@SJBUK Yep, that is probably why it doesn't work in VR yet. And there's an extra layer of challenge as, ideally, it would have to blend with DFR (dynamic foveated rendering) as well.
@SJBUK Yes, the potential for VR is enormous. On flat-screen games, the benefit of the Pro can be limited in cases where the CPU is the main bottleneck. But in VR, you're almost always limited by the system's GPU. The benefits will be especially noticeable when PSSR works with VR, since many games render at a resolution that is quite a bit lower than the OLED panels'.
Oh, the classic example of taking a real problem and using it as an excuse to impose draconian measures. This is so incredibly naive, unthoughtful and ill conceived, that I struggle to understand where these people have their head at.
This is a super complicated issue. And in such situations, government overreach is almost always the wrong direction.
Whoa, not so fast. One quarter alone is just a picture, but what matters at the end of the day, is the film. Even with this quarter's good results, the trend still points downwards.
Sure, the overall situation is probably not as dire as some may have led us to believe, but one good quarter is by no means a conclusive indication that the industry challenges are fully addressed.
The Pro is not just about selling more consoles. It's about having an option with the "world's most powerful console" stick on it. Even if a buyer ends up getting the standard model, the halo product strongly influences that decision by virtue of brand image alone.
It's a similar situation to PSVR2. Having a VR headset accessory ends up weighing in a person's decision to buy a PlayStation rather than an Xbox, simply because it's nice to have the option down the road. The machines are too similar this generation, so any bullet point in the box can sway people in either direction.
Microsoft only has Game Pass to show for it, and even though the value proposition is sound, it's just not sexy enough.
"we understand PSN isn’t officially available in every country"
That is a total bs excuse for the fake online rage. I live in Brazil, where there was no PSN back in the PS3 days. And that has never stopped me from creating a US (or whatever else) account and buy my digital games from there. All I needed was an international credit card, which is also something anyone can easily get.
@get2sammyb I'm afraid I disagree, Sammy. To me, Sony sound a lot like they have their heads buried in the sand. There's so much that went wrong with Concord that is not being alluded to here.
I know, I know... to a hammer, everything looks like a nail. The culture war can get tiring, but culture might as well be all that matters at the end of the day, because it permeates everything whether we like (or see) it or not.
The tidal shift is too big to ignore at this point.
@Gooseman42 Same here. PSVR2 is my first headset, but I got it at launch. I've been building rather strong VR legs, but Kayak is a little much for me to handle. Truth be told though, I've yet to manage smooth turning in any game. Whenever I enable it, I immediately feel I'm cross-eyed.
@Thumper "The difference between 90Hz and 120Hz is not as significant as 30Hz and 60Hz."
Not true if you're using v-sync. In this scenario, the framerate would be bouncing between 60 and 120 Hz, which actually looks worse than a stable 60 Hz.
Maybe you assume that every 120 Hz display supports VRR, which would solve this issue, but that is also not true. Most early 120 Hz TVs did not support VRR.
Btw, love the profile name/picture. Thumper was one of my first VR experiences, and it immediately sold me on the platform.
@NEStalgia I agree, but reread the article carefully and you'll spot the signs.
"...despite solid ratings on Metacritic..."
For a while now, the opinion of critics has been diverging from the general public, steadily but surely. The same has been happening in the film industry.
There's an ongoing cultural shift that hasn't been reflected in the gaming media at large, and inside dev studios for that matter. Don't Nod has fallen victim to that, but the most prominent example is obviously Firewalk.
The reported strike is another telltale sign of just how clueless these people are. There's this frankly astonishing entitlement by workers that studio heads somehow owe them a job. Jesus, the market speaks, and reality has this strange habit of eventually showing its ugly head.
"Oh, so insensitive!" Yeah, so is life, deal with it.
Look, I'm not saying that this is the only, or even the main reason these studios and projects are failing. There are too many games, they are frequently released in a bad state, budgets have skyrocketed, inflation is reducing people's buying power, and so on.
What bothers me is how people are pretending that culture has nothing to do with it; that there isn't a conversation to be had here. They can keep burying their head in the sand and see where they'll end up.
@Ralizah I'm sure most of us who disagree with Sony's PC push understand the reasons that lead them into this path.
The crux of the matter is whether the gains will outweigh the losses. And I assume you understand where those losses could come from.
The thing is these losses are not as tangible as the gains, because they are potential and long-term. So, it all comes down to a matter of opinion, because we can only speculate about the future at the end of the day.
What you should keep in mind is that stockholders' pressure very frequently leads companies to prioritize short-term gains even when the people in command are fully aware of future damage, except for growth stage startups.
@NEStalgia Se the reply above. It's actually quite simple. Think Elden Ring. It's like upgrading your GPU. The messaging sounds weird simply because they try to put very technical stuff in layman's terms, adding silly marketing terms.
Not sure if you watched the Digital Foundry hands-on video, but what sold me on the Pro was the footage from F1 2024. The added ray tracing features genuinely looks like a generational leap.
Sure, few games will take advantage of the new hardware to that effect, but the potential is definitely there.
@Balie3000 You are overcomplicating this. Think in PC terms. Whatever the cap (30, 60, 120 fps), if a game drops frames on the PS5, the more powerful GPU of the Pro should help them get closer to the target framerate.
The extent of it depends on how far the PS5 is from that target, and also the cause of the performance bottleneck: if the game is mainly CPU bound, the Pro will actually do very little.
Another potential gain that people don't mention as often, is resolution. Most current games employ some form of DRS (dynamic resolution scaling). And when they run on the Pro, they should get much closer to the resolution ceiling, improving image quality. And that is exclusively dependent on the GPU.
@LikelySatan Cancel culture was very much celebrated and one sided for many years. But the tables have been seemingly turning and the same people who were on the previously winning side are now quite upset.
You live long enough, and you realize that the pendulum never fails.
Remember a few years ago, when a side of the isle was celebrating cancel culture, while the other side was alerting that the shoe would eventually be on the other foot?
Lesson learned? Not quite, as the same exact thing is now happening with censorship.
@Fritz167 Oh, I agree that Sony has fallen in many senses. The whole push to appeal to "modern audiences" is a cancer that has metastasized badly throughout the whole company. And we're starting to see the results of it popping around every now and then.
But that has nothing to do with the price of the Pro. I've mentioned Apple, Nvidia and Intel/AMD to prove the point, but here's another one for you:
Microsoft is launching a $600 Xbox that has nothing new going for it except for a larger drive and a literal coat of paint. If that doesn't tell you what you need to know, you're beyond hope.
@Fritz167 Exactly right, I'm glad you're reiterating the point I made earlier. We're firmly into diminishing returns with tech. We will pay increasingly more money for increasingly smaller leaps. And that's what it is, regardless of what you think or do. Get over it.
@Fritz167 "If you buy a PS5 PRO at that price, PS6 will cost the same or more."
And if you don't, Sony will adjust (downgrade) the specs of the PS6 to make it cheaper.
Gosh, how long will it take for people to adjust their sense of reality? You've seen the price of smartphones steadily rise and cried about Apple and Samsung being greedy. You've seen the exact same happen to GPUs. You've seen CPUs stagnate in performance for years now. And so on.
So, is it all a big, coordinated scam or (maybe) the times have changed? Look, no one can defeat physics. The main source of performance and efficiency gains have come from node shrinks in chip manufacturing. That doesn't quite work anymore, because angstrons are really freaking small and expensive to get to.
I hate to be the bearer of disappointing news but, in 2024, better performance = more expensive.
@thefourfoldroot1 Yeah, Sony has been weirdly quiet about the advantages of the PS5 Pro for VR. The haters would argue that they've abandoned PSVR2, but last night's State of Play would prove otherwise.
I guess it's a matter of priorities at the end of the day. PSSR is one of the big headline features of the new console, and it seemingly doesn't work with VR yet.
But I'm sure developers are already at work trying to take advantage of the extra 45% of GPU horsepower, which aligns nicely with the bump from 60 reprojected to native 90 fps.
@NEStalgia You're trying to make a point that the old console model is dying while failing to provide clear evidence of it. In fact, your last point kind of destroys the whole argument. Nintendo is the irrefutable proof that the old model still works, and works wonderfully. I'm sure Sony and Microsoft would die to be in their shoes. Because even though Nintendo might not be the biggest player, it is definitely the most lucrative one.
This whole narrative you're describing has been pushed down everyone's throat by Microsoft simply because they are on the losing side. Their strategy is to try and pretend their issues are everybody's issues in an attempt to flip the script. I don't fall for it. If anything, I'd guess the next Switch is going to be as successful as the current one, if not more.
Now, if the internet infrastructure ever gets in place, streaming may become a thing. But that could well take another couple of decades.
@NEStalgia You're focusing on the picture when you should be looking at the film when analyzing this. And the harder part is that most of the movie is yet to be revealed.
You're also conflating many different dimensions to construct your argument, but they don't quite fit together at the end. In my opinion, of course. I do respect your view, but I'm a little short on time to deconstruct it now. So, we'll have to go with "I disagree", sorry.
I'll just reinforce the crux of the matter, then: a platform is different from a publisher because there's this symbol to rally around. I'm referring to the console, or course. If you erode this idol, the whole thing colapses. And great first-party exclusives are the necessary support. It was in 1994, and it continues to be in 2024. There's simply no substitute.
The PC strategy is such a shot in the foot. It obviously devalues the brand, even if the negative ramifications will only be felt in the future, and gradually. Moreover, it adds a lot of unnecessary complexity to the already tumultuous game development environment.
Of course I understand the reasons. Margins are getting crushed, and Sony needs to extract more money from each game. But it's a shortsighted mistake.
This "PC gamers" and "console gamers" separation is total bs. These things ebb and flow when you give them enough time.
On the bright side, there are glimmers of Sony realizing it. So I hope they get to eventually revert it. But, why would I want fewer people to enjoy PlayStation games? Because I want better games, and that would come from a healthier industry.
Entitlement really is one of the major widespread societal issues particularly on the West, a fact clearly demonstrated by this ridiculous outrage over the Pro's price tag.
1) It's totally optional. If you can't afford it, why do you care?
2) Most people complaining, do have the option to trade-in or sell their current PS5. If you paid $400+ for your current console, why is it such a big deal to shell out another $400 to cover for the difference? And if it is a big deal somehow, see point number 1.
3) The Neo Geo was introduced in 1997 for $650. Adjusted for inflation, it would cost $1,275 today. Yeah...
4) The 3DO launched in 1993 for $700. In 2024's dollars worth? $1,525. Hell yeah.
5) A GPU that would offer about the same level of performance and features of a PS5 Pro would cost, alone, around the same $700 of the Pro today.
"Ok, but it's still not worth it for me..." Well, it is for me. See point number 1 again, please.
@InfidelFrigidstraigh It's subtle, for sure, as we've been deep into diminishing returns in graphics for years now. But it's certainly noticeable. The character's hair is the telltale here. It looks heavily dithered even in the base PS5's fidelity mode, whereas it's clean and natural in the Pro shot.
Most people won't care but, for the few (millions) of us graphics enthusiasts, the current way upscaling looks on the PS5 is quite distracting and well worth the upgrade.
The PS5 will be worth it for PlayStation fans who are graphics tech enthusiasts if they can afford it. Simple as that. For everyone else, there's the base PS5. No drama.
It wouldn't make sense to release it before 2028. CPU technology has been stagnating over the last several years, which means Sony wouldn't be able to deliver a significant leap before then.
And even by 2028, the leap wouldn't be so great. If you think the Pro is expensive, adjust your expectations for the PS6 pricewise.
My work PC can play games, but I had never even installed Steam. Then I purchased the PSVR2 PC adapter out of sheer curiosity and man oh man... I'm definitely buying the PS5 Pro.
And BTW, I'm an app developer. I can troubleshoot anything on my PC but, when it's time to relax, the last thing I want is to fiddle with it.
People seem to miss the point of Pro consoles just like they do with VR headsets.
The PS5 Pro is a halo product. It's not meant to sell in volumes, but to provide a higher reference point in terms of brand image and recognition.
Having the world's most powerful (and expensive) console gives Sony a clear edge, even if the vast majority of people end up buying the standard model.
Additionally, the few enthusiasts who bite the bullet are usually the most vocal users, which helps amplifying positive buzz around the product line. Not to mention the Digital Foundry videos that will inevitably crown the PS5 Pro versions of games the "best" among consoles, further solidifying that superiority notion.
Circling back to VR, PSVR2 is a value add. When choosing which console to buy, many people will opt for PlayStation simply because it offers the option of jumping into VR in the future, regardless of they ever doing it.
It's funny to see the reaction of people who got used to live in a world without inflation. I'm from Brazil, so I've seen my fair share of that.
Look, electronics have been raising in prices above inflation for many years now, and the lockdowns have just made it much worse. It's a complex supply chain issue with many dimensions, and there's no escaping from it.
The outrage here is the same we saw with many price announcements in the recent past: the iPhone X, the 2080ti, the 3090, 4090 and so on. But people eventually adjust their expectations and bite the bullet.
@naruball I actually agree with you on this one, wholeheartedly.
It just so happens that it's outrageous to say anything in 2024 that may hurt some people's feelings, even if it may be exactly what they need to hear.
Comments 545
Re: Dead Rising Remaster Adds PS5 Pro Support, Casual Mode
@SJBUK Yep, that is probably why it doesn't work in VR yet. And there's an extra layer of challenge as, ideally, it would have to blend with DFR (dynamic foveated rendering) as well.
Re: No Xbox Games Are Off the Table for Release on PS5, Says Phil Spencer
The three stages of coping with trauma:
1) "Just these four".
2) "And Indiana Jones".
3) "No red lines".
Re: Dead Rising Remaster Adds PS5 Pro Support, Casual Mode
@SJBUK Yes, the potential for VR is enormous. On flat-screen games, the benefit of the Pro can be limited in cases where the CPU is the main bottleneck. But in VR, you're almost always limited by the system's GPU. The benefits will be especially noticeable when PSSR works with VR, since many games render at a resolution that is quite a bit lower than the OLED panels'.
Re: Indiana Jones Looks Like an Adventure Worth Waiting for on PS5
@Oram77 I think it's the first-person camera perspective. It's totally unnatural for this kind of game.
Re: Australia's Planned Social Media Ban to Include PSN
Oh, the classic example of taking a real problem and using it as an excuse to impose draconian measures. This is so incredibly naive, unthoughtful and ill conceived, that I struggle to understand where these people have their head at.
This is a super complicated issue. And in such situations, government overreach is almost always the wrong direction.
Re: PlayStation Has Swiftly Solved Its Profitability Problem
Whoa, not so fast. One quarter alone is just a picture, but what matters at the end of the day, is the film. Even with this quarter's good results, the trend still points downwards.
Sure, the overall situation is probably not as dire as some may have led us to believe, but one good quarter is by no means a conclusive indication that the industry challenges are fully addressed.
Re: PS5 Pro Pre-Orders Are Stronger Than PS4 Pro, But Scalpers Are Losing Money
The Pro is not just about selling more consoles. It's about having an option with the "world's most powerful console" stick on it. Even if a buyer ends up getting the standard model, the halo product strongly influences that decision by virtue of brand image alone.
It's a similar situation to PSVR2. Having a VR headset accessory ends up weighing in a person's decision to buy a PlayStation rather than an Xbox, simply because it's nice to have the option down the road. The machines are too similar this generation, so any bullet point in the box can sway people in either direction.
Microsoft only has Game Pass to show for it, and even though the value proposition is sound, it's just not sexy enough.
Re: Sony Boss Says It's 'Learned a Lot' from PC Player Pushback
"we understand PSN isn’t officially available in every country"
That is a total bs excuse for the fake online rage. I live in Brazil, where there was no PSN back in the PS3 days. And that has never stopped me from creating a US (or whatever else) account and buy my digital games from there. All I needed was an international credit card, which is also something anyone can easily get.
Re: Sony Comments on Concord Disaster, Says Game Should Have Been Tested Earlier
@get2sammyb I'm afraid I disagree, Sammy. To me, Sony sound a lot like they have their heads buried in the sand. There's so much that went wrong with Concord that is not being alluded to here.
I know, I know... to a hammer, everything looks like a nail. The culture war can get tiring, but culture might as well be all that matters at the end of the day, because it permeates everything whether we like (or see) it or not.
The tidal shift is too big to ignore at this point.
Re: Don't Forget PS5 Pro Also Makes Big Improvements to PSVR2
@Gooseman42 Same here. PSVR2 is my first headset, but I got it at launch. I've been building rather strong VR legs, but Kayak is a little much for me to handle. Truth be told though, I've yet to manage smooth turning in any game. Whenever I enable it, I immediately feel I'm cross-eyed.
Re: Gran Turismo 7 Clocks Native 4K, 120fps on PS5 Pro Via Game Boost, Pre-Enhanced Patch
@Thumper "The difference between 90Hz and 120Hz is not as significant as 30Hz and 60Hz."
Not true if you're using v-sync. In this scenario, the framerate would be bouncing between 60 and 120 Hz, which actually looks worse than a stable 60 Hz.
Maybe you assume that every 120 Hz display supports VRR, which would solve this issue, but that is also not true. Most early 120 Hz TVs did not support VRR.
Btw, love the profile name/picture. Thumper was one of my first VR experiences, and it immediately sold me on the platform.
Re: Gran Turismo 7 Clocks Native 4K, 120fps on PS5 Pro Via Game Boost, Pre-Enhanced Patch
@TrickyDicky99 "GT7 has earned the nickname GT Sport Directors Cut".
Well, I'm glad I skipped Sport for the better version, then. Feel sorry for you, though.
Re: Metacritic Responds to Ongoing Dragon Age: The Veilguard Review Bombing Campaign
Removed
Re: Netflix's Recent AAA Studio Closure Part of Planned AI Pivot
I know, "it's exponential, it will quickly get much better", but every AI generated art that I see looks eerily soulless.
Re: Metacritic Responds to Ongoing Dragon Age: The Veilguard Review Bombing Campaign
Removed
Re: Metro Awakening (PSVR2) - One of the Most Immersive VR Games Ever
I rarely get games at launch, but I'm willing to make an exception for this one. Thanks for the review.
Re: Metro Awakening Will Be a Reason to Own PSVR2 This Holiday
Yeah, Metro and Alien are definitely two of the highlights, but I would add Behemoth and Wanderer.
Re: Mini Review: Vendetta Forever (PSVR2) - Exhilarating Puzzle Shooter Is Next VR Must Play
This was my personal highlight of that VR Showcase. I'm glad the gameplay lives up to the visual style.
Re: PS5 Pro Adds Ray Tracing to Alan Wake 2 in Big Tech Improvement
@StylesT Might as well just wait for the PS7.
Re: Don't Nod Financials Result in Reorganisation and Layoffs, Cancelled Projects
@NEStalgia I agree, but reread the article carefully and you'll spot the signs.
"...despite solid ratings on Metacritic..."
For a while now, the opinion of critics has been diverging from the general public, steadily but surely. The same has been happening in the film industry.
There's an ongoing cultural shift that hasn't been reflected in the gaming media at large, and inside dev studios for that matter. Don't Nod has fallen victim to that, but the most prominent example is obviously Firewalk.
The reported strike is another telltale sign of just how clueless these people are. There's this frankly astonishing entitlement by workers that studio heads somehow owe them a job. Jesus, the market speaks, and reality has this strange habit of eventually showing its ugly head.
"Oh, so insensitive!" Yeah, so is life, deal with it.
Look, I'm not saying that this is the only, or even the main reason these studios and projects are failing. There are too many games, they are frequently released in a bad state, budgets have skyrocketed, inflation is reducing people's buying power, and so on.
What bothers me is how people are pretending that culture has nothing to do with it; that there isn't a conversation to be had here. They can keep burying their head in the sand and see where they'll end up.
Re: Until Dawn Is One of Sony's Worst Performing PC Ports to Date
@Ralizah I'm sure most of us who disagree with Sony's PC push understand the reasons that lead them into this path.
The crux of the matter is whether the gains will outweigh the losses. And I assume you understand where those losses could come from.
The thing is these losses are not as tangible as the gains, because they are potential and long-term. So, it all comes down to a matter of opinion, because we can only speculate about the future at the end of the day.
What you should keep in mind is that stockholders' pressure very frequently leads companies to prioritize short-term gains even when the people in command are fully aware of future damage, except for growth stage startups.
Re: Until Dawn Is One of Sony's Worst Performing PC Ports to Date
@naruball Oh God... yet again, I must say I agree 100%.
Re: Tencent, Guillemot Family Reportedly Considering Ubisoft Buyout
Interesting... That could actually be the reason for the seemingly inexplicable delay of AC Shadows.
Ubisoft is understandably very nervous about this game's launch, and another flop should send the stock prices into a death spiral.
Can't say I'm happy about the Chinese tentacles reaching further into the gaming industry, but Ubisoft really had it coming.
Re: PS5 Pro Will Reportedly Boost PS4 Games, and Reduce PSVR2 Motion Sickness
@NEStalgia Se the reply above. It's actually quite simple. Think Elden Ring. It's like upgrading your GPU. The messaging sounds weird simply because they try to put very technical stuff in layman's terms, adding silly marketing terms.
Not sure if you watched the Digital Foundry hands-on video, but what sold me on the Pro was the footage from F1 2024. The added ray tracing features genuinely looks like a generational leap.
Sure, few games will take advantage of the new hardware to that effect, but the potential is definitely there.
Re: PS5 Pro Will Reportedly Boost PS4 Games, and Reduce PSVR2 Motion Sickness
@Balie3000 You are overcomplicating this. Think in PC terms. Whatever the cap (30, 60, 120 fps), if a game drops frames on the PS5, the more powerful GPU of the Pro should help them get closer to the target framerate.
The extent of it depends on how far the PS5 is from that target, and also the cause of the performance bottleneck: if the game is mainly CPU bound, the Pro will actually do very little.
Another potential gain that people don't mention as often, is resolution. Most current games employ some form of DRS (dynamic resolution scaling). And when they run on the Pro, they should get much closer to the resolution ceiling, improving image quality. And that is exclusively dependent on the GPU.
Re: Microsoft Is Investigating Why Devs Are Prioritising PS5 Over Xbox
Jesus, I had no idea they were this clueless.
Re: Gran Turismo 7 PS5, PS4 Update 1.52 Adds Two Sports Cars and a Very Boxy Van
Sophy is slowly taking over, very cool.
One of the best use cases for ML AI, along with resolution upscaling, of course.
Re: Assassin's Creed Shadows Hasn't Removed Yasuke, But Dev Focused on Historical Accuracy
@LikelySatan Cancel culture was very much celebrated and one sided for many years. But the tables have been seemingly turning and the same people who were on the previously winning side are now quite upset.
You live long enough, and you realize that the pendulum never fails.
Re: Assassin's Creed Shadows Hasn't Removed Yasuke, But Dev Focused on Historical Accuracy
Remember a few years ago, when a side of the isle was celebrating cancel culture, while the other side was alerting that the shoe would eventually be on the other foot?
Lesson learned? Not quite, as the same exact thing is now happening with censorship.
Re: 'PS5 Pro Is a Really Good Investment,' Argue Tech Experts After Hands-On
@Fritz167 Since I don't have a good counter argument about the topic at hand, I'll revert to personal attacks.
Re: 'PS5 Pro Is a Really Good Investment,' Argue Tech Experts After Hands-On
@Fritz167 Oh, I agree that Sony has fallen in many senses. The whole push to appeal to "modern audiences" is a cancer that has metastasized badly throughout the whole company. And we're starting to see the results of it popping around every now and then.
But that has nothing to do with the price of the Pro. I've mentioned Apple, Nvidia and Intel/AMD to prove the point, but here's another one for you:
Microsoft is launching a $600 Xbox that has nothing new going for it except for a larger drive and a literal coat of paint. If that doesn't tell you what you need to know, you're beyond hope.
Re: 'PS5 Pro Is a Really Good Investment,' Argue Tech Experts After Hands-On
@Fritz167 Exactly right, I'm glad you're reiterating the point I made earlier. We're firmly into diminishing returns with tech. We will pay increasingly more money for increasingly smaller leaps. And that's what it is, regardless of what you think or do. Get over it.
Re: 'PS5 Pro Is a Really Good Investment,' Argue Tech Experts After Hands-On
@Fritz167 "If you buy a PS5 PRO at that price, PS6 will cost the same or more."
And if you don't, Sony will adjust (downgrade) the specs of the PS6 to make it cheaper.
Gosh, how long will it take for people to adjust their sense of reality? You've seen the price of smartphones steadily rise and cried about Apple and Samsung being greedy. You've seen the exact same happen to GPUs. You've seen CPUs stagnate in performance for years now. And so on.
So, is it all a big, coordinated scam or (maybe) the times have changed? Look, no one can defeat physics. The main source of performance and efficiency gains have come from node shrinks in chip manufacturing. That doesn't quite work anymore, because angstrons are really freaking small and expensive to get to.
I hate to be the bearer of disappointing news but, in 2024, better performance = more expensive.
Re: 'PS5 Pro Is a Really Good Investment,' Argue Tech Experts After Hands-On
@thefourfoldroot1 Yeah, Sony has been weirdly quiet about the advantages of the PS5 Pro for VR. The haters would argue that they've abandoned PSVR2, but last night's State of Play would prove otherwise.
I guess it's a matter of priorities at the end of the day. PSSR is one of the big headline features of the new console, and it seemingly doesn't work with VR yet.
But I'm sure developers are already at work trying to take advantage of the extra 45% of GPU horsepower, which aligns nicely with the bump from 60 reprojected to native 90 fps.
Re: 'PS5 Pro Is a Really Good Investment,' Argue Tech Experts After Hands-On
@carlos82 You conveniently missed the "hassle-free gaming experience" part in your quote.
Re: 'PS5 Pro Is a Really Good Investment,' Argue Tech Experts After Hands-On
@milonorth Sorry to be the one breaking it to you, but that is not how technology works anymore.
Re: The Novelty of PlayStation's PC Ports Does Appear to Be Dampening
@NEStalgia You're trying to make a point that the old console model is dying while failing to provide clear evidence of it. In fact, your last point kind of destroys the whole argument. Nintendo is the irrefutable proof that the old model still works, and works wonderfully. I'm sure Sony and Microsoft would die to be in their shoes. Because even though Nintendo might not be the biggest player, it is definitely the most lucrative one.
This whole narrative you're describing has been pushed down everyone's throat by Microsoft simply because they are on the losing side. Their strategy is to try and pretend their issues are everybody's issues in an attempt to flip the script. I don't fall for it. If anything, I'd guess the next Switch is going to be as successful as the current one, if not more.
Now, if the internet infrastructure ever gets in place, streaming may become a thing. But that could well take another couple of decades.
Re: The Novelty of PlayStation's PC Ports Does Appear to Be Dampening
@NEStalgia You're focusing on the picture when you should be looking at the film when analyzing this. And the harder part is that most of the movie is yet to be revealed.
You're also conflating many different dimensions to construct your argument, but they don't quite fit together at the end. In my opinion, of course. I do respect your view, but I'm a little short on time to deconstruct it now. So, we'll have to go with "I disagree", sorry.
I'll just reinforce the crux of the matter, then: a platform is different from a publisher because there's this symbol to rally around. I'm referring to the console, or course. If you erode this idol, the whole thing colapses. And great first-party exclusives are the necessary support. It was in 1994, and it continues to be in 2024. There's simply no substitute.
Re: The Novelty of PlayStation's PC Ports Does Appear to Be Dampening
@naruball Now I'm starting to get worried... 😏
Re: The Novelty of PlayStation's PC Ports Does Appear to Be Dampening
The PC strategy is such a shot in the foot. It obviously devalues the brand, even if the negative ramifications will only be felt in the future, and gradually. Moreover, it adds a lot of unnecessary complexity to the already tumultuous game development environment.
Of course I understand the reasons. Margins are getting crushed, and Sony needs to extract more money from each game. But it's a shortsighted mistake.
This "PC gamers" and "console gamers" separation is total bs. These things ebb and flow when you give them enough time.
On the bright side, there are glimmers of Sony realizing it. So I hope they get to eventually revert it. But, why would I want fewer people to enjoy PlayStation games? Because I want better games, and that would come from a healthier industry.
Re: Vince Zampella Defends PS5 Pro Price, Says 'It's Actually Not That Bad'
Entitlement really is one of the major widespread societal issues particularly on the West, a fact clearly demonstrated by this ridiculous outrage over the Pro's price tag.
1) It's totally optional. If you can't afford it, why do you care?
2) Most people complaining, do have the option to trade-in or sell their current PS5. If you paid $400+ for your current console, why is it such a big deal to shell out another $400 to cover for the difference? And if it is a big deal somehow, see point number 1.
3) The Neo Geo was introduced in 1997 for $650. Adjusted for inflation, it would cost $1,275 today. Yeah...
4) The 3DO launched in 1993 for $700. In 2024's dollars worth? $1,525. Hell yeah.
5) A GPU that would offer about the same level of performance and features of a PS5 Pro would cost, alone, around the same $700 of the Pro today.
"Ok, but it's still not worth it for me..." Well, it is for me. See point number 1 again, please.
Re: Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth's Huge PS5 Pro Enhancements Are a 'Vast Improvement'
@InfidelFrigidstraigh It's subtle, for sure, as we've been deep into diminishing returns in graphics for years now. But it's certainly noticeable. The character's hair is the telltale here. It looks heavily dithered even in the base PS5's fidelity mode, whereas it's clean and natural in the Pro shot.
Most people won't care but, for the few (millions) of us graphics enthusiasts, the current way upscaling looks on the PS5 is quite distracting and well worth the upgrade.
Re: PS5 Pro Shows Real Promise in First Expert Analysis
The PS5 will be worth it for PlayStation fans who are graphics tech enthusiasts if they can afford it. Simple as that. For everyone else, there's the base PS5. No drama.
Re: PS6 Is Already Deep in Development, Backwards Compatibility of High Importance
It wouldn't make sense to release it before 2028. CPU technology has been stagnating over the last several years, which means Sony wouldn't be able to deliver a significant leap before then.
And even by 2028, the leap wouldn't be so great. If you think the Pro is expensive, adjust your expectations for the PS6 pricewise.
Re: Sony Boss Says 'PCs Are Difficult to Set Up', Firm Will Focus on PS5
My work PC can play games, but I had never even installed Steam. Then I purchased the PSVR2 PC adapter out of sheer curiosity and man oh man... I'm definitely buying the PS5 Pro.
And BTW, I'm an app developer. I can troubleshoot anything on my PC but, when it's time to relax, the last thing I want is to fiddle with it.
Re: Annapurna Interactive Exodus Sees Entire Staff Resign
@somnambulance "Lock everything down, we'll deal with the economy later."
It's later, now.
Re: Talking Point: Is PS5 Pro Way Too Expensive?
@PerpetualBoredom When the Berlin wall fell, who ran to which side?
Re: PS5 Pro Reveal Is Already Sony's Most Disliked Console Announcement
People seem to miss the point of Pro consoles just like they do with VR headsets.
The PS5 Pro is a halo product. It's not meant to sell in volumes, but to provide a higher reference point in terms of brand image and recognition.
Having the world's most powerful (and expensive) console gives Sony a clear edge, even if the vast majority of people end up buying the standard model.
Additionally, the few enthusiasts who bite the bullet are usually the most vocal users, which helps amplifying positive buzz around the product line. Not to mention the Digital Foundry videos that will inevitably crown the PS5 Pro versions of games the "best" among consoles, further solidifying that superiority notion.
Circling back to VR, PSVR2 is a value add. When choosing which console to buy, many people will opt for PlayStation simply because it offers the option of jumping into VR in the future, regardless of they ever doing it.
Re: Talking Point: Is PS5 Pro Way Too Expensive?
It's funny to see the reaction of people who got used to live in a world without inflation. I'm from Brazil, so I've seen my fair share of that.
Look, electronics have been raising in prices above inflation for many years now, and the lockdowns have just made it much worse. It's a complex supply chain issue with many dimensions, and there's no escaping from it.
The outrage here is the same we saw with many price announcements in the recent past: the iPhone X, the 2080ti, the 3090, 4090 and so on. But people eventually adjust their expectations and bite the bullet.
Re: Ex-PlayStation Boss Reckons Axed Game Devs Should Just 'Drive an Uber'
@naruball I actually agree with you on this one, wholeheartedly.
It just so happens that it's outrageous to say anything in 2024 that may hurt some people's feelings, even if it may be exactly what they need to hear.