps picking up decent points to extend his lead - Lewis is closer to 2nd (Lando is 61pts ahead of Lewis) than Lando is to Max (Max is 84pts ahead of Lando) so would be extremely unlikely. Max can sit out the next 3 races and Lando couldn't catch him with 3 victories and 3 fastest Laps so I can't see Lewis getting that 8th title with Merc in the remaining part of the season...

The fact that we have Merc winning again and seemingly more competition to RB could make the 2nd half a fantastic run in to the Final Race of the season...

Oh Perez, I could probably just copy-paste my comment from a couple of weeks ago.

@BearsEatBeets I won’t say a word about Perez, it’s all been said before. But I do wonder who will take his seat.

Russell out in Q1 is the bigger shock. Could be an interesting Q2&3 with the wet/damp

@themightyant That little shower spiced it up nicely. Having Russell next to Perez near the back will make for an interesting watch to see who does a better job working back up the field.

@themightyant
Where is Carlos off to next season? He seems a very good driver these days, he started off a bit iffy a few years back but he seems really good these days and dare I say that Ferrari are keeping the wrong driver as Le Clerc seems to buckle under pressure. If all else fails hopefully Papa can get him a rally drive (that was a very poor attempt at a joke).

Anyway it looks to be exciting tomorrow with various people being in the "wrong" positions.
I do like the Hungarian track.

@CaptD Agreed. Carlos has really got his head down and found some consistency. He’s driving like he has a point to prove. It’s a shame it took his dream seat to be gone for it to happen. At this level they are all incredible drivers and the margins are so small, the difference between the best and the rest is that consistency every lap of every race. It’s why Max is the best right now, it’s not just his natural talent, he just squeezes everything out of the car every lap and very rarely makes mistakes. Compare that with Leclerc or worse Checo and you see inconsistency again and again.

Talking of seats Toto is still playing the waiting game and hoping Max will come which is slightly delaying everyone else, they are hoping Mercedes might come a knocking if they feel Antonelli is too soon. I have no idea what will happen, it’s great.

I really hope they can sort out Lando's throttle in time. That would be brutal if it affects the race.

Just had the grid walk, not a lot of celeb 'fans' go to Hungary then.

Well, that was entertaining for some very different reasons. Has team radio the show ever been that good? All the top 8 drivers in the standings now have a race win (except Perez 😉).
I think a lot of racing fans were on Lando's side of the 'discussion' at the end. I believe it would a lot different if Piastri was keeping up with Lando at the end.
A little time penalty for Max for the collision would help the championship.

@BearsEatBeets it’s a tough one but I think Lando did the right thing. Though I think it was a problem that didn’t need to happen. I don’t think Lando was really in danger of the undercut from Lewis (they came out over 6s clear) unless they had a really terrible pit stop. They could have pitted next laps and been clearz McLaren bought that on themselves. But it did give us some added drama.

Oscar was a bit lucky in that he was making mistakes and not as fast as Lando at the end. Lando would have done better to give the place up immediately and then beat him on track.

We’re seeing petulant Max again, short tempered and frustrated when things don’t go his way. I’d be amazed if that isn’t a penalty, there is no doubt he caused a collision by dive-bombing and then locking up, he wasn’t in full control of the car. That’s two crashes in recent races he’s caused, both times he’s lost positions but been lucky he hasn’t knocked himself out of the race.

@themightyant Oh I totally agree he did the right thing to swap back. It would have been terrible for the team moral to do otherwise. Totally agree with him stating Oscar needed to catch him up to do the swap though.
Your right that Mclaren messed it up by pitting Lando first when Lewis wasn't that big a threat.

Petulant Max radio was also very entertaining. I wonder if he is going to get away with it as it didn't damage or hinder Lewis. Not that I think that should matter.

@BearsEatBeets they’ve said in the past that what happens as a result of an incident shouldn’t affect the penalty, so the stewards either think it is a racing incident or a penalty.

@BearsEatBeets
@themightyant
Exciting race both to watch and to listen to although I couldn't make out a few words as they were beeped out.
Great to see the races liven up and great to see McLaren back on form even if it is at the cost of Max's temper. Good on Lando to hold fast until the eleventh hour just to ensure the viewer knows what's what and tbh I'm not sure Oscar will look back fondly to his first win being handed to him in this fashion, assuming he gets more wins which im sure he will.

And yes I think a time penalty would be in order for Max as that lunge seemed crazy, the old Mad Max of years gone by seems to have returned.

@CaptD I'm not sure "handed to him" is quite fair. Lando was only really in that position due to team pitting him first, Oscar was ahead purely on merit before that. Had Oscar been pitted first, as is usual for the leading driver, he likely would have likely gained an additional 1 - 4 seconds lead (depending on pit stop, both cars in and out laps) and it would have been hard for Lando to catch up 4 - 6 seconds AND pass Oscar with just 12-14 laps left (by the time both had pitted). Not least he might have had Lewis in his rear view mirror and Oscar out of sight, that usually changes how drivers drive. While not impossible, it is improbable Lando would have won.

But I agree it may feel a little less that it was under team orders even if this was a situation entirely of McLaren's own making. They dug a hole that didn't need digging. Lewis was 5+ seconds behind when Lando pitted the second time, they even had time for a slow pit stop and still stay ahead, not least they had the faster car. They were overly cautious and it cost them team morale.

@themightyant
Yeah that "handed to" was a bit of flippant remark, it's just that sort of thing doesn't make the sport look good, yes team orders has always been a thing but for it to be so blantant is not good.
I still think Oscar won't look back at it fondly but as you say it was all down to the teams making.
Still it was an exciting race which is what we need.

@CaptD Yeah I mostly agree, team orders aren't a good look. I just think they should have pitted Oscar first and avoided all of the drama.

Also agree it was an exciting race and is exactly what we need. Max is miles ahead (+76 points) but we're only just passed the half way point (13 of 24 races done), there is a sliver of a chance the title fight may still be on.

I think Lando's messages to and from his engineer spoke volumes.

From a team perspective, points wise, it made no difference but there would be bad feeling from one side of the garage or the other.
Fact of Lando being told to slow down in certain corners and save fuel/tyres when he was pulling second after second, lap after lap just goes to prove that he's the threat to Max. He had to almost stop down the start/finish straight so Oscar could erode his SIX seconds lead just to gift him the win? Meanwhile, Lando loses out 7 points in the drivers championship. Pathetic really.

@CaptD @themightyant Another big thing that didn't help was when Oscar lost it on one lap and went wide. Pretty sure he had about a 5 second lead before that and it was close to the second pitstop timing. That enabled Lando to close up to under 2 seconds. Without that the plan to pit Lando first probably wouldn't have given him the lead.

Anyway I think it ultimately sorted itself out for probably the best for the team. I'm sure they will all be over it when they get to Spa. Should be interesting, I've got a feeling the long DRS sections will play back into Red Bull's hands but hope I'm wrong.

@sanderson72 I agree it was all pretty embarrassing public display. As I said had it been me I would have pitted Oscar first, as was his right; and seen if Lando could have caught him up, which seemed unlikely. But they were overlay cautious of Hamilton and the undercut, Lando was over 5 seconds ahead, enough time to come in a lap later and still clear. It was entirely a problem of their own making. Will be interesting to see how Lando/oscar are going forward.

@BearsEatBeets Yep i mentioned Oscar going wide above, lost him 2-3 seconds and didn’t help. Had he not done that he should have been on Landos tail even with the undercut first pit stop, instead he was adrift.

Tough situation, and one that only really happens when you are competing for wins (so a good problem to have) but I still think it was McLarens fault and could/should have been avoided