Wastedyuthe

@ autogolazzo: I think you're right unfortunately. I looked at the Move as a Wii replacement and since sold my Wii. But since the initial excitement of Sports Champions etc, I have completely lost interest as there just doesn't seem to be enough coming out that interests me. I was hoping for a great Tennis game, and thought that at least one of the 2 coming out would suffice. Nope. Both poor in terms of Move support. That's that down the pan. I think I'm just going to sell the Move controllers and stick to DS gaming.

To be totally honest, I have been very underwhelmed by Move supported games since I bought it. I bought 2 Move's, a Navi controller, and a charging dock for them all. They are all sitting in the dock, and it hasn't needed to be turned on in weeks. I actually believe I've wasted money on it all now and wish I never bought into Move. Should have just stayed with normal PS3 titles.

@ din_djinn:
"...and the amount of open floor space needed to play"
Ok, we have to move the PSEye near to the floor and point it down every time we play, but with it located 1 or 2 feet from the floor, we found it only needs a meter or so space in front of the tv. Are us sitting on your tv or something? How small is your room?

Anyone else lost interest now we know the Move won't be incorporated into the career mode? I wonder if they'll mention that little tit-bit of info on the demo.

Some things I've learnt from the IGN review:

"On Xbox 360 and PS3 Tiger Woods PGA Tour 12 features 16 courses on the disc, and 20 available as DLC. The game finally incorporates DLC courses into the career mode, though in an awkward way. As you play the career, you'll try to enter a tournament attached to a DLC course. The game will stop you and inform you to go purchase the course from the store, or skip the event. Having a good chunk of my career mode blocked off sucks, and comes off as crass. By comparison, the Wii version of the game, which features no DLC, comes with 25 courses. If course amount is a deciding factor in your purchase, the cheaper Wii version has nine more courses than its HD counterparts."
"The Wii version made a couple of additions, most notably Balance Board support to measure your feet placement. It also has the additional motion control modes, like disc golf, mini-golf, and party games."

@james: Actually as much as it pains me to say, I prefer Racket Sports to the Top Spin 4 demo. At least it attempts to direct the shot based on your swing direction unlike this- with a little practice it works 7 times out of 10. Not ideal i know, but you can also do lobs, slices, and add spin, all by motion control- no buttons needed. And types of shot work pretty well from my experience. The only issue I have with Racket Sports tennis is the shot direction not always going where you aimed your swing. I really wanted Racket Sports to be bettered

IGN just posted a very average review score for this- 5/10. not a good start. But then IGN aren't exactly trustworthy with their reviews.

Resi 4 was perfect on the Wii, although I would have preferred the option for the trigger as the fire button, not the A button (the Wii's equivalent to the Move button)- just makes more sense to me for the trigger to fire your weapon. Odd that they never even give the player the option to do that, and its the only shooter on the Wii i know that did that.

@ dirtyvu: and that's all i have ever wanted in a Tennis game- a FUN experience. It's not much to ask that a Tennis game allows me to make forehand and backhand strokes adding spin if i want or and upward motion for lobbing, gentle stroke for drop shots etc etc. I want a game me and my family can play together, and one we will have fun playing using motion control, like we did with Wii Sports Tennis and Grand Slam Tennis on Wii. I can't believe I spent so much money on a technically better system yet the games are getting worse not better.

What is clearly needed is for someone to take a note out of Grand Slam Tennis' book- make a Tennis game FOR the Move- no DS control option apart from for movement if the player hasn't got a Navi controller. The problem with both Top Spin 4 and Virtua Tennis 4 is they are trying to do both DS and Move controls in the same game (and making Move control more of an afterthought in the process). Someone needs to make a Tennis game that only has Move control, so the player can use the Move in all aspects of the game not just exhibitions, and the developers can concentrate on making the Move work perfectly for the game unlike these two "efforts".

@ dirtyvu: I don't play Tennis in real life, but enjoy the console games (when they are good), so that info was quite insightful, thanks. However, you're right- this game is a fail, because it doesn't take into account the direction of your swing, or even which side- you could be doing a back hand in the game and still do a fore hand stroke with the Move and pull it off. You have to hold a button while swinging if you want to lob or slice, yet you are able to swing diagonally up to add top spin. The poorest decision though has to be directing your shot via the analogue stick on a DS or Navi controller instead of registering that from your Move swing. Absolutely pointless incorporating the Move- added to help with marketing and boosting sales no doubt, without any effort from the developers.

@ Dazza: you obviously didn't read my comment above yours. C&VG website stated that Virtua Tennis 4 only supports Wii motion, Move, and Kinect control during Exhibition and mini games. Thats all. Even the Wii version resorts to using d-pad and buttons during the career mode. So no, I don't believe it will deliver the goods

From what I have played of the demo, I completely agree with the review. Extremely disappointing. And with the upcoming Virtua Tennis having seemingly better Move control but unfortunately limiting Move support to Exhibition and mini-games, things aren't looking good for Tennis fans. If it weren't for the odd calibration problem, Grand Slam Tennis on Wii got the controls perfect. Put that control with the graphics of Top Spin and that would be all we need. Looks like we'll be waiting another year though

@slapshot82: i hope you're right and there will be a time the Move really does take off in a big way. Let's hope games such as SOCOM and Killzone etc will encourage other dev's.

"At launch Sony made the statement that Move would sell itself without the need for an over-abundance of advertisement"

Yes, but they STILL should do that and it would sell even more. This is why the Kinect is selling more than the Move. This is why the Wii still continues to sell. Sony just don't advertise enough, plain and simple.

And, tbh, I'm disapppointed in the lack of support for Move in upcoming games. Ok, we have Tiger, Top Spin, VT, but 2 out of 3 of those have extremely poor Move controls/support. Looking forward to SOCOM, but thats the only game I am looking forward to that has Move support. No news on GR Future Soldier or Battlefield 3 incorporating Move. No news on any more previously released games gaining Move through patch. This article sounds optimistic, but I'm actually beginning to be disappointed in support for what is actually a great technological achievement.

Marked on mine too. Can't wait for this. My most eagerly awaited title.

@ lipnox: "... i think it would be awesome if they would let you customize all ps3 games with move controls ..."
Yea that would be cool for this to be built into the firmware of the PS3 to tell it, as an example, that for Rainbow Six I want the Move to take over the right analog stick control and T to replace R1 etc.

Might be one for me and my daughter to play together. But then I thought she'd like Start The Party and she only played it once lol

Thanks for the great review. I can tell from it that this won't be my sort of game. I don't like getting frustrated with losing and having to start all over again from the beginning of a level- more of a casual gamer me. Even my beloved Rainbow Six has checkpoints

I think they should at least have a Move option in all FPS' or TPS' now, to let the player decide their preferred method, and Sony should push for this to be the case.
I also think multiplayer instances should recognise who is using DS or Move and have Move only/DS only multiplayer match options.
It's sad to me that some of my favourite games have already been released a good while ago and will no doubt never receive a Move patch to make them compatible, such as the excellent Rainbow Six Vegas and its sequel. Those with Move would be my perfect game (hoping SOCOM at least comes close)

Just bought Killzone 3 from play.com for £27.99 can't wait

The only thing that concerns me with VT is movement. IGN states there is no movement control, but Gamespot states it will have via the Nav although they couldn't test that at the time of their preview. Eurogamer states "Movement left and right is automatic at the moment, but that's being worked on. What you can do is move into the net to put pressure on your opponent by running up closer to the screen". So take from these what you will. I just hope they at least have the Nav for movement as an option.

"The battle for tennis supremacy on Move is heating up"
Well this has lost already in my book.

Eurogamer says about Virtua Tennis 4: "Everything I've ever played on Move suggests that it works exactly as it's supposed to, and Virtua Tennis 4 is no exception. Shots land where you want them to, slice or spin in the intended direction... Lobs, slices and top-spin are all self-explanatory, and there are no buttons involved"

Something tells me to wait for that instead, i don't care what features this game has got. It sucks with Move.

Again, completely agree. It really does feel like Move support was added as an after-thought and not thought about properly, and certainly not implemented as well as we would expect it to be.
With Virtua, from what we have seen, they have at least thought about how best to implement the Move, with the first-person view etc. Let's hope for good things with that title

Completely agree TGov. VERY disappointed in Move control. As you say, you may as well use DS, as the direction of your shot and even the type of shot, can be down to button presses or analogue direction. Heck even Racket Sports allows slice control just by how you swing rather than having to press a button (unlike this- having to hold T). If the Move is so accurate, why must we hold a button to slice or lob when we swing? And it certainly is NOT 1:1 with the player on screen as it completely ignores your movements with regards to its animation. Sadly, even Racket Sports is closer to 1:1 compared to this

@ James: LOL

I like the demo, but wish it would let you replay a match instead of having to keep going back to the Menu when one ends. I like the DS control, and have got used to holding down the button and letting go at the right times. However, I have now tried with the Move control and have mixed feelings about it. It feels better swinging something instead of just holding a button then letting go. But the timing for me was actually harder to get right with the Move, and my character still swung his racket at times even though i hadn't done so with the Move. It just seems like it half registers your motion and half decides what it wants to do itself. Movement around the court works well, but it seems you also control where you want your shot placed using the analogue stick too, instead of aiming with the correct motion of the Move controller. You can motion forward with your Move, but if you are holding to one side on the stick your character will hit their shot in that direction. Racket Sports had a lot of slack for not getting its hit direction right and being too tough to direct shots, but at least it did try to allow you to direct your shot using your Move motion. Grand Slam on the Wii got it right in this regard. Not sure about this game now tbh. Might wait to see how Virtua fares in comparison

I fail to see the point of different colours. When you're playing the game, you're (hopefully) looking at your tv screen, not what's in your hands. What should be more important would be if they are any more comfortable to hold/use, which doesn't look the case from the pics

Almost makes me want to be a Plus member

Just want to agree with other comments on here- great review its nice to see that someone has actually waited and took the time to play the game properly before writing. Hard to trust some earlier reviews as they seem to just want to be the first to get it out there.

@ odd69: "... It was nice of them to throw in a botzone mode too, i could see myself trying it out before i would play online. For me this is important, as im not the best fps player."

I agree. All online FPS' should have bot mode for offline practise- I'm the same, I like online shooters but definitely not the best.

Playing the single player demo over and over and over again says something for how good this game plays. I do like how it is sometimes better to hide behind cover and choose a good time to attack and not go in all guns blazing every time (i love my tactical shooters).
Wasn't expecting to get this game, as I tend to stick to Rainbow Six/Ghost Recon etc, but after the great reviews and excellent demo, I might just pick this up. Great options for Move set-up too- should allow everyone to pick their way to have it set.

@lipnox: yes, I guess u would have better value for your money then

@TGov: "... I just hope that they somehow incorporate the nav controller to move your character about the court ..."

I'm sure I read somewhere that this is the case. Same for Virtua Tennis too. I've played Grand Slam Tennis on the Wii with this control method and it works great.

"... if the motion controller gives your player an edge ... "

I can't really see the Move giving players an edge over DS players, but I really hope it adds to the enjoyment of the game and is accurate enough for the player to send the ball where they want it to go.

The career mode looks very comprehensive and involving, giving the player plenty to get their teeth stuck into. Can't wait for the reviews to start coming in for this. Fingers crossed for a demo too.

@ lipnox "Last generation cheats werent sold at $2 a peice, and if users wanted to unlock the complete cheating power they could buy an action replay, or earlier a gameshark and game genie." But u had to PURCHASE the Action Replay yes?

I did own this game, and have actually traded it in now. I really REALLY wanted to like it, and went through lots of training and built up my stats, and it still didn't have enough satisfaction in the fighting for me to actually enjoy the game. It just wasn't fun, plain and simple. This DLC may have made my fighter better quicker, but I felt i'd already wasted enough money on it

@ lipnox, thx I didn't know that was possible. Thats nice to know for the future. But in this case an extra day waiting is tolerable thats good to know in the case of a demo not coming out in the UK though.

Thanks for that info James

I wonder if the UK will get the demo later than the US as with the full game. Looking forward to this

Is their WiiWare game any good? On rails shooters are all well and good for those who prefer no-nonsense all-action blasters. I prefer a little more tactics and planning with my shooters though- Rainbow Six, Ghost Recon etc. Not many of them on the Wii, hence me not playing it in ages and ending up buying a PS3 which i should have done ages ago

Really not sure if I like that first person view at all. I'd rather have the typical overhead view (as well as having total movement control with the navigation controller), so I can see exactly where i am on the court and where best to place myself.
You can still see how close the ball is to your player so hitting at the right time shouldn't be a problem.

It will certainly be interesting which of this and Top Spin will be the better game. Funny how the Top Spin developers haven't utilised the Kinect at all. And from what i've read about Virtua Tennis, i wouldn't like to use that anyway- swinging my arm with the game being unable to tell how my wrist is positioned for top spins etc. The Move is certainly sounding the best of the 3 for Tennis implementation, and I can't wait. Apparently we'll be able to use the navigation controller for movement around the court too, as an option. I've used this method with Grand Slam Tennis on Wii, and its great.

@din_djinn:
Yes I seem to remember the developers giving the Wii version of Call of Duty 3 that option- to have the crosshairs stay at the centre of the screen while you use the controller to look/turn. It worked ok, but I don't think many gamers went for it, and it was an option not used since in future games from what I know.

Completely agree with MadchesterManc and Hamispink.
Having played FPS's on the Wii this way for some time, I am completely used to the method and prefer it for its accuracy and more of a sense of actually aiming. All the developers need to do is allow plenty of options for configuration so players can adjust to their own preferences. Games can easily fail with the lack of control options- its happened on the Wii, and it will happen with the PS3 Move too, as well as future consoles.

Thanks slapshot

I'm new to the PS3 as well as this site- only had it several days. Are we able to play copies from other countries without the PS3 being hacked?

Any UK release date yet? Can't wait for this ( i love my tactical shooters )

I bought this game last night based on this review, and agree it deserves a 7. Great review. My fighter definitely needs to up his stats as he isn't very powerful yet, and i definitely need the practise. But I can see that what ever I am doing, my fighter is copying exactly.
Comments here mention holding X to dodge/weave, but I couldn't see anything telling me about that in the instructions or in the games tutorial. My shoulders are still aching this morning from my half hour session yesterday A great fun way to work-out

Since buying this for my daughter, she can't stop playing it. Doesn't take much to move the camera to a lower position and it works perfectly. There are parts i'll do for her, and parts she loves to do. But its great that we have something we can both take part with and bond. Superb game.

UPDATE: Well, I'm still waiting for Top Spin and Virtua Tennis, however, I reluctantly bought this second hand from Blockbuster for £13 because my daughter loves it. And tbh, the full game seems to be a little more responsive to where i want the ball to go. Badmington more so than Tennis. But both are fairly playable at least. At least i can direct the ball more now, but its still a case of waiting for the other player to make a mistake as they almost always are able to be within reach of your shot.
Still, at least it will suffice till Top Spin. Still wouldn't recommend unless u have children and they force u to buy it lol