LogicStrikesAgain

Lol
Facepalm

Damn!
I just cant believe this game cost that much, it really doesnt show.
Come to think of it, they probably already created a lot of the weekly cgi scenes. Which probably had a fair bit amount of motion capture in it.
Still think it could've done better if they just said from the start what type of game it was, not shroud it in mystery and make it seem like it had some kind of singleplayer narrative or cool co op multiplayer.

Sony should really stop it with the silence and playing cool and just come out with a banging showcase.

@LifeGirl Seems to me that what u explained "the agenda" was, is considered "woke" by many. But hey i dont even know what woke really is. Everybody seems to define it differently.

@LifeGirl This makes no sense to me. Is this a joke? Anti traditional beauty standards? Thats the "woke" part? They didnt include beefcakes in it. Thats a big Lol for me, but hey to each its own

Edit: Temu Drax was a bit of a beefcake

@2here2there Funny, i'm probably one of very few. Im not saying they're stellar, far from it. But i have no big problems with the character designs. Its been a while, and ive only played a bit of the beta. But i dont really remember a character which i disliked.
Except for the generic soldier with the assault rifle and the red Drax knockoff with the weirdly shaped head.

I must say though, i dont really care about the characters with these games. Its team deatchmatch. Closest ive played to this was CoD in the original Modern Warfare era. Didnt care what my character looked like then either

Edit: Im going to add something very controversial possibly. I just looked up the character roster of Overwatch on google images for the first time. And i think i like the Concord design better, LoL

[Pre-emptively opens umbrella for incoming sh*tstorm]

@Fishmasterflex96 Fair points, i agree with all of it!

@PuppetMaster I appreciate the points given. I think @NEStalgia made a good point though. Im really not familiar with hero shooters, so i guess i really didnt compare it with any of those games. I still think the hate is disproportional though, i played the beta. Its a solid game. Again, lots of titles a lot worse have come out the past few years.

I must say though, having never played Overwatch and Apex legends, but obviously seen it around since you come across it everywhere. If character design is supposed to be so good or important in hero shooters, well colour me dumbfounded. All those free to play games including fortnite etc. have all the same cartoony unmemorable characters ever. Maybe im too old, i dunno, not gen Z over here

@NEStalgia Honestly, thats a good point! I might just really not see the big deal, cause its not a world im familiar with

@OthmaneAD I hear many people saying they wanted the Factions multiplayer that was cancelled. Also hear a lot of people telling Sony that if they wanna do multiplayer they should revive IPs like Killzone.

Look i get what ure saying. But you have to realize there are many people that would like to have multiplayer on PS. Having only single player would be very boring, atleast in my opinion.

People just didnt want Concord, and hey thats fine. Again, im not particulary a fan of it either. But i just find the amount of hate it gets so weird and disproportional. Thats all

@Fishmasterflex96 I agree. It just interests me from a sociologic standpoint where all the hate comes from. Its seems like a solid game, nothing special or anything. But it has become the most hated on game on the internet it seems. And frankly, i dont really get why. But hey, thats just me

@tameshiyaku You think the game has gotten to be one of the, if not, the most hated game on the internet because its just generic?

Nah, people forget about generic games. The hate for this game is on a whole other level

@OthmaneAD You say we. But ive also heard many people ask Sony to come up with new IPs. Also heard people asking for something else than only single player narrative games because they were getting tired of sad dad walking sims

@nessisonett What do you mean? Am i missing something? What does politics have to do with it? Is it because of the pronouns? Are you telling me thats really the biggest reason a solid game got hated on this much? Ive never seen a game hated on this much. Because of pronouns?

Im not playing stupid btw, im not from the US. I know "woke" is very big there. But if its not about the pronouns. What is so woke about the game? And if it is just about the pronouns, then wow. Harsh crowd

From someone who has never played a hero shooter before, i played the beta and i dont really understand whats so wrong with the game? Played good, was polished, graphics seemed good, satisfying gunplay. Was it really all down to character design? Because that seems highly subjective, i didnt really have any big problems with the character design really. To be honest, with these types of games, i really dont care that much about character design. I mean, its rounds of team deathmatch, who cares about the characters? I guess a lot of people, but this much... i dont know, it all seemed a bit out of proportion.

My view on it, people dogpiled on it. It got bad publicity, and people who havent played it or havent even seen it just layed it on it with negativity. Thereby creating a whole air of negativity around it. The amount of hate it got was totally disproportional. I mean remember Gollum? Now thats a bad game. This must be the most polished and solid "bad" game in history. Cause there are some real sh*tgames out there. Remember the last of us clone on switch, or the god of war clone on xbox? Those were sh*tgames

Lots of people also commenting about people hating the "wokeness" of it all. What exactly in it do they dislike? If someone would care to explain. Is it the variety of ethnicities? Or that they listed the pronouns?

Also, a point about the game costing $40. The whole purpose was that the game wouldnt have any battle passes and everything would be added for free. Isnt that what everyone wanted? Like i saw people complaining all the time about these free to play games ruining the industry. Now someone tries it this way and they get sh*t on. I guess people want free games full of paid battle passes and microtransactions then, right? Dont complain if thats going to be the future then

Ps. I dont particulary care for the game, but i do find if very weird how things transpired and this became probably the most hated on and the worst launch of any game ever. Just dont get it, its a solid game. And if it really comes down to something subjective as so called "woke character design" than that to me is very worrying

@RubyCarbuncle Would you be interested otherwise?

@TomasVrboda Playstation had new IPs this year. Rise of the Ronin, Stellar Blade, or do 3rd party games not count? In that case, Concord

Damn, that does look very nice!

@tangyzesty I dont get what ure saying. The PS5 Pro is meant to play those games better. The upgrade isnt necessary, its for people who want to play with better settings and visuals. Like all PC games can be played on a RTX2070, but you can also play it on a RTX4070. Is it necessary? No ofcourse not, itll just give u better visuals and fps. None of it is necessary, its just an extra option.
Also, you do realize there are like 4 more years of games coming out before next gen hits. Maybe its also meant for those games?

I dont think Sony forgot how to make cheap consoles. They just dont target the same market as Nintendo does. Sony wants to give you triple AAA gaming with reasonably high specs but with the ease of use of a console. Nintendo caters to a different demographic which doesnt really care for high end graphics. Thats why they created the Pro, which can give you reasonably high settings for a console price, meaning a price that u cant get on PC if you build it yourself.

Im just gonna go with what u said about the servers things, cause im not too knowledgeable on that subject. All i can say is, Valve probably makes enough money with the 30% cut, that they get to run and maintain it, thats all. If they didnt they would have to find other ways to pay for it as well.

Also, Sony makes cheap consoles as well. The PS5 digital released for $399 if im not mistaken. In contrast to the series S, since you mentioned it, which cost $299 at release. Look at the difference in price and the difference in specs and be honest. Does Playstation sell cheap consoles? Yes, just not the Pro, because its not subsidized as explained earlier

@NEStalgia These are complex topics and the replies are getting longer and longer. I appreciate it though. Heres my rebutall if you will.

You're right about Valve being a privately owned company. Sony and Xbox arent, but yeah, not gonna be able to change anything there. Sony can not go back to being a private company.

Sony started the subsidized model because creating a console that was profitable and still cheap was getting harder to do. Saying Nintendo and Sega did it means nothing. It just means it was possible at that time with those certain economic conditions, things changed after that. They started selling consoles with a loss, almost every console manufacturer did.

Also, didnt Xbox start asking people to pay for online with Xbox Live? It certainly wasnt Playstation

Regarding Valve, they have a whole other business model in that they can seemingly get enough profit from their 30% cut to run and maintain their online network. The PC market is just a far larger pool with many more paying costumers than the console arena. If they didnt get enough out of the cuts that theyre getting, they would have to ask for payment for online as well. Because again running and maintaining it isnt free, not even for Valve.

Also, im no expert, but arent servers on Steam usually run by developers themselves? Correct me if im wrong, but that would definitely take the financial strain off Valve, which could explain a lot of why they dont need to charge for online.

Also, PS plus basic is $80/year, around $7 a month. But it doesnt only include online gaming, it also gives 36 games a year, with other additional benefits like discounts on dlc and such. People think its only about online gaming

I dont know all the ins and outs but comparing it to Valve with a whole other business operation is very hard to do.

So to conclude, i dont think the 30% cut is so unreasonable. I dont think them wanting to sell the PS5 Pro with a profit margin instead of subsidizing it and selling it with a loss is so unreasonable, because its not a mass seller. That would be a wrong strategy that will lose them money. You only subsidize consoles that sell like a 100million in lifetime sales, cause then you can guarantee that you will have a large enough paying playerbase to offset the loss you made by selling a console at a loss. This is not the case for the PS5 Pro which will maybe only sell around 10-12 million

@NEStalgia Hehe i know they dont lose $300 on each console. It was more meant as a thought exercise for people to realize the price isnt that extortionate, cause you cant build that for the same price. Im not expecting they subsidize all their products if it doesnt make sense. This isnt gonna sell in large volumes so that strategy isnt gonna work well. But are you saying you find it unreasonable that they sell a product with a profit margin? Or do you just think the profit margins are too large for this console?

Regarding your comments on PSN costs and their 30% cut on games selling through their platform.

Im confused, do you find it unreasonable that they get a cut from games sold on their platform? That happens on every platform including steam.

And also, the whole paying for online. Isnt that how they maintain PSN? If PSN was maintained by extra and premium alone, whole of Playstation Network will probably need to be shutdown. I mean, running and maintaining PSN probably costs a lot of money. Everybody seems to be wanting everything for free these days.

Again im no expert in the financials, im just guessing its not cheap to maintain. I have no idea how steam does it

@ZeroSum You said u understood that production costs were increasing, because of inflation, therefore games were more expensive to make. Then u proceeded to say that studio heads increase prices to cushion their company. Afterwards u said your own employer didnt cushion u from inflation. U might not have said my exact words, but it sure seemed as if you implied what i said in my post. But i may have inferred wrong, in that case i take it back

Just out of curiousity, if you wanna tell me, if you were a business owner? If cost of production rose, would you cushion your company by increasing prices? Or cushion all your employees as you said you would have wanted your employer to do?

@ZeroSum Wait, are u saying if you were a business owner and costs of production rose. You would not increase the price of your product? But rather make sure all of your employees are cushioned against inflation?

Thats noble and all, but really doesnt make business sense. You would lose money on your products because of rising production costs and you would increase employee salaries, losing even more money. How would you break even? Or better yet, make profit to continue ur business

@RubyCarbuncle Lots of armchair CEOs around, thats why u have so many opinions, but most dont really have experience with running billion dollar companies.

Maybe people should start building their PS5 Pro equivalent PCs for $1000 and sell them for $700. See how much profit they can make, seeing as they think $700 is an extortionate amount of money for it.

@RubyCarbuncle I just find it funny that people get so upset about console prices rising. Compared to other products. Like everything has risen these last years and decades, how could inflation not be an argument?
Im not saying im happy with it.

But damn have you seen smartphone prices lately? Iphone pro max going for $1600. How about gpu cards, top Nvidia cards used to be what $1000 10 years ago, its now $1600. Houses? Seen those prices lately? I bet you guys seen your grocery prices going up?
How much do you think dev salaries cost nowadays? Im guessing that has gone up as well.

Prices of everything have gone up through the years, in some markets, like smartphones it goes up incrementally every year. But somehow in the console space nothing is supposed to go up or else everyone gets in a frenzy.
I can honestly say, that i thought console prices would have risen a while ago, we were just lucky they kept subsidizing it. Seeing how much the components cost in these consoles if you make it yourself, its a fair price.

Again, not saying im happy with the price from a consumer standpoint. But the outrage, i really dont understand, but hey thats just me

@NEStalgia Well you're right, prices are indeed lowering very slowly nowadays. But that only reinforces my thoughts that a 2026 release of the next Xbox isnt a good idea. Even if they go with Nvidia, they would probably be deep in development by now, they must have chosen their GPU already if it launches in 2 years? I mean, the RTX4090 costs like $1600. Can you imagine that thats the card thats going to be in the next Xbox? As of the now, i really cant. To be truly next gen, i would advise Xbox to wait atleast another year till 2027

@NEStalgia Also, if Xbox releases a new console in 2026, i dont think the difference in specs compared to the Pro would be all that mindblowing. Severely dampening the true next gen claims from Xbox. I mean what could they achieve by then? An equivalent of a rtx4090? If thats even possible? It would be amazing, but considering the PS5 Pro is around 4070 level, than that isnt really the big leap people would be expecting i think.

But yeah strategically speaking, it might be the better move for Xbox. Instead of taking Sony head on again with a simultaneous next gen release in 2028. Still think 2026 is too early, maybe 2027 would be better. They would still have a one year headstart. And have a much larger increase in tech available to them. Will be very interesting to see what these companies will do.

@NEStalgia Well even if the jump of architecture slows down. If the rtx5090 releases next year in 2025, it must have atleast come down in price 3 years later. For an equivalent, or maybe a bit under, to be used in the PS6. It might not tho, but one can hope hehe

@NEStalgia According to rumours Xbox is gonna come with a console in 2 years. Sony i hope, will wait till end of 2028.

They couldnt change too much for the Pro, cause they have to use the same architecture for compatibility issues.

End of 2028, AMD Zen 6 with a RTX5090 equivalent card -which will probably be around midrange by end of 2028- will be a significant step up from the Pro. Coupled with a DLSS4+ equivalent (PSSR 3.0)

I dont know man, it might be. I just cant see it happening right now, but hope to be surprised. If i had to guess it will be around $399. At its cheapest $349

Edit: But hey i was way off with the Pro, so what do i know

@simondud1 You say those are the best looking next gen games, but you forgot a couple. I'll help you out:
Demon souls, Spiderman miles morales, Spiderman 2, Resident evil village, Returnal, Ratchet and clank rift apart, Horizon forbidden west, Gran turismo 7, God of war Ragnarok, Callisto protocol, Final fantasy 16, Robocop rogue city, Resident evil 4, Alan wake 2, Avatar frontiers of pandora, Black myth: wukong

Dont worry, lots of people seem to keep forgetting there are lots of good looking games this gen. Or they just choose to not acknowledge them

@GamingFan4Lyf I just cant see the Switch 2 releasing for $299, but hey anything can happen

I'd advise Sony to release it end of 2028, let this gen have a bit more breathing room. Even if Xbox comes out in 2026, that wont be a true next gen experience, because it would come to soon. The specs available right now wouldnt make the difference that much bigger compared to the PS5 Pro(unless its very expensive).

If they're smart they should probably incorporate some sort of modularity in the console.

Maybe they could release with three tiers:

• The Standard base tier could be around RTX 5090 equivalent, but a bit underclocked, with AI and machine learning, DLSS4+ equivalent, AmD Zen 6 10 core CPU, 16GB ddr6 and 1TB gen 5 ssd for $599(assuming the 5090 has lowered in price by then, around mid range by end of 2028)
• Plus or Enthousiast tier could have the same as the Base, but with a fully clocked RTX5090, slight overclocked CPU with 12 cores instead of 10, 24GB ddr6 and 2TB instead of 1 for $699
• PS6 Pro could have the same as 2nd tier, but with a RTX 5090Ti or higher equivalent GPu, CPU with 16 cores, 32GB ddr6 and 2TB but Gen 6 ssd speeds for $799

This way they can target different price demographics.
Hehe, im just dreaming i know. But i like thinking about how Sony could strategize their moves

@BTC4FET I know, didnt mean to single you out or anything. You just happened to be the last to say it. But ive seen many saying it. So i just wanted to adress it. I know its a bit off topic, but everybody keeps mentioning it so yeah..

@NEStalgia I know, it is a red herring. I am aware you can buy prebuild.

But i keep seeing people mentioning "building a pc is so easy". So i wanted to adress it, thats why i replied to the person i replied to. He is 1 of many saying that. That argument is obviously partly meant to convince people. Im just saying its not gonna work, because not everyones interested in building their PC, doesnt matter how "easy" people make it out to be.

@BTC4FET I see a lot of people saying "Its not even hard to build your own PC". I think they're missing the point. Casual gamers just arent interested in building their own gaming machine.

Its not 'hard' to do some DIY tasks like installing flooring or painting, but a lot of people still choose to hire people to do it out of convenience and saving time.

You can build your own surround sound speaker system by chosing all the components and putting it together, but many people arent interested and find it far simpler to buy prebuild.

Telling someone its so easy to build your own PC is not gonna convince anyone who isnt interested in doing that. Its the same reason people spend money for contracters and prebuild sound systems.

It doesnt matter how easy it is. Spending 6 hours or more building a PC, including researching components and troubleshooting, especially when youre a beginner is not easier than buying a console that works out of the box.

Just wanted to give some points on why people might favor console over PC, havent read all the posts so theres probably going to be a lot of overlap.

• PS exclusives. Not all exclusives come to PC and if they do, it could be years later.
• Better suited for living room play and big screen gaming, also couch co op, not everyone wants to be tied to a desk when gaming.
• Ease of use, just plug and play. No time spent building or upgrading parts.
• Lower cost of purchase
• Longer life cycle, a console will be supported for atleast a generation of around 7 years.
• Games are usually made for console, so games will typically work well on console, because they are tailor made for them. PC however, with its userbase having a large variety of components will not always run well. Stutterfest, shader compilation, anyone?
• No need for tweaking settings, all games work the same on console. Games are often also made to make full advantage of the PS5 hardware. On PC because of teh varied components people have, a game is probably not tailored to your system.
• Physical media. Having the ability to resell your games if yoy want. I dont know, do some PC games still have physical copies? I think their all digital now, right?
• Stable OS. Because of the versatility of PC, you also have more chance of things like malware, viruses or crashes.
• Drivers, mods etc. might be easy for people who are good with tech, but for the average casual gamer isnt something they want to be bothered with.
• Some games arent compatibile or run worse with certain hardware(like some games preferring nvidia or amd gpus for some features), or require additional firmware or driver updates.
• Also, as previously alluded to by a poster. Upgrading parts to your PC sometimes means you will have to upgrade more than those parts. Like upgrading a CPu or GPU, might mean your motherboard or power supply might need upgrading too. Not to mention incompatibility or creating bottlenecks between hardware, if you dont know what you're doing.

Im definitely not against PC btw, i have gamed on PC before and might be a PC gamer again in the future. I just wanted to clarify that there are still lots of reasons for people to favor console. Yes, PC is much easier than before, but its a bit disingenuous to say its as easy as console.

Good to hear! Go Astro

Sounds promising!

As usual, a lot of people drawing immediate conclusions lol

@IOI I dont think the hype is gone at all

@Ainu20 Well its just the retail numbers of one country, not including digital apparently. But yeah, you're right about the rest

@ShogunRok It might be that more people chose to buy this digital than other titles in the past. But i can see the wider appeal argument being true

I would be very interested in a wireless PSVR2, but i'd like them to show some more support for the platform first

I'm guessing most people buy digital nowadays? Or else its not looking good for Astro Bot in Japan, which would be a shame

@Vaako007 Exactly!

@Zeke68 But when so many analysists telling us its largely due to inflation and rising component pricing. And we can see it for ourself, for example in other hardware which have prices that have gone through the roof. Consoles arent created in a bubble, they are dependent on component pricing.

And we can verify by trying to build our own PC with equivalent specs that its not possible to create that for the same price. So why do people keep insisting its because of Sony nickle and diming us?

Look im not saying we should accept everything from greedy companies, but having some business logic it makes sense to have a profit margin. Not every console, especially something niche like this can be sold at a loss or break even. Cause its not meant to sell in large volumes so that strategy isnt a very suitable approach for this

It will only run at 60fps if they designed the game from the ground up to run at 60fps, which they probably didnt. I'm guessing its a 30fps game

I dont get why people get so upset over Sony releasing better hardware. Do they also get upset by Apple releasing Pro versions of their phones? People just buy the regular phones and move on. Why get mad at someone for buying the Iphone Pro Max? And why get mad at Apple for releasing it?

@MightElf-69 You think selling the the Pro at a loss is a good strategy? Strategies like that are most suited when you expect to sell large volumes