Topic: The Marvel Thread

@RogerRoger It’s an valid concern. I am likewise a big fan of Comic based entertainment and Star Wars. Throw in Harry Potter, Lord of the Rings, and basically most nerd culture stuff. (Although I’ve never quite caught the Star Trek bug fully. I like the reboot movies though… But I digress…). And as a big MCU fan even I have trouble keeping up. The pandemic has slowed things down naturally, in addition to the nice wrap-up produced by Endgame and Far From Home that you mention; and now they are in this weird space of losing some of the momentum from the Infinity saga due to filming production delays, and yet they haven’t let things settle down enough to not feel saturated by the content. The TV shows have served to keep the IP relevant, but I think the movies are stumbling out of the gate, comparatively speaking (and granted, when you are comparing to prior success that was box-office record breaking, then it’s tough to compare). I still haven’t seen Black Widow, nor finished all available TV output. I know I’ll like them when I see them but I’m satisfied to wait. I might try to see Shang-Chi in the theater though, but with COVID raging again I might want to wait.

@RogerRoger, @Th3solution. Yeah, I'm really interested in seeing how Star Wars holds up under the same treatment as the MCU. While it makes some sense in terms of the latter since they have dozens of different heroes to adapt which helps add potential longevity in case some need to retire (or others flop), in terms of SW everything has the original trilogy at it's core in the end and I wonder how many degrees of separation it can endure before (the average viewer) loses interest.

@RogerRoger I'm hoping Star Wars is safer in the oversaturation department as you can do so many different stories in different timelines; focusing on various aspects/people of the universe, it doesn't feel like it has to tie into one big story.

I think Star Wars will lend itself well to yearly content drop on the live action, subsidised by an animated series for us extra enthusiastic people.

As you say, we don't need constant content. Star Wars hopefully can lend itself well to a yearly new series and a new movie every 2/3 years I think (or hope).

New What If is out tomorrow, the title is "What if... Zombies?!" and that is the best title Marvel Studios has ever thought of.

Really really hope that Ditko and Lee’s estates win their court case against Marvel. Lots of idiotic fans thinking that the estates getting the copyrights would mean the end of Marvel but no, it means that creators would be actually paid for their work.

@RogerRoger One of the main reasons I’m trying to get through Falcon & the WS is because I hear there’s a little connection between it and the Black Widow movie and I want to complete it first before watching BW. Good to hear that the film holds up.

@RogerRoger @Th3solution I thought the connection was so insigificant that if I hadn't watched FWS then I would have just said "who's that?". Having watched FWS, I just said "oh" lol.

Unfortunately I didn't hugely rate Black Widow, it's a bit too sappy for me which is unfortunate because Black Widow is one of my favourite avengers in the movies and has been since CA:TWS. Her character has been better served in every other film she's been in (except Iron Man 2).

I did enjoy Winstone though but I will always enjoy Winstone. I loved how he looked basically the same in all the photoshopped historical pictures and they didn't go for a Scum/Quadrophenia-era de aging. I say loved, more like I just thought it was really funny.

Red Guardian was good too and the film could have done with more of him. I liked Taskmaster but I probably would have gone with a different interpretation if I was making it. It's done plenty in origin films but it can be annoying when they kind of add extra motive for an already perfectly acceptable villain to arbitrarily tie them to a hero.

I think BW fits better after FWS but it's just a bit of a random film and beyond springboarding some new characters, I doubt it will get mentioned much in future. It feels like it's the new Incredible Hulk of the MCU. Just a film that came out under weird circumstances that will probably get forgotten.

If anyone wants to watch a really good Ray Winstone film, I recommend Sexy Beast that also stars Ben Kingsley who played Iron Man 3's "Mandarin".

(Proceeds to duck out of this thread to avoid Shang Chi spoilers as I haven't seen that movie yet!)

@ralphdibny Another great Winstone film is 44 inch Chest, a masterpiece in all ways. Also has Ian McShane, John Hurt.

@nathanSF ahh cool, haven't seen that one actually. I think I have the dvd somewhere though so I'll have to check it out!

So I rewatched a bunch of Marvel films over the past week.

Originally it was only going to be Spidey Homecoming and Venom but after that I ended up wanting to watch more Marvel so... I'm going to go through all the Marvel films I own as I fancy rewatching them

Spider-Man: Homecoming

It's a thoroughly enjoyable film and I like Tom Holland as Spidey (Certainly better then Garfield at the very least). Michael Keaton's brill as Vulture too and I really like the design of his suit with it being fairly menacing.

I adore Ned too. He's a cute character, his friendship with Peter is well done and has some fun lines and wanting go be the "guy in the chair" for Peter.

Only thing I don't really think I don't like is Zendanya's character (why does she get third billing when she barely has 2-3 minutes of screentime?) and is rather poorly written in my eyes.

I like the Sam Raimi films more (Spider-Man 2 is still THE Spidey film to beat) but Homecoming is pretty darn good fun.

Venom

I hated this movie.

... At least... I did when I first watched it not long after it came out on DVD.

It's still not a good film (the ending fight is an absolute mess of CGI) but after rewatching it I can say I enjoyed it well enough and appreciated Tom Hardy's performance a bit more (Though his accent is not good(?)).

Villain's still terrible mind you and everyone else is a bit bland... But it's watchable enough.

Iron Man

For the film that started the MCU off Iron Man still holds up quite a bit to me. A blast from start to finish. I pretty much like everything about it and I've only ever liked it more every single time I've re-watched it.

Captain America

I first saw trailers for this way back when I'll admit I wasn't too interested in it. I thought he'd be somewhat similar to Superman being the boy scout fight for truth, justice and the American way and all that jazz...

And whilst he is a boyscout... He's a lot more relatable and endearing to me then Superman ever was or has been and Chris Evans is perfect as the "Star Spangled Man with a plan"

I would've liked to have seen more of cap with his crew (The Howling Comandos if I remember right?) and it's a shame we never get the Red Skull again as Hugo Weaving knocks it out the park as he always seems to do. But it's my favourite of the first phase of films

Thor

I know this film gets a bit of a but of a bad rap or at least more negatively perceived compared to most...

But I actually REALLY like this film. Always have.

Anthony Hopkins is so good as Odin (Especially that one part where he just snarls at Loki and Tom Hiddleston looks genuinely shocked by it 😂)

Who doesn't like Loki?

Chris Hemsworth does well as Thor too and I like the whole fish out of water concept with him & he has some pretty funny lines at times and a nice enough arc of character development!

Colm Feore doesn't get a whole lot to as Laufey... Yet he has an undeniable presence every scene he's in.

I even like the human cast of Jane Foster (Though I don't think she and Thor needed to be love interests), Erik Sellvig & Darcy (The dire sequel however doesn't do them any favours).

The destroyer's a bit naff but that's only my real complaint about it to be perfectly honest...

Eternals’ post credit scene leaking somehow has me even less interested than I was before. I just… don’t really care that much about that side of the MCU anymore despite being a life-long Marvel fan of the comics and having gone to see all the movies since Iron Man in the cinema.

@Foxy-Goddess-Scotchy Have you watched any of the Marvel Disney+ shows yet? Namely Falcon and the Winter Soldier, Loki, and WandaVision?
With some of the points you bring up about the characters, I’m wondering how you’ll get along with those shows, which in some really delve deeper into side content and characterization of these people. I especially think you’ll like Loki and WandaVision, based on what you said above. I don’t know though. I also thought you’d like NieR Automata and you hated that 😂. Falcon and the WS might be harder to take because you like Chris Evans as Cap. But I think it carries on the storyline pretty nicely.

Personally, IMO, Captain America. The Winter Soldier is the best MCU film. It plays more as a thriller than a superhero film. I don't include Guardians of the Galaxy or Thor Ragnorak, as they are a different superhero (comedy/action) genre.
Far from Home was my least liked film. It was all pretty pointless and gave me very little to care about. Plus Spider-Man is incongruent with big monsters/threats. He's a friendly neighbourhood guy and fits in best with real, physical 'no-bigger than a truck' dangers. Having a grieving Peter Parker, Skrulls settling in, and Parker outed as a villain could have been done in an one of 14,000,0605 ways that didn't include meta sfx and cgi.

... I knew it was only a matter of time before you brought that up again Sol

Nah I haven't seen any of the Marvel Disney+ shows... yet. I have seen both seasons of Agent Carter though and rather enjoyed those!

I do actually really like Sam and Bucky as characters though so Falco and WS is not as hard as a sell as you might think despite not having Chris Evans around.

After I finish Castlevania those might be the next things I'll take a look at.... We'll see

Yeah Anthony Hopkins was a great bit of casting as Odin... It's a shame we didn't get more of him @RogerRoger!

And fair enough in regards to Loki... The fact the show made you come around on him kinda makes me wanna see it more.

Aside from the ridiculous glorious fishbowl helmet that Mysterio has I like that he's otherwise a normal human and not super powered or enhanced in anyway (At least as far as I'm aware... I'm sure the comics have done something with him over the years).

Plus like Scarecrow from DC I'm all for illusionary and trickery like that rather then just brawn. I really need to get on watching Far From Home

Also I swear I saw Keaton in a trailer for another Marvel film... I think Morbius the Living Vampire might've been it? Not bloody sure why though!

The Avengers/Avengers Assemble

All flash, very little substance.

It's my least favourite phase 1 film (Not including The Hulk film (Cus I'm not really a fan of The Hulk and haven't actually seen it) or Iron Man 2 which I've seen once and didn't think much of).

However despite saying I don't like Hulk... I really do like Mark Ruffalo as Bruce Banner?

Hawkeye gets a bit of a bad rap but Jeremy Renner plays him well in my opinion and honestly seems to do more then most that aren't called Iron Man in this film.

Loki is Loki and we get Cobie Smulders as Agent Hill who's always nice to see.

It also has Ashley Johnson (Elly from the last of us etc) as the waitress Cap saves towards the end so... that's something! 😄

It may've been something special at the time but we have MUCH better team ups now.

Captain America: The Winter Soldier

Cap gets limber!

... Seriously whilst in Avengers and the first film all he really does is punch, kick and throw his shield in thd most basic of manners he gets a lot more acrobatic in his fighting style in this one and it's good to see him being a lot more versatile as it naturally makes the fights more visually interesting!

I really like the addition of Sam/Falcon who is wholly different and unique compared to Cap (Unlike War Machine for example who's just... Iron man with more firepower and a bland as hell character to boot).

The Winter Soldier is a neat villain with nice emotinal ties to our main protagonist.

Black Widow and Cap have great chemistry together and the movie as a whole is simply a great thriller and easily one of the best films the MCU has to offer.

Also I really like the score for this and the animated credits sequence before the mid credits teaser is really nicely done too!

@Foxy-Goddess-Scotchy Haha, you know I have to give you a hard time. 😛 Well I’ll keep trying nonetheless - I can always fall back on luckily pointing you into the direction of DOS2, which was a home run I think. 😄

As far as your Avengers and CA Winter Soldier thoughts, I’d mostly agree — although I quite enjoyed The Avengers. I think some of it is nostalgia because it was the first successful mash-up of its kind, and was such a genius idea at the time. Like you say, subsequently the cross over movies have been done multiple times over, and to greater effect and higher quality. But it was the first big step into this larger assemblage of multiple isolated characters and their stories into one overarching interchanging universe. The fact they pulled it off to the degree of quality they did was impressive.

And I did not know that is Ashley Johnson! Wow, even the Marvel nerd that I am, you taught me something new! (…Ever the teacher 😄) I knew she seemed a little familiar, but somehow I just whiffed on making the connection.

And spot on with CA: WS. Somehow that movie just works so well, despite (or maybe because of) the change in tone to the more spy thriller / realistic style. Redford is great in it and I really enjoyed the twist. I always love it when a movie or game throws me a twist I wasn’t expecting. Just like we were talking about with Squid Game.

Ha ha Divinity more then makes up for it @Th3solution... Only problem is I'll have to keep pestering you to finally get round to playing it yourself

I liked The Avengers quite a bit when it first came out but I dunno, every time I've seen it I've enjoyed it less and less.

Fun little fact I actually recognised Ashley in The Avengers (When it first came out) from a one off role in a tv show I'd seen her in not too long before going to see it. Had no idea she was a voice actress at the time (Though ironically it was her voice that made me make the connection) 😄

Yeah it being a grounded spy thriller which just so happens to feature Captain America & Black Widow really makes it standout in the MCU.

I agree with Redford being a delight The twist with Hydra having been reborn in S.H.I.E.L.D with Zola's reapperance as the million or so databanks is neat and Sam Jackson puts in a nice performance as Nick Fury too

Lol no worries @RogerRoger I've already been spoiled on the main spoilery things in it anyway!

That's very true in regards to Keaton rog... But other then Morbius being a spidey villain (I think?) I'm not quite sure exactly how Vulture ties into "Jared Leto becoming a vampire" shenanigans 😅

... I'd be down for a pure Bruce Banner film for sure. I actually don't remember a whole lot of Avengers Endgame but wasn't "Professor" Hulk part of it and actually kind of ok?

Oh he did the music to Civil War too? I remember quite liking the score to that too so in hindsight that makes a whole lotta sense. I agree on that being a rather nice piece of music! 😄

So I just read that the upcoming Insomniac Wolverine game's lead writer also wrote Spec Ops: The Line. Now although I havent played it (it's in what remains of my PS3 backlog), I have heard a lot about how great the game is... particularly its gritty narrative and adult themes. Seems like a real nice marriage of project and talent to me 😁

So I finally was able to take the time to watch Black Widow. I don’t have much to add to what other people have said, and I’d consider it mostly a middling affair for the MCU — which is not a bad thing, considering the usual quality of their output.

I know we harp on it a lot, but for me the main thing that dragged the experience down was the consistency of the Russian accents. The side characters had more believable accents, Ray Winstone being the best, imo. But most of the main character actors and actresses were all over the place. Which is too bad, because the script was good and had that sharp humor the MCU is known for, and the comedic timing was spot on, but the way the accents sounded often pulled me out of the moment. It’s the same issue that exists with Elizabeth Olsen as Wanda Maximoff / Scarlet Witch with her drift in and out of accents, but here it was several characters putting on an accent so it seemed to stick out more if someone had a lazy line delivery.

The same basic principle applied to the action sequences. They were really good for the most part and I think the underlying choreography for the fights scenes was right up there almost as good as Captain America: Winter Soldier. What held it back was the occasional obvious stunt doubling and a couple of the actors not quite being able to pull off a believable looking flashy and ornate acrobatic move set. In other words, there were times when I could tell the exact moment that the action switched from a stunt double to the actual actor, which is something I hadn’t noticed before in the Marvel movies. I wonder how much the filming and editing process was effected and hampered by the pandemic.

As for the story, it turned out to be pretty good, although I had a hard time really investing myself in the plight of Natasha and Yelena. Their chemistry didn’t really hit its stride until late in the movie. And even then, I’m not sure how I feel about the clear indication that we’ll be seeing more of Yelena in future TV and movies. The post-credits scene with Julia Louis-Dreyfuss was a great nod to what’s to come, but I just wish it was another actress taking on the role. With all due respect to Florence Pugh, the role seems a tad too big for her. But I hope I’m proved wrong

Perhaps some of the lack of my investment in the movie was subliminally related to my knowledge that not only is Natasha dead in the regular MCU timeline but also the lawsuit and souring of relationships between Scarlett Johannsen and Marvel/Disney. It shouldn’t affect my feeings in the movie, but I think it was in the back of my mind.

And that’s a lot of negativity up there for a movie that I’d say was a solid good time and I would recommend to anyone who likes the MCU and these characters. 😄. And it’s also ironic that I started out saying I didn’t have a lot to add and then followed it up with a wall of text. 😂

@RogerRoger The way I’ve been lagging behind on things, I’m not sure when I’ll watch Hawkeye, but I’m definitely going to. I haven’t even watched all the What If..? episodes. Need to see Shang-Chi and Eternals too. And I think the next Spidey movie isn’t too far away either.

But yeah, I really liked the chemistry between Hawkeye and Widow and so I’ll be curious how it transitions over to his own show. The fact that Natasha’s sister has been assigned to take a hit out on him makes for a compelling storyline, but there’s got to be more to it than that to hold the public interest.